Buddy clinically dead

[High Compression]

Today I was informed that a buddy of mine was involved in an accident. His employer asked him to pull a Case 580 backhoe with a 1 ton truck. After protest, he reluctantly had to give in because of how hard it is to get a good job these days, and he has a baby boy to think of. Shame on him for giving in and shame on his employer for telling he to do it. My buddy is an experienced CDL driver and knew better.

He lost control of the over sized load on the highway. Thank God no one else was injured or killed. Unlike another story I have shared on this forum in the same situation. He was in the mangled truck with his head pinned against his chest. When fire/rescue cut him free, he seized and his heart stopped. He was clinically dead.

Fortunately he was revived in the air to the hospital. When he awoke from his coma, he was blind for three weeks. He has since recovered 90%.

Point is... I have said it before, but I'll say it again.
DON'T PULL MORE THAN 10,000 LBS WITH A 1 TON. EVER!!! Not once, cuz, "well it's just once and the truck will pull it". Not occasionally. I don't care what the tag in the door says. When you pull a machine that weighs more than the truck, it better be a class 7+ truck with air brakes on the truck and trailer.

You can find other threads of people being killed by this same mistake. I have been pulling equipment for over 17 years. I started with F-Superdutys in the early 90's. I quickly learned the right and wrong way to tow equipment.

Please, put your agenda and your pride in check. It is no big deal to get a CDL. A "big" truck is actually cheaper to maintain and operate than a pick-up. Rent, hire, beg, borrow, steal, a truck to pull your 580 etc. Please don't take my wife, family, friends with you in your mistake.

 

[creekbend]

Sincerely sorry from the bottom of my heart.

 

[davygp38]

I assume you are talking about a 1 ton srw pick up truck? I haul bumper pull camper trailers that weigh over 10000# with my 3500 dually. I also pull a dual tandem goose neck that ranges between 10000# and 22000#. I have no issues, with the truck, or trailer. Hope you're friend gets better, but I will continue to do what the law allows. I also have a class A cdl.

 

[aczlan]

Sorry to hear about your friend, do you have a link to a news story and/or the accident report?

Thanks

Aaron Z

 

[High Compression]

Sorry to hear about your friend, do you have a link to a news story and/or the accident report?

Thanks

Aaron Z

Here you go. I-380 accident sends man to the hospital, causes traffic delays | Eastern Iowa News Now

 

[High Compression]

I assume you are talking about a 1 ton srw pick up truck? I haul bumper pull camper trailers that weigh over 10000# with my 3500 dually. I also pull a dual tandem goose neck that ranges between 10000# and 22000#. I have no issues, with the truck, or trailer. Hope you're friend gets better, but I will continue to do what the law allows. I also have a class A cdl.

DRW F-350. I too have pulled like that in the past. I don't care if it is legal. Plain and simple it's stupid. The point is, in an emergency situation, (evasive driving, tire blow-out, emergency braking, etc) when the machine and trailer weighs 22,000 lbs and the truck weights 8,800 lbs., you don't have enough mass to control your load in those circumstances. Go ahead and bury your head in the sand. Say it won't happen to you. I just hope that you can live with yourself when you make it, but the family in the minivan that you hit did not.

 

[Bird]

Here you go. I-380 accident sends man to the hospital, causes traffic delays | Eastern Iowa News Now

That news story says the trailer fishtailed. Fishtailing is not caused by not having a big enough truck. Of course having a bigger, heavier truck might have controlled the fishtailing, but proper loading would properly have prevented it to start with.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Point is... I have said it before, but I'll say it again.
DON'T PULL MORE THAN 10,000 LBS WITH A 1 TON. EVER!!! Not once, cuz, "well it's just once and the truck will pull it". Not occasionally. I don't care what the tag in the door says. When you pull a machine that weighs more than the truck, it better be a class 7+ truck with air brakes on the truck and trailer.

I am so sorry to hear about your buddy. Hope him and his family make it though this tough time ok.

With that said, saying not to pull over 10K with a F-350 is absurd. Things happen. Yes, he was overweight and he knew better. But to say a F-350 oar any other 1 ton diesel for that matter can not handle 10K is crazy. I am sure there is much more to this story. It was a accident and it was also one that could be prevented but thats it. Saying a F-350 should not be pulling a 10K trailer means every 5th wheel should be parked. Every GN should be parked. Every boat I have sold or delt with for the last dozen years should be parked. :confused2:

The Case 580's I have been around are all about 14K. With the right trailer and a properly equipped newer F-350 rated at about 18K towing its perfectly fine and safe to tow it with.

Just my $.02. We all have our opinions and I respect yours for you but for me and my circle we tow right upto the limit SET BY THE MANUFACTURE.

Chris

 

[High Compression]

That news story says the trailer fishtailed. Fishtailing is not caused by not having a big enough truck. Of course having a bigger, heavier truck might have controlled the fishtailing, but proper loading would properly have prevented it to start with.

This is true. If you look close in the pictures, it is a tandem dual 20k gooseneck trailer. It would be difficult to position a backhoe on that trailer so that it didn't have enough tongue weight. He did do a good job chaining it on the trailer though. It sure didn't go anywhere.

 

[Diamondpilot]

DRW F-350. I too have pulled like that in the past. I don't care if it is legal. Plain and simple it's stupid. The point is, in an emergency situation, (evasive driving, tire blow-out, emergency braking, etc) when the machine and trailer weighs 22,000 lbs and the truck weights 8,800 lbs., you don't have enough mass to control your load in those circumstances. Go ahead and bury your head in the sand. Say it won't happen to you. I just hope that you can live with yourself when you make it, but the family in the minivan that you hit did not.

