Burning Water

[TomPenny]

I saw something the other day. I was out in Cumby Texas visiting a friend when a buddy of his starting talking about something he'd heard about and made work.

this all happened in front of me.

He filled an igloo cooler with water from the tap. Placed a contraption into the cooler. A real simple thing, couple of pieces of metal bolted together sandwiching something with a few wires comming from it.

He hooked it up to a typical battery charger on low and we waited. A few minutes later it started to foam on the surface. Just a little like a film layer of bubbles.

He took a lighter and lite it. Poof a small flame.

He then added one drop of dawn detergent. This caused the film of bubbles to get a little bigger. When he lite that you got a very impressive flame, looked very hot.

This may be old news I dont' know but to catch water on fire is something to see.

Apparently this electric gadet does electrolosys which unbinds the hydrogen and oxygen at a molecular level. When this happens the 2 gases escape. Some of it is trapped for a moment in the small bubbles. Poof!

I was impressed.

 

[Treemonkey1000]

The detergent just loosened the retention of the water molecules. Surface tension is what you see when you see water in a glass mounded up slightly or a bead of water on a stained deck. Add a little detergent and it breaks down the surface tension. Thus the water soaks in faster. When I was a Volunteer Fire fighter and we had brush or forest fires we would add a little detergent to the Fire Engine water tank. The water would then soak into the ground much faster to put out burning of roots and buried material. The same process for your Hydrogen releasing to burn. Probably another reason they tell you to keep flame away from charging batteries that are bubbling off hydrogen gas. Now some smarter cookie than I can come along and correct my little spiel here.

 

[woodlandfarms]

That, my friend, is the starting idea on the hydrogen fuel cell that they hope to be powering our cars in the next 20 years with.

Fuel cell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cool stuff. I was at JPL and they were running one as a demo.... Who would have thunk it...

 

[have_blue]

He took a lighter and lite it. Poof a small flame.

When I was in 6th grade, we learned to produce hydrogen and oxygen by electrolysis. I took it a step farther and learned how to inflate balloons with pure hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen balloons would float up quickly and disappear. I learned to make a tiny little oxy-hydrogen torch with thin copper tube, combining the gases from each balloon. Once in a while, the flame would flash back into the balloon, and BANG! Skeer the bejeezus out of ya.

My neighbor said they used to fill garbage bags with gas from an oxy-acetylene torch. They would stand back and shoot it with a .22, and said it would make a nice loud bang. It's amazing to me how the bullet sets off the gas. Anyone try that?

 

[AlanB]

When I was in 6th grade, we learned to produce hydrogen and oxygen by electrolysis. I took it a step farther and learned how to inflate balloons with pure hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen balloons would float up quickly and disappear. I learned to make a tiny little oxy-hydrogen torch with thin copper tube, combining the gases from each balloon. Once in a while, the flame would flash back into the balloon, and BANG! Skeer the bejeezus out of ya.

My neighbor said they used to fill garbage bags with gas from an oxy-acetylene torch. They would stand back and shoot it with a .22, and said it would make a nice loud bang. It's amazing to me how the bullet sets off the gas. Anyone try that?

Not yet

When my dad was a kid, growing up in Waterville Maine, his dad owned the Chrysler dealership. One of those old ones with the big glass windows and the office in glass in the middle of the showroom.

Dad did the Oxy Acetylene balloon using a big weather ballon behind the shop. He lit it in the back alley and ran, the story goes he passed an old lady and asked her if she could run,,,,, he made it too the front of the shop as it went off and apparently blew out many windows in the dealership, and surrounding buildings. I was told that his dad, without looking up from the desk, with the office glass falling around him screamed DICK, what did you do!

He went to boarding school the next week.

I would tell you about mine, but not sure if the statute of limitations is passed yet

O/A ballon on the range with a 22 sounds cool though. Kind of like Party Poppers.

