Cat 257 hydro problem

   / Cat 257 hydro problem #1  

DirtyWorks

Silver Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
199
Location
Mississippi Pine Belt
Tractor
ASV RC-100, '07 272c Cat ,Kubota 080 with Cimaf Head, Cat 257 MTL, JD 450c, Kubota 3440 4wd CUT w/ fel
:eek: Ok guys my ol reliable 257 an 03 model with a lot of hours decided to lay down on me yesterday. There is no power to the lift or tilt. I can try to explain it better. It will lift and tilt when nothing is on the front, but put on my grapple @700-800lbs or even an empty dirt bucket @ 350lbs it will barely pick it up off the ground. I have to throttle all the way up and it will move up maby 2" and that is all. I let off the stick and do it again to get another few inches out of it. When no attachment it will lift fine. The machine moves/tracks as if no problem. I do not know if the aux hydraulics arefunctioning as I did not hook them up. I was worried that i may have a broken line but lfted the cab and found nothing obvious. I will not be able to get it to a dealer till tues or wed and would like to try to find the problem myself. Is it possible to be a relief bypassing or stuck? the machine does not bog or stall but does nothing if this info helps. I would like any and all advise. Thanks in advance.
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#2  
Oh my guy was mowing with it when it did whatever it did. Could he have hit something ? The mower is/was supposed to have a sheer pin in it but I have since found out the soft bolt had been replaced by a much harder one than it should have. Is there a coupling in the machine that could have sheared instead and if so where would i find it?
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #3  
Dirty, i had a hydro problem once with the L joystick...Unrelated to what you are experiencing (R joystick)but it was explained to me that fluid was bypassing in the valve assy related to that stick..mine would be driving forward and machine would start to make a very hard right turn and the reverse beacon would sound...Was told that the valve assy's related to the joysticks were a common fault especially w/higher hours.....might be something to look at ..think it was like 600 bux.
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #4  
Low pressure issues on multiple functions is usually a pump problem. I would follow the lines and see if there is a pump that controls these functions only. Pumps go bad many times before relief valves do. I've worked on hydraulics many years and don't know if I ever saw a relief valve go bad. I"m sure they do go bad, but I haven't seen it. I've seen plenty of pumps do just this. Do you have pressure gauges? I know that Cat's are pretty good with installing test ports.
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#5  
Thanks Scott. I was hoping to find a pinched line or a bad leak or something obvious. I've never had a control problem, other than self inflicted, yet.

WC I do not have any gauges at this time but may welll need to invest in some. Never can have too many tools! I do believe there is only one pump on my machine that controls everything. Do the drive motors run directly off the pump and then the loader functions runn off a seperate piece? ie a coupler? Does my problem definately like a hydro related one vs an electrical one? ie fuse, safty, etc? I may have to wait till Tues if I do not come up with anything. Is there a way without knowing the exact pressures if some thing is stopped up or restricted? Thanks for the replies and I will keep yalll posted and up to date as I search for my solution. I may be the next person to look straight at the screen and declare..."I am NOT smarter than a CAT Technician"
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #6  
Hey Dirt. I think WC has lead you very close to your problem. I think you were getting there on your own. If you had a leak bad enough to not lift you would hydro fluid everywhere. I would think if it was a fuse it wouldn't work at all. Sorry for the breakage!! It's hard to make money when your customer gives to you and you turn around and give it to the dealer!!
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #7  
Have you made sure that the switch is off that controls the attachment flow? Also is there a relief valve on the lifting cylinder that is sticking open? I know on my Asv Rc30, if you leave the continuous flow switch on, with nothing attached, it'll stall. Not too sure if yours is similar.:confused:
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#8  
Dave, my asv is that way also. The little cat does not have a switch, just a momentary button like on your joystice. I do need to put a switch in though. The way it is now you thumb get tried quick!
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #9  
hey dirty-I can lock my continuous flow so your thumb wheel finger can rest..I wonder if yours does also...My left joystick has 4 buttons on top and right has 2 buttons 1 wheel on top.

