Bolt removal

[Trainer]

Going to change my exhaust manifold. It has been on there since 1988 so I expect the bolts may not be in good shape. My plan it to take a side grinder and grind off one side of the nut or get a nut splitter and split the nuts. I will do this to keep from twisting off a manifold bolt.

Does anyone have a suggestion for removing an exhaust manifold and not twist off the bolts. Is there something good to spray on them?

Also if the bolts need to be replaced, any suggestions to remove them. In the past I have sprayed with some type of liqid wrench, tap on the end of the bolt with a hammer, and hope for the best. Any other suggestions.

I hate to drill and ezy out a a broken bolt.

 

[patrick_g]

Well, you might have to hate part of the job as even after trying a number of GOOD ways to take it down some of the STUDS may break off. One good approach is to spay them liberally with Liquid Wrench and or similar penetrating loosening agents. I have even gone so far as to use tape and modeling clay to form a dam so I could soak manifold studs in the loosening liquids. The soaking is better done after the differential heating as the expansion and contraction can help break down the rust layer and make a way for the penetrant to get in. In describing various approaches you will see the term "sometimes" getting frequent play because sometimes one thing works and sometimes another. Sometimes (see!) heat can help. Actually I think it is differential heat that works the best. Just heating everything evenly doesn't do as well as heating the surrounding metal while keeping the rest cool. This tends to break the rust connecting the two pieces together. I'm not so sure I would be trying to remove the nuts from the studs or try to loosen them at all as they can make convenient handles for turning the studs out of their holes. Sure, some may come right off but any help is welcome. With luck, you won't have to drill out all the studs. If you think you feel a stud starting to yield (first stage of brreaking) stop straining it before it breaks. You can then cut it off neatly and be able to drill it in the center and not drill out the threads it is screwed into. If you have to drill one, start small and patiently and drill a nice deep small diameter hole and work youir way upo through drill sizes till you get a hole as large as possible without ruining the threads before you try the EZ-out. If you do ruin the threads you may be able to drill the hole out oversize and insert a "HELICOIL" to remake the threads. You will have to check the manifold to see if there is enough "MEAT" around the hole in question to allow drilling it out enough to take a larger stud which may be required. Good luck. It is not a fun task but with care it might go a bit easier. Patrick

 

[Mike_Lipke]

Kroil oil is to Liquid Wrench as acetylene is to propane.
Only avail on the net, but it is great.

 

[Charolais]

Most of the time I've found that if you tighten the nut just enough to hear a squeak they will then back off. That seems to break the rust. I use deep creep(sea foam) before trying this. My old friend that was an auto mechanic for 35 years told me that's how he did it. And I'll have to say it works pretty good. My son just removed them from a 1980-305 and didn't break a one. He could have been lucky too. LOL

 

[OKnewguy]

Maybe with a little luck some of the vintage tractor guys will see your thread, or you might ask over there. They have to be the masters at this, btw some guys use something like pb blaster or something that sounds like that.
Dave

 

[texasjohn]

YEP, I learned about PB Blaster on TBN.
It's at auto parts stores.
It's great for getting into rusted stuff.... WD 40 won't touch things that PB BLASTER makes easy... relatively. I recommend it.

 

[MF1455v]

Like Mike Lipke said, Aero Kroil will remove it easily. Just spray on and let set for a short time. I used it to remove manifold bolts from my 57 Allis Chalmers in about 1 hr with no effort. This stuff will even work on removing gauled stainless from stainless. Not sure what part of Texas your in but I have a new can in my garage.

James

 

[DieselPower]

I agree both Kroil and PB Blaster are both great penetrating oils. Here's a little tip to stick in your tool box though. Go to the grocery store (or steal it from your wife) and get a bar of caning wax. Heat the bolt thread area of the bolt you suspect will break off or that is already broken off with a propane torch. You don't need to get it glowing hot, just hot enough to melt the wax. Then take your stick of wax and touch it to the bolt or stud. You will be amazed how quickly the wax is drawn across the rusty bolt and into the threads. The wax when melted is super thin and the rust act's like a sponge and absorbs the molten wax. I had a old timer teach me this trick when I worked at a Internatinal truck dealer years ago. Probably the best trick I ever learned. I probably have more caning wax in my tool box's then most people that jar food.

 

[RayH]

X4 on the PB Blaster. Good stuff. I havent tried the Kroil or wax though. Ive got a couple projects coming up that may need some help. I think I'll give them a try. Where can I get the Kroil?

 

[MF1455v]

Do a search on Yahoo or Google. You will find a lot of places to buy online. Also I think Granger carries it.

Work is kind enough to donate to my cause.

