Buying/Pricing

[Anonymous Poster]

Help - I just bought 9.25 acres, 5 of which will be lawn (overgrown field - swap birch, poplar, ~20' high). We will be building a house in the next year or so, and I have been looking at Compact tractors from a distance for about a year. I know next to nothing about tractors, but am very mechanically inclined (employed by General Motors for several years as a field specialist). In the process of building, I will need to do some trenching, lots of landscaping and a lot of mowing. I have been told to avoid a MMM or "Belly Mower" as they provide no clearance with loader work. I was told to use a rear finish mower. I was also told not to invest in a backhoe ($5-$9K) unless I use it weekly. I have looked at the NH TC33/35D and the Kubota L3410/3710. Deere seems to be awfully expensive for what you get, and smaller makes I want to avoid as they may not have dealer representation locally. I think I need about 30 HP, but don't know what I'll need for implements. I've heard too many stories of people not buying enough tractor up front.....

 

[Golfgar4]

If you've been looking at NH, did you take a look at the TC30? That seems to be a pretty popular and nice "economy" model. A lot of people have picked up one of these lately.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

They (NH Dealer) told me for the additional money the 33 was the way to go. They also mentioned the 35 is the larger frame of the TC40/45D as well as axles, etc. The NH seem to be down on power compared to the Kubotas.

 

[Boondox]

Dazed -- Like so many others, it sounds like you're in that grey area where the tractor you need for the heavy construction work is not the same as the tractor you'll need for the upkeep later. Could you describe your short and long term uses a little more? It might help us provide better input.

Not sure I agree with the advice you got on the backhoe; they have to be the most fun of any implement out there! Sometimes I find myself transplanting trees just for the sake of digging a new hole! /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Pete

 

[Anonymous Poster]

The house will be about 800 feet from the road. I will need a backhoe to trench for utilities, put in a culvert, and I'm sure other things will come up. I could rent/lease a backhoe for a week/month - and that's what others have suggested. Ultimately my main use will be mowing the 5 acres of lawn. I used to do a lot of landscaping and will around this house, so a loader is a must. I may have fences - so a post hole digger might be nice. I guess what I'm trying to say, is I know once you have one of these, you will use it constantly.

 

[looch]

I have some small excavation work to do around my house. I just priced the rental of a JD 4400 with loader and back hoe - 210$ CDN (130 US) for 24 hours! To me that's darned reasonable. I'll have a hard time justifying a back hoe for my tractor at that price.

 

[Gary_in_Indiana]

<font color=blue>"the backhoe; they have to be the most fun of any implement out there"</font color=blue>

I have to agree. I had to drive a couple 8' long 5/8" copper rods to 6" below grade 6' apart for electrical grounds recently. The area was all hard packed clay (as is most of my county). I tiried working them in with water, sledge hammering them and a fence post driver all to no avail. I'd get to about 4' and they just bound up on that sticky clay.

I got out the backhoe and dug a 7' long trench about 6' deep and then used the fence post driver to set the rods down a couple feet in the bottom of it. Then I just backfilled to about a foot of grade and used the sledge hammer for the last few inches and ran my ground wire. I'll backfill the last half foot after the inspection later this week.

In this case I don't know how else I'd have done the job but I'm sure no other way would have been as much fun, regardless. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif/w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

 

[Anonymous Poster]

I am looking at the 3 best represented manufacturers in my area. (Albany, NY) I think 30 HP is the right number....if so, the Kubota 3410/3710, the NH TC33D/35D, or the JD 4400??

The Kubota seems to be the most powerful all around???

 

[BKColeman]

Sounds like you're looking in the right area.

I started out looking at the Kubota 3410, JD 4300, and NH TC 33D. I quickly moved up to looking at the JD 4400 (then later the 4410) as it seemed to me to make sense to get the most power in the same physical size. Then the features of the Class III Boomers made me start looking at the 35D instead of the 33D. So then I started looking at the 3710 too.

I ended up deciding I was more comfortable with the twin pedal HST instead of the treadle so I ruled out the Class II Boomers and Kubotas. That probably isn't a big deal but I was more comfortable with the other style. So it came down to the JD 4410 and the TC 35D/40D.

I ended up choosing NH and went with the 40D over the 35D because of the 4cyl engine.

