Loader Busted hydraulic hose...

/ Busted hydraulic hose... #1  

xtn

Platinum Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2011
Messages
887
Tractor
New Holland Boomer 50
Well I've had my NH Boomer 50 for two weeks, and already sprung a leak in a hydraulic hose. Specifically the hose that commands the DOWN action on the loader. The one on the right side.

I was just back-dragging with the bucket. Shouldn't I expect the hoses to hold a higher pressure than the release valve is set to?

xtn
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #2  
I'd say it was a defective hose. Back dragging should have not hurt a hose.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #3  
Oh my! Backdragging can be MURDER on hoses, especially if you hit a rock, a tree stump, or anything else. If you backdrag with your bucket only down at a 45 degree angle, you will probably be okay. That's because it will lift up the front of your tractor and only a small pressure spike will be felt. If you go beyond 45 degrees and approach 70 to 90 degrees down, the pressure spike is more pronounced and may be huge. Why doesn't the relief valve stop any high pressure spike? Because the relief valve is only in the circuit when the joystick is not centered. I put that in bold because it is so important to understand. When you backdrag, you rotate the bucket down and then hold it in position by centering the joystick or only moving it slightly. The centered joystick valve isolates the loader hydraulic from the rest of the hydraulic circuit including the relief valve.

In the hydraulic circuit, the loader physically cannot drop because of the relief valve. Have you ever heard of someone carrying a very heavy load and have it drop because the relief valve popped open? I don't think so. The strength of the hoses, metal tubes, joystick valves, and hydraulic cylinders all have to be much higher than the pressure relief valve pressure. I like to use 4000 psi working pressure hoses. Their bursting pressure is way above 4000 psi. If you T'd in a pressure gage and left it there while you were operating, you'd be surprised, I'm sure.

At some point, I have busted all four of my OEM curl/dump cylinder hoses on my tractor. I have four 4000 psi hoses and a spare I keep for emergencies. If you think about it, you can have your loader cutting edge down and be dozing with it and hit an obstruction too. That will surely also cause a spike and may pop a hose. Once you understand how the loader hydraulics and joystick work, it makes you a bit more careful. At least that was true in my case. I'm always careful to backdrag at high angles only if I'm in very loose materials where I am sure there is no obstruction.:thumbsup:
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #5  
Oh my! Backdragging can be MURDER on hoses, especially if you hit a rock, a tree stump, or anything else. If you backdrag with your bucket only down at a 45 degree angle, you will probably be okay. That's because it will lift up the front of your tractor and only a small pressure spike will be felt. If you go beyond 45 degrees and approach 70 to 90 degrees down, the pressure spike is more pronounced and may be huge. Why doesn't the relief valve stop any high pressure spike? Because the relief valve is only in the circuit when the joystick is not centered. I put that in bold because it is so important to understand. When you backdrag, you rotate the bucket down and then hold it in position by centering the joystick or only moving it slightly. The centered joystick valve isolates the loader hydraulic from the rest of the hydraulic circuit including the relief valve.

In the hydraulic circuit, the loader physically cannot drop because of the relief valve. Have you ever heard of someone carrying a very heavy load and have it drop because the relief valve popped open? I don't think so. The strength of the hoses, metal tubes, joystick valves, and hydraulic cylinders all have to be much higher than the pressure relief valve pressure. I like to use 4000 psi working pressure hoses. Their bursting pressure is way above 4000 psi. If you T'd in a pressure gage and left it there while you were operating, you'd be surprised, I'm sure.

At some point, I have busted all four of my OEM curl/dump cylinder hoses on my tractor. I have four 4000 psi hoses and a spare I keep for emergencies. If you think about it, you can have your loader cutting edge down and be dozing with it and hit an obstruction too. That will surely also cause a spike and may pop a hose. Once you understand how the loader hydraulics and joystick work, it makes you a bit more careful. At least that was true in my case. I'm always careful to backdrag at high angles only if I'm in very loose materials where I am sure there is no obstruction.:thumbsup:

Jim, if I understand what you are saying, on an open center system when the joystick (or any open center hydraulic control valve without relief valves in the working circuits) is centered, any transient pressures induced by having the loader hit an obstruction are reacted out in the cylinders, hoses, and the control valve.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #6  
What jinman said is correct,the oil is trapped and has nowhere to go when the valve is returned back to center.Your hose is probally a #6 2wire which is good for around 4,ooo psi working pressure,the burst pressure is 4 times working pressure.That would bring it up to 16,000 psi burst pressure.Who knows what the pressure spikes to when something is hit,depending on the speed and force of the tractor.I've also seen the bucket curl cylinder rods bend from misuse.You could also blow out the piston seal internally causing the oil to bypass.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #7  
Also check the hose routing installation. Every hose should have the manufacture's data on it or a colored line down length of the hose. The line or writing must run in a straight line, not spiraled around the hose. If the hose is twisted in compress steel webbing in one area and expands in other. This expanded area dramaticly reduces the pressure rating of hose in that spot.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #8  
Jim, if I understand what you are saying, on an open center system when the joystick (or any open center hydraulic control valve without relief valves in the working circuits) is centered, any transient pressures induced by having the loader hit an obstruction are reacted out in the cylinders, hoses, and the control valve.

Yep, you understand exactly what I was saying, but you said it in a lot fewer words.:eek::D
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose...
  • Thread Starter
#9  
Thanks for the explanation. I didn't hit anything, but was back dragging with the bucket tilted down pretty steep. I hadn't thought about the fact that the circuit is closed off from the pump and relief valve when the control lever is centered. :mur:

xtn
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #10  
sounds like bad luck blowing a hydro hose.just take it off an have a new hydro hose made.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #11  
Thanks for the explanation. I didn't hit anything, but was back dragging with the bucket tilted down pretty steep. I hadn't thought about the fact that the circuit is closed off from the pump and relief valve when the control lever is centered. :mur:

xtn

Well, there's nothing that says you can't take the hose in and see if they'll replace it under warranty. I think you have a 1 year warranty on your loader.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #12  
Great explanation Jinman! :thumbsup:

Brian

Amen. I had that happen early on...

I have found a Green tractor dealer that will make hoses for about 1/3 the cost of one from NH though...must be expensive to ship them. ;)
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #13  
Agree with Jinman. I burst a hydraulic hose back dragging with FEL. Loader was few years old but hoses were in very good shape and I did not think I was using it that hard. The amount of force that can build up can be extreme. Better to burst a hose than break a cylinder or FEL. It is possible the hose was also defective. If still under warranty, they will probably replace it.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose...
  • Thread Starter
#14  
They are going to supply me a replacement hose, and I am going to be gentler with my back-dragging. I appreciate everyone who responded to my post.

When I put the new hose on, do I need to do anything special like some sort of purge procedure? Or do I just start using it and the air will find it's own way out of the lines?
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #15  
Put on the hose. Start it up and cycle the cylinders a few times to remove the air from the system. Then your good to go. No special procedure needed. If you lost much oil, be sure to check your fluids after you cycle/purge the air from the system.
 
/ Busted hydraulic hose... #16  
My NH dealer is pretty competitive on hoses IF they've got the fittings. When they don't, I"ve ordered them online from discounthydraulichose.com made to exact size and got them quick (ordered online Sunday nite, in my hands on Wednesday). They're pretty reasonable. I've also got a piece of R2 hose and some reusable fittings/adapters so if I bust one and need a temp fix, I'm covered.
 
 
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