James

 

[sandman2234]

PB Blaster is awsome...
I would give every bolt a shot, and as much time as you can, then hit them with a torch to heat up one side or the other (as mentioned, differential heat is what works), then allow it to cool, put a box end or six point socket on it, and apply a little pressure to see if it will break loose.
Light continous tapping on the bolt while under a little wrench pressure will also help...
David from jax

 

[SPYDERLK]

X4 on the PB Blaster. Good stuff. I havent tried the Kroil or wax though. Ive got a couple projects coming up that may need some help. I think I'll give them a try. Where can I get the Kroil?

Kroil is good, but Ive got to try the PB Blaster and the wax idea. The Aero-Kroil cans have the worst valve I have ever encountered and this outrages me to such an extent that I would switch products immediately were I to find one equally effective.

I dont know why the studs would need to be replaced if he grinds or splits the nuts. Use an anti-sieze compound on the new nut and you will be able to get it off next time. Be sure you apply it to the threads only. If on the nut seat too it may loosen on its own.
Larry

 

[BB_TX]

I just did the same thing on my 1984 model tractor last year. I used a Dremel tool with with the thin flat cutting disk to cut the nuts. After getting the manifold off, I sprayed each stud with PB Blaster. Let it sit for a while. Then I heated the first stud. Put a pair of vice grips on it and tried to turn it. Would not budge. Did not want to break it off. So I began to gently wiggle the vice grips back and forth from loosening to tightening. After only a few gyrations, I felt the stud give a little. After a few more it loosened up and came right out. The next one I tried without heating. Same routine, same result, and just as fast as the one I heated. Took all the others out in the same manner without heating.
Just to give an indication of how bad mine were, I might add that the nuts were so rusted you could barely tell there were any flats on them, the ends of the studs were much smaller than the part inside the nut, and the nuts and studs looked as if they had melted and run together.

 

[Soundguy]

Pb blaster.. heat then cool.. perhaps heat then quench with pd.

Would be nice if they were brass nuts. Might also want to put never sieze on them after reinstall.. etc.

Soundguy

 

[patrick_g]

Just piling on... WD-40 which some folks use for everything (including spraying on their catfish bait... which really works by the way!) was designed to displace water... WD (Water Displacer) and although we have found several uses for it above and beyond the original military contract specifications it is a relatively poor penetrating oil. Sure it works way better than not using anything but it can't hold a candle to any of several products that are especially designed and marketed for freeing stuck parts. The "Blaster" is a good one as is "Liquid Wrench" and others. WD-40 is a poor substitute for the REAL THINGS. --------------------Pat

 

[sandman2234]

Funny how different parts of the country see things differently.
I was under the impression that the WD-40 name came from a request during WWII for a light weight lubricant to handle certain jobs as a penetrating oil. There were 39 previous entries tested before this one, and the war department labeled each entry as 1, 2, 3, etc. Consequently, the entry that was accepted was # 40, hench the name WD-40.
The actual makeup for the product seemed to have changed several years ago, (probably to exclude some EPA chemical restriction) and now has some qualities about it that I don't care for. However, as a lubricant for my cutting tools while milling or cutting aluminum, it excells, therefore I use a lot of it.
David from jax

 

[DieselPower]

From the WD-40 website.

"In 1953, a fledgling company called Rocket Chemical Company and its staff of three set out to create a line of rust-prevention solvents and degreasers for use in the aerospace industry, in a small lab in San Diego, California."

"It took them 40 attempts to get the water displacing formula worked out. But they must have been really good, because the original secret formula for WD-40—which stands for Water Displacement perfected on the 40th try—is still in use today."

Welcome to WD-40 * About Us: Our History

 

[sandman2234]

Guess that pretty much ends my tale of the War Department number 40, unless they were doing it for the war dept, which isn't mentioned. Many a small group has tried for a military contract, in hopes of striking it rich.
David from jax

 

[masscity]

I've never seen Kroil in a spray can, but my brother gave me the Kroil can with the plastic squirt nozzle. About a dozen years ago I bought a alluminum can with a spray nozzle. You can put any liquid in it and you power it by pumping it up with air pressure. I bought it from Harbor Freight or Northern Tool for about $10.

 

[SPYDERLK]

I've never seen Kroil in a spray can, but my brother gave me the Kroil can with the plastic squirt nozzle. About a dozen years ago I bought a alluminum can with a spray nozzle. You can put any liquid in it and you power it by pumping it up with air pressure. I bought it from Harbor Freight or Northern Tool for about $10.

The good thing about Kroil in a spray can is that it doesnt go rancid because theres no oxygen. The bad thing is the crummy valves they use that leak as you spray, wasting half the fluid. The stuff costs 7-$8 a can and the wasteful delivery is outrageous. Im going to try the PB Blaster.
Larry