Right joystick-first,Roll the thumb wheel and hold

Left joystick-push and hold the bottom left botton -then let go of the thumb wheel and then the bottom left button...the attachment will run continuosly until one of the two forementoined butons or wheel is pushed again..

my finger used to get tired holding the wheel until i figured that out..Might be different on high flow model but try it...(once you get your lift/tilt figured out)
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#10  
Scott mine is a lowflow older model with only two buttons on the right. Works great for opening and closing the shear or grapples but thats about it. Left has only a horn on top:(
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #11  
oh darn, I know they have a few different j-stick options..

any luck yet? I have a CAT 247b/257b cd with exploded parts views and part numbers maybe i can find a way to send you copies of the hydraulics or heck try and burn a copy to mail to ya..
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #12  
You should still be able to let go of your button on your joy stick.If I remember right the 257A model that we had before the B model has a switch up to your left high in the canopy to activate the buttons so you dont have to hold It. check in your owners manual as I cant quite remember how to activate it.
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#13  
thanks scott a diagram of the hydraulics would be great! no luck yet it has been too cold this weekend to mess with it.:(
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#14  
dunebuggy55 said:
You should still be able to let go of your button on your joy stick.If I remember right the 257A model that we had before the B model has a switch up to your left high in the canopy to activate the buttons so you dont have to hold It. check in your owners manual as I cant quite remember how to activate it.
Dune, thanks I do remember that switch but i didn't think thats what it did. I have been out of that little machine for almost a year and a half and have never needed continous hydro. I did not have the mower then and have since put one of my guys in it.lol guess i will have to let the poor guy know!
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #15  
Any chance you have ice in the hydrolic lines or the bottom of the tank blocking flow?

I know you are in the South, but...

jb
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #16  
I had what seem's like the same problem on my ASV. I was running a carbide cutter and all of a sudden the lift arm's hyd. had no response it would just about lift the cutter off the ground and it was during August of 2006, I shut the machine off disconnected the cutter head and recycled the high flow and the the low flow switches.When I did this you could hear the change in tone of the Hyd, circuits after a few tries,I shut the machine off and then restarted the machine the lift arms worked fine. I reconnected the cutter and the unit worked fine. I believe one or both of the flow line valves got stuck and there was no hyd. for the lift arms. Since that time the problem has not reoccured. I talked to my dealer and he also thought that a valve was stuck open. I know that the hyd. of the ASV and Cat use many of the same components my 257 shares many of the asv features and vise versa. I know there is a way to check output pressures on these machines I do not have the equipment to do so but your dealer might be able to help you.
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #17  
Dirty, I viewed the Hydraulic sections of my CAT cd...169 pages....

No "flow" diagrams but some good descriptive images showing lift and tilt hydraulics..and of course part numbers..Ill try and burn the cd to another sometimes these things are copyrighted but ill try..

By chance did someone turn the MANUAL ball valve for the lift arms? Its located at the rear of the machine if you open the door on the right side has a square drive turning key...I think its for lowering the arms in emergency or when the conrols are inop to lower...maybe its open or partially open??? bypassing fluid?? Just a idea...im no hydro guy..

Maybe you already have it at CAT...
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem
  • Thread Starter
#19  
Did not get the CD as far as I know. Well update, went to cat Thurs and spent about three hours in their shop diagnoseing it. Checked pressures from the pump and it was at 1000psi max. Tec checked the relief and dissasembled it made sure there was nothing in there, and decided on it being either a $28 set of pump seals or the entire pump so I left it there for them to inspect further. Called Fri and they told me the bad news that it was the pump and they had one on the way from Atl. Should be here Mon and hopefully I will be in it again Tues at the latest. New Pump is $500 plus labor but it is ok since this is the first major problem in 3 years! Cat service has always been above and beyond what any dealer has ever offered us no matter where we purchased the machine. I could not express in words how they have gone out of their way several times in the past for us on little items. I just wish ASV was as good to their people.Thanks to all for their help on this matter. Your support and ideas is, as always, appreciated!
 
   / Cat 257 hydro problem #20  
I'm glad that Cat found your problem quite easily. I am a secondary local distributor for the Cat dealer in this territory, so I know what you mean about Cat's quality and service. They are a first class company.
I had a trainer here from Cat for some training. They figured on a week. When he found out I am a mechanic, we were able to cut it to 2.5 days. Class was geared to a novice. In our spare time, we discussed Cat's hydraulics in depth. He told me that when Cat had to increase their working pressures, they did it by tightening up the pump clearances. This makes clean oil and filters even more critical. If I had a Cat, I would use only Cat oil and filters. After they purchase their oil, they actually use a second filtering process then package it.
Their prices are also competitive with anyones, for the same quality stuff. I am a Weatherhead hose and fitting dealer as well as dealing Cat's hose and fittings. I can build a Cat hose cheaper than a Weatherhead.
 

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