 

[TomPenny]

A hydrogen fuel cell is a little different concept. It takes hydrogen from a source(tank) converts it to energy which is then used to charge a battery.

This concept which clearly has been around for a long time creates a very flammable gas from water. This gas evidently is released in proportion to the amount of current used.

Story has it, a typical alternator on todays vehicles produce enough current to generate the gases at a rate sufficient to operate the engine. The story continues where this guy(not the guy I met) has driven a vehicle coast to coast on 22gals of water.

I don't know about all that but I did see a guy light up some water with a bic after only a few minutes of current being passed into it.

I saw pics of a chevy extended cab p/u that had been opened like can in an explotion caused from Oxygen-Acytelene filled balloons. These young people had filled the balloons put them in the truck and drove somewhere to blow them up. Static charge ended their little pyro-show a little early. There was one young man still in the truck when it happend. He lucked out and only suffered a removed scalp.

So any young'ans reading this post might want to think twice about screwing around with the old mans Oxygen-Acytelene rig.

 

[woodlandfarms]

A hydrogen fuel cell is a little different concept. It takes hydrogen from a source(tank) converts it to energy which is then used to charge a battery.

You are absolutely right, what I was getting at is that from what the scientist at JPL told me was that the idea for the fuel cell came from this process.. Sorry I was not more clear on that.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

My computer guy is currently messing around with this. He has a system hooked to his Taurus to supplement the gasoline burning. He claims to be getting a few more miles per gallon. he has done a ton of research on this and claims that when anyone gets real close to going to market with something, they get bought out by the auto industry or disappear.

 

[YM-135trac]

Oh gawd, I hope it ain't so... I need my water to, uh drink & bath &stuff. If it really burns then that means it'll be comoditized, then the clepto-corpra-crats will control ALL-OF-It? I guess I'll have to get another job to pay for this, or be thirsty & stinky?

 

[oldhippy]

I know a guy that is converting his truck to all hydrogen fuel. He is building a small hydrogen generator to power it. Some one has plans to do this and he is using them. He has about a thousand in this generator. The hydrogen that is created for the first step is to "hot" to use and is run through a coil that has a pot switch to control it. If the head tempature is to hot then voltage is increased to cool the fuel. This is going to be put on a Toyota Tundra pickup. I did some machine work on the cans that cause the electrolosys and these are 5"long and about 3" in diameter. He is a electronic guy and is making a board to cause the electrolosys to take place. Wonder how long before we have a water tax on car use? big dan

 

[MReeb]

he has done a ton of research on this and claims that when anyone gets real close to going to market with something, they get bought out by the auto industry or disappear.

I've heard a few stories like that as well. My grampa talked about a guy who converted his tractor to run using a mix of gas and hydrogen. The tractor was supposedly bought by one of the larger tractor manufacturers, taken to the local quarry an blown up. Not sure how many of these stories are urban legend but...

 

[YM-135trac]

I know a guy that is converting his truck to all hydrogen fuel. He is building a small hydrogen generator to power it. Some one has plans to do this and he is using them. He has about a thousand in this generator. The hydrogen that is created for the first step is to "hot" to use and is run through a coil that has a pot switch to control it. If the head tempature is to hot then voltage is increased to cool the fuel. This is going to be put on a Toyota Tundra pickup. I did some machine work on the cans that cause the electrolosys and these are 5"long and about 3" in diameter. He is a electronic guy and is making a board to cause the electrolosys to take place. Wonder how long before we have a water tax on car use? big dan

Hey hippy, tax yes,but by whom? I don't make this stuff up. Google "paraguay aquifer"and see who just added that bad boy to their porfolio. Might be a nice cool place to be when the heat gets turned on? plan"B" nothing like a back-up plan.

