CBP tractors

[Tractors4u]

Buck is right on. The buyer should have no expectations of the broker as far as the tractor is concerned unless the freight carrier the broker uses does some sort of damage. The broker is not in the tractor business. He may handle a tractor today, a load of cantaloupes in tomorrow and a load of rubber balls in the day after that, but know of those are his products. His product is the handling of a buyer's purchase. Now if the broker is promoting a certain exporter then that is different.

 

[JohnS]

Dan,

What parts were missing vs what parts were damaged in shipping? It is kinda nebulous with a retail dollar value that includes shipping. If CPB told you they stocked parts and/or would air freight them to you, and they did not, that would be an issue. Before I ordered my tractor, I knew there was little or no chance of getting the warrantee parts. Yes, they would be free, but cost of shipping would be prohibbitive. If I was lucky, I would find someone relatively close using the same export rep, and would get the parts on that order.

I did know that they typically throw in some free spare parts in the container. I negotiated the exact part numbers I wanted, and agreed apon value. This gave me something to offset issues, if I had them. Did you receive any free parts, and include them in your calculations?

I never did count the number of emails back and forth with the rep I used, but there was a good number. I already had been exposed to importing and had numerous discussions with people that had done it. The rep probably uses a translation program, because when we talked on the phone, it was a half hour of non-communication. My rep was in china, so add to that the time delay, where only one email can get answered per day. Add to that, the endless amount of chinese holidays!

I did not see what happened in your case with CBP, any different with dealing any of the reps I know about. If there is something else missing, please post it.

 

[JohnS]

Buying a laptop from Taiwan compares to buying a single large piece of equipment form China? How about Vietnam, India, South America, Mexico, any country? Wouldn't you research what that meant? What laws you have to worry about? And understand exactly what could happen? The info was all out there. Saving $$ sometimes blinds you from realizing what might happen.

 

[DIYGuy]

I must be missing something here...'cause it sound like were all in "violent agreement" /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

If you buy from a broker, you are the importer, dealer, end-user.
If you buy from an importer, they deal with customs, but you are the dealer, and end user.
If you buy from a dealer, then the dealer has skin in the game for a fee and you are just the end-user.

If you buy from a broker and have warranty issues, then it will take 60-90 days to work it out.

If you buy from an importer, they worry about getting your stuff, but it will still take 60-90 days.

If you buy from a dealer, then warranty issues are worked out with the dealer, and in some cases may still take 90 days to work out if the dealer doesn't have the parts, but you have leverage with the dealer and an expectation of how quickly warranty items would be handled.

The original poster purchased from a broker, had a warranty issue that would take 60-90 days to work out. I don't think CBP said they wouldn't, I think they said it would take time and there's a lot of leg work involved for the person acting as the importer and dealer. The original poster wasn't willing to wait, and, I'm out on a limb here, wasn't ready for the hassle of being an importer and dealer when a warranty issue occurred, so they tried to have the broker pick up the "importer/dealer" expediting costs (about $500) by buying things domestically and requesting reimbursement. (If I'm reading this correctly).

Yes there's an expectation that everything works, but when it doesn't, you're left with the original deal.

The cheaper the deal, the more risk you assume.

When I bought my crate tractor, I figured that my worst case risk was $2000 and 180 days (I didn't deal directly with the broker and had an importer share some of the risk). Best case was $0, 15 days. Turned out to be $100 and 60 days.

If expectations were not properly set, then that's bad, but it only takes a few minutes of reseach to understand the risks involved with being your own importer.

FWIW,

DIYGuy (MarkS)

 

[Anonymous Poster]

John,

The tractor was missing the following parts.
1.Seat Swivel
2. Shade Canopy
3.All of the adapter parts to hook the Backhoe to the tractor(Slotted shaft,adapter plate, adapter plate cover,bearings)
4. Several different fasteners(nuts and bolts)
The following parts were broken.
1. Exaust manifold
2.by-pass hose on coolong system
3.Power sterring cylinder cover boot


I do feel that when you purchase a product, any product you should at least get what you paid for, nothing more nothing less. That is just common sense, and the way any buisness that wants to stay in buisness, should be run.

I understand that if you buy from a dealer you will probobly get more support. I am not asking for support, I am asking for what I paid for...All of the parts from the manufacturer.

The nearest dealer to me is over 200 miles away and where I picked up the tractor was only about 100 miles away, that is why I did what I did.

As for any spare parts, they did send filters, some gaskets, and some spare glow plugs. I did think that was great, but does not make up for the missing and broken parts.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

YosemiteDan

The tractor was missing the following parts.
1.Seat Swivel
2. Shade Canopy
3.All of the adapter parts to hook the Backhoe to the tractor(Slotted shaft,adapter plate, adapter plate cover,bearings)
4. Several different fasteners(nuts and bolts)
The following parts were broken.
1. Exaust manifold
2.by-pass hose on coolong system
3.Power sterring cylinder cover boot

One word John...RE-freakin-DICULOUS!