Again, I respect your opinion for YOU but what you say makes no sense.

Lets take your example. The truck weighs 8,800# and the trailer 22,000#. This means the trailer is 2.5 times the weight of the truck.

The average semi rolling down the road is about 80,000#. The tractor is only 15,000# so using your math anything over 37,500# is STUPID. These guys would starve only pulling 1/3 of the available GCWR

I will leave it at that. It was a accident. Like I said before, there is more to this story. I am sure he got cut off or something. More than likely the balance was not right on the trailer, ect. No way to say if more truck would have helped or not.

I hope he gets better soon, I really do. Its his, yours, or my choice to get into a rig and go.

Chris

 

[aczlan]

This is true. If you look close in the pictures, it is a tandem dual 20k gooseneck trailer. It would be difficult to position a backhoe on that trailer so that it didn't have enough tongue weight. He did do a good job chaining it on the trailer though. It sure didn't go anywhere.

Are you sure on the gooseneck part? The pictures of the accident and where the trailer ended up in relation to the truck make it look a lot like a tag trailer as does the fishtailing part.

Either way, it looks to me like the back tire of the backhoe was probably on or behind the rear axle of the trailer (based on where the beginning of the dovetail is in relation to the back tire of the backhoe as seen in the story) making the nose of trailer very light:

Now, compare that picture to one of a similar backhoe on a tag trailer:

It appears that the backhoe in the accident was on a trailer similar in length to this one, but was back a foot or two more than this one (as measured by the distance from the bucket to the front of the trailer and the distance from the backhoe's back tires to the beginning of the dovetail).

It is possible that the backhoe shifted in transit or during the accident (if it wasn't chained down properly), but I doubt it as the chains that I can see look like they were well placed if if they were loose, they would have probably snapped from the shockload.

I am glad that he is recovering, but I suspect that this accident might have been preventable with proper trailer loading.

Aaron Z

 

[slowzuki]

Looks like a bumper pull and looks to be loaded too far to the rear, the hoe is hanging over the rear of the trailer. Centre of mass is barely in front of the rear tires on these machines.

10,000 lbs is fine on a 350 when setup right. If I'm towing over loaded, which it appears he was as the trailer looks like a small float, am I going to head out on the freeway at 70 mph? Nope.

 

[Kyle241]

Sorry to hear about your friend. Personally I would not tow a full sized backhoe with a 1 ton either. I don't like heavy loads on the back and I've driven a 40ft RV with pickup attached for years and it works because the RV outweighs the truck by 8 to 1. Having a BH with a 1 ton just doesn't seem like enough truck but others have stated if loaded correctly it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Army grunt]

sorry to hear about your friend. I have a "CDL" got mine in 68 when you only needed to be driving a rig an have your employer sign you up. At that time my rule of thumb when i was told to pull something was really simple after checking the rig an tie downs excepting it was all ok. pull whatever up to speed. apply the trailer brakes(only the tr brakes)if it stopped ok then all is ok. if it didn't its not road worthy.I wouldn't pull it. job or not.
Just my $00.o2 worth
Army Grunt

 

[slowzuki]

Flat towing a vehicle, even with integrated braking is really tough, the dynamics of a flat tow cause the tow vehicle to get pushed around hard.

Looking up 4wd 580 weights, a modern one weighs up to just about 18,000 lbs. Over loaded with a bad weight distribution is a bad combo.

Sorry to hear about your friend. Personally I would not tow a full sized backhoe with a 1 ton either. I don't like heavy loads on the back and I've driven a 40ft RV with pickup attached for years and it works because the RV outweighs the truck by 8 to 1. Having a BH with a 1 ton just doesn't seem like enough truck but others have stated if loaded correctly it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[dodge man]

I've seen a lot of backhoes towed to job sites. If that isn't a goose neck, I bet its a pintle(??) hitch setup. I've always seen a tandem axle dump truck pulling a load like that.

 

[High Compression]

It looks like a pintle to me too. (even more insane) It also looks like a Deere 310 or 410 not a 580 now that I blow up the pic. I went off what I was told by my other friend that talked to him. Regardless, I don't mean to preach. I'm not perfect and I have done stupid things in my younger years. We ALL just need to step back and take a second look sometimes and make sure that we're not going to make a mistake that will cause someone else grief, pain and suffering. And we can't always trust what the truck tag says. Sometimes a little common sense has to come into play. Happy tractoring, towing, living.:thumbsup:

 

[clemsonfor]

All you guys are making good points. When you think about liability the manufactures are robably a little liberal on the tow weights.

But along what Dpiolt said, if you cant ever tow more than 10K, 1/3 to half all the campers on the road would have to be pulled by F-450to650 trucks which pretty much NO regular person has can afford and wont get a CDL to drive them.

 

[powerstroke444e]

It puts a guy in a tough spot when his boss says do it and the driver is the one that gets the ticket.
Best wishes for the driver.
Remember that its doing safely is the drivers job.

 

[Soundguy]

All you guys are making good points. When you think about liability the manufactures are robably a little liberal on the tow weights.

But along what Dpiolt said, if you cant ever tow more than 10K, 1/3 to half all the campers on the road would have to be pulled by F-450to650 trucks which pretty much NO regular person has can afford and wont get a CDL to drive them.

you are seeing half tons with those tow ratings now.. and as you mention.. RV's pull more than that every day...

I have a f350 and f450 both DRW and a 14k tandem gooseneck with good brakes.. it's rare when i'm NOT pulling 10K..

soundguy