The Paraguayan Senate voted last summer to “grant U.S. troops immunity from national and International Criminal Court (ICC) jurisdiction.”
Immediately afterwards, 500 heavily armed U.S. troops arrived with various planes, choppers and land vehicles at Mariscal Estigarribia air base, which happens to be at the northern tip of Paraguay near the Bolivian/Brazilian border. More have reportedly arrived since then. Gota "FIX-UP" the neighbor before you move in I guess?
TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION/

 

[SamWalton]

My computer guy is currently messing around with this. He has a system hooked to his Taurus to supplement the gasoline burning. He claims to be getting a few more miles per gallon. he has done a ton of research on this and claims that when anyone gets real close to going to market with something, they get bought out by the auto industry or disappear.

There going NO to market! Money talks and fools disappear. These devices are in operation all over the world. Your safe and only route is to build for yourself and keep it to yourself. Also design to crack on demand because the storage is very dangerous.

 

[SteelDust]

The problem with producing through electrolysis is that it's a net negative fuel source. It takes more power to produce it than it yields. In other words if you used 100 kilowatts of electricity to produce a certain amount of hydrogen, that hydrogen would yield something less than 100 kilowatts of energy. You'd be far more efficient taking the power used to perform the electrolysis, storing it in a battery and utilizing it in an electric motor.

 

[Egon]

Does all this mean the Pouge sp?? carburetor is not the way to go?

 

[woodlandfarms]

The guys at JPL were showing a solar paneled Hydrogen maker...

We are following fairly closely a new technology with solar panels using holography to amplify the efficency of the panels. We are planning to incorporate both into our house in LA and up north. We are also considering small wind turbine for the LA house....

Holographic Solar: New Method of Concentrating Sunlight Could Be Cheaper : TreeHugger

There was a thing on the tube last night where a town installed 4 large windmills.. While they have to pay for the purchase and the mainenance, the windmills should keep electricity prices fixed for the next 20 years....

 

[DIRTROAD]

I am currently building one of these little Hydrogen cells just to see how it does. Just using what I have seen on Youtube.com. My question is that "If gasoline and diesel are this expensive after only about 100 years of steady use, How long will it be before our water bills are crazy high?" Given this technology catches on.

 

[TomPenny]

The problem with producing through electrolysis is that it's a net negative fuel source. It takes more power to produce it than it yields. In other words if you used 100 kilowatts of electricity to produce a certain amount of hydrogen, that hydrogen would yield something less than 100 kilowatts of energy. You'd be far more efficient taking the power used to perform the electrolysis, storing it in a battery and utilizing it in an electric motor.

Well that was my first thought and question reguarding the claim that someone drove from coast to coast on 22gals of water. If thats were true the vehicles charging system would produce the gas at a sufficient rate.

If it is in fact a net negative fuel source, again my first thought, you would not be able to generate enough electricity using on board charging system powered by the very engine being fueled.

 

[BobRip]

Well that was my first thought and question reguarding the claim that someone drove from coast to coast on 22gals of water. If thats were true the vehicles charging system would produce the gas at a sufficient rate.

If it is in fact a net negative fuel source, again my first thought, you would not be able to generate enough electricity using on board charging system powered by the very engine being fueled.

It's not just the volume of electricity generated (although that too), but the more power you pull from the generator (or alternator), the more torque and power required from the engine to run the generator, and the more fuel the engine will use. Of course the generator is not 100% efficient and neither is the gasoline engine. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

 

[EastTexFrank]

The problem with producing through electrolysis is that it's a net negative fuel source. It takes more power to produce it than it yields. In other words if you used 100 kilowatts of electricity to produce a certain amount of hydrogen, that hydrogen would yield something less than 100 kilowatts of energy. You'd be far more efficient taking the power used to perform the electrolysis, storing it in a battery and utilizing it in an electric motor.

And there's the rub. It's not that you can't run a car on water, it's just that it doesn't make any economic sense to do it. Why would you use diesel to produce electricity to produce hydrogen to run a vehicle when it's a lot more efficient and economic to run the diesel in the vehicle in the first place. If anyone finds a free lunch somewhere give me a call.