That was how my buying process went. It sounds like you're leaning toward the Kubota, which I think is a fine choice. I don't think the specs are much different on any of them so it boils down to which tractor and which dealer you are most comfortable with.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

look at the Mahindra line either the 3510 or 4110, nice tracor, heaver than most, higher lifting capcities than most, priced right, the have factory installed Bradco backhoes sub frame mount now availible, i don't think youll be disapionted.
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.newenglandtractor.com/>http://www.newenglandtractor.com/</A>

 

[Boondox]

<font color=blue>I am looking at the 3 best represented manufacturers in my area. (Albany, NY) </font color=blue>

I think he wants something he can service locally. Some of these new-to-the-US lines might be great deals, but without somebody local to stand behind them...

Pete

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Just went to a local dealer that used to carry Kubota. They have switched to Massey-Fuergeson. He spent quite a bit of time with me explaining things. He stated Massey costs a little more, but the quality is much better. Talked me out of Hydrostatic because of all the power loss. They offer a "Power Shuttle" which I believe will do what I want. Now I have to go see if the other manufacturers have something like that. They also are offering a "v" or value series that is more comparable to a Kubota price point. 8 speeds instead of 16, no Hydrostatic drive and fixed ROPS. Why would you want foldable ROPS anyway?? I have to be honest, this is getting more convoluted each day. This will easily be a 6 mo. - 1 yr process.

 

[wasabi]

<font color=blue>This will easily be a 6 mo. - 1 yr process.</font color=blue> Actually, the process gets less daunting after you get into it a bit more, and as several folks pointed out to me early in my search, it can and should be fun! (Took me about 4 months)

Since you are mechanically inclined, you might find the American built Power Trac line as interesting as some other TBNers, myself included. They are very logical, straightforward machines that can be fairly easily self-maintained. Impressive statistics including lift vs weight, power, outstanding manuverability, hillside stability and comparative cost. There is a PT forum here. Check it out. For more info on the Tazwell VA based company and their line of well-built tractors, go to: www.power-trac.com

 

[Anonymous Poster]

If you are going to buy a loader with your machine I suggest you talk yourself back into hydrostatic. You do lose some power, about 1.5 hp in the compact range, but the convenience difference will be made up every time you get on your tractor. Any of these machines have plenty of power to make up the difference and there will be plenty of HP left over. As far as what brand to get. I like green but just pick your favorite color because you can't go wrong between Kubs, NH, or Deere. Unless all you are doing is tilling a long row get the hydro.

 

[TimSullivan]

My advice is just read all the threads on this site that you can. I spent nine months before I bought my 4300. Shopped everywhere and ended up buying just 10 miles away. Get out, drive the machines, make sure the machine fits you and you are comfortable with the controls. I was already to buy a Kubota but when I drove it, I was just not comfortable on it. It was not the machine's problem just my body.

Just remember you are buying to help develop a relationship with the dealer. I worked for a car dealer while going to college. There is a difference how you are treated if you bought the car from the dealer you were expecting to service it.

The better know brands are all good machines. Your task is to find the dealer, tractor and price that all adds up to the best deal. Please don't just shop price.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Absolutely not. I have had a lot of experience in the car industry (worked for General Motors). I am buying the "best value" I am just trying to sift through all the marketing hoopla and get to the facts. If I have to pay $1000 more for a more durable product, that's a no-brainer. If I wanted to shop price alone, I would get a second tier manufacturer that supplies the big guys without the markup.

 

[Boondox]

Try to remember when you're talking to a salesman that he wants to sell you something. If any salesman said anything derogatory about Kubota, JD or HN/Ford quality I'd walk away.

The "loss" of PTO HP with HST has never been an issue with me and my L3010. I do a lot of loader work, and really appreciate the ease of operation. I can focus on controlling the FEL and ignore pedals, switches, etc. Try them both before you rule out a hydrostat.

Why have a foldable ROPS? Well, I lower mine to get into the garage or to mow under low-hanging branches. With it lowered, I can even fit into the sheep shed to use the rear blade instead of a shovel and wheelbarrow.

Don't be bamboozled by a used car sales type. Get out there and try some machines. I know you felt JD was too $$$, but give them a try as well. The quality is up there, and you might find the visibility and ergonomics to your liking.

If you're near Vermont, contact me privately and I'll let you drive my L3010HST

Pete

 

[Kodiak]

Dazed welcome to the confusion (I mean forum)

I'd like to get back to the backhoe issue. Having a backhoe is like having a second pair of hands, and 3 or 4 strong backs. In regards to renting, you are soon going to be into that phase of property development that when you need a backhoe, you need it right now. You don't want to be 3 or 4 down the list waitng for one to be delivered. Especially if you have subcontrators standing around, on time and materials, waiting for you. And if they pull off your job because your not ready. You may have quite a hard time getting them back. It will be at their convenience not yours. Secondly does that price include pick up and delivery. That adds up fast when they have to bring it out 6 or 8 times. Then after construction and you want to do all that beautiful landscaping. You know the projects where you really should try to take your time for quality. Well a 24 hr rental usually involves trying to squeeze as many projects in as you can possibly get to. They are usually rushed and/or 1/2 finished. The results really suffer. And of course you don't want me to even go there, where you have enlisted help paid for or not. Only to have your rental unit crap out on you, because some 1/2 baked rental yard wannabe mechanic didn't take the time to service it right. Oops kind a got carried away about all those wonderful experiences, that I and others have encountered.

On the other hand, ownership of your own backhoe means its always available when you want it, at your schedule. And you know its capabilities, instead of relying on what somebody else tells you, or has available. If your shrewd you can recover some of its expense from the 1001 people who will stop by after they find out you own a backhoe. And of cousre should you ever get caught up /w3tcompact/icons/eyes.gif. And feel that you can no lnger justify owning a backhoe. Just post a for sale notice here on TBN, it won't last long, every body wants a backhoe.

I have a new TC29 with a Woods 7500 Ground breaker backhoe and the Woods 1012 loader. As well as my 22 year old kubota L345DT with Loader and backhoe (bought it new). So you can see that I have been doing this for awhile. I think the TC29/33 with the above pkg would probably be well suited for your needs. Kubota also makes good products, and can match a hoe and loader, in a properly put together pkg. John Deere, well I think they have some issues to sort out right now. During construction I think a smaller, yet powerful (at least 29 hp) tractor may be more handy, working in tight areas, same goes for landscaping. I downsized from the L345 to the TC29 for this very reason. Its the after construction/landscaping uses where you need to justify the size of tractor you need/use. If you have to go for the larger frame tractors, then you should equip them with a larger backhoe. Probably the Woods 9000 or maybe a Bradco.

Well thats my $0.47 worth. Good luck, on your tractor purchase. I think your on the right track. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[frank_f15]

DAZED: sit back and taake a deep breadth/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif u need to look at what u want to do with the tractor most of the time. as far as a BH goes, once u do your trenching, will u have more needs for it? as much fun as they are to operate, if u don't have a need for it that is a lot of $ to be sitting around, u can rent a trencher or mini excavator for a lot less than that.as for a hydro , i personally would not be with out it, granted u do loose a little pto hp, but not that much and the way it makes it easier to do many tasks is well worth it at least for me.the ability to change speed with out loosing rpm is invaluable.also remember the bigger the tractor the heavier the tractor, depending on the type of mowing u are going to be doing and the ground conditions, sometimes bigger is not better. as far as jd, nh or kubota u have to get the one u feel most comfortable with all of them have the strong and weak points.the tractor search can be daunting but it should be fun also/w3tcompact/icons/eyes.gif

 

[Gary_in_Indiana]

Boondox makes some excellent points. What you like, I might not and vice versa. For example, I got folding ROPS not because I want to ever lower it, but because the non-folding ROPS wasn't as high as my head when I was on the tractor seat(somewhat defeating the purpose, I thought).

I wanted to buy Kubota because of their reputation, their local dealer was a HS classmate and his store is less than a mile from my drive. Unfortunately, the HST foot lever (a rocker style) was terribly uncomfortable for me. I looked at New Holland but the local dealer was closing his doors after 53 years so they were out. I ended up with a Deere almost by default and I'm very happy with it.

Lots of things go into a buying decision for every individual. Make sure you try each machine and make sure you're comfortable on whatever you buy. You'll be spending a lot of time on it. Good luck with whichever color you pick.