I understand that in your case the broker isn't insuring that the product is working or even complete but the manufacturer must have Stevie Wonder working in quality control. These are big major parts not just a screw here a washer there.

Hope it works out and the tractor now gives you good service after the original issues.

 

[JohnS]

Dan,

Here are my thoughts on your issues:

1.Seat Swivel
3.All of the adapter parts to hook the Backhoe to the tractor(Slotted shaft,adapter plate, adapter plate cover,bearings)

This is not uncommon. Has been mentioned on CTOA numerous times. I am not sure if it is a manufacture/packing issue or how the order was specified to them. I would have made sure it was specified that these items were pre-installed on the tractor, on the Proforma Invoice.

4. Several different fasteners(nuts and bolts)
Again very common, the dealer keeps a stock of metric parts or go to a good supply house for metric bolts.


2. Shade Canopy
Non-critical part, and is sometimes considered an option. If not clearly stated on Proforma invoice (is it on yours?), might not been included. If CBP offered to pay shipping, could have waited. It is more common for it to be damaged in shipment.


The following parts were broken.
1. Exaust manifold
Casting or muffler? It would have taken allot of force to break the casting, but the muffler can get crushed easily. Muffler shouldn't have been a high cost.

2.by-pass hose on coolong system
Goto NAPA

3.Power sterring cylinder cover boot
Torn? Should not have been expensive.

Outside of the canopy, the parts should come to $100 or less on Shanghi dock. Canopy itself, I thought was more than $100. I will check what I have, tonight.


<font color="blue"> The nearest dealer to me is over 200 miles away and where I picked up the tractor was only about 100 miles away, that is why I did what I did.
</font>

Did you consider using Tractor Outlet or similiar type dealer. Fairly sure they keep a good stock of parts stateside, and could of had it delivered to the same location, or closer. They can supply technical support, in English /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif It would have been more expensive, though.

<font color="blue"> As for any spare parts, they did send filters, some gaskets, and some spare glow plugs. I did think that was great, but does not make up for the missing and broken parts.
</font>
no, those are just the toolbox parts. I am talking about other spare parts. Sounds like you didn't get them. They might not bother with single tractor purchases, anymore.

I am pretty sure you frequented the CTOA board, prior to your purchase. If not, that explains allot. Anyone reading this, should be aware that this is common, and if you can't deal with it, don't import them. Buy from a dealer, with the correct support that YOU need.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

So John,
Let me get this straight. You say anyone who imports Chinese tractors should expect them to come in with several problems???? /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif This makes no sense to me at all. These tractors are sold all over the world, and if every where they are being sold had the same kind of problems that mine did I don't think they sell many.

Yes I did go to the CTOA BBS for a few months before I purchased the tractor. I saw very few problems like I had. shown on the site. Also I know very few of the parts were critical to operate the tractor, but the cast manifold was and it was broken, and the parts for the backhoe were and they did not even come with the tractor.

You make it sound as though when you search out a good deal you should expect to get screwed. I don't aggree with that either. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

I know that when you spend several thousands of dollars, you should get what you pay for, and not a whole lot of excuses. Also I forgot about the broken fuel tank float. That was just another broken part.

I know that several of my neighbors have been by to see the tractor, and now they want nothing to do with Chinese ttractors, do to the problems they have seen with mine. I guess you would say that they also are stupid for expecting so much huh....

I did get a writteh reciept from CBP showing all of the parts that I ordered. That made know difference at all to Steve with CBP.

You send CBP cash money and they send you #HIT in return.

You try and get it straighened out with them and you just get MORE #HIT /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

I would consider another broker, but never again CBP. NEVER /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

 

[JohnS]

<font color="blue"> So John,
Let me get this straight. You say anyone who imports Chinese tractors should expect them to come in with several problems???? This makes no sense to me at all. These tractors are sold all over the world, and if every where they are being sold had the same kind of problems that mine did I don't think they sell many. </font>
Anybody that imports these tractors, already knows about these issues, and is prepared to handle these problems, or has the items on hand, and calculate that into their pricing structure. Dealers will have the parts in the next order which might already be in process. Its a hard lesson you learned, during a one import tractor, but in could have been worse. If water was left in the block, with the container on the ship deck, and its voyage took it through freezing weather, how happy would you be then? Does that happen every shipment? No, Can it and has it? Yes. Most shipments there are minor issues, not significantly less than your issues. I try to warn others of such a risk, but many are still lured by the lower cost.

<font color="blue"> You make it sound as though when you search out a good deal you should expect to get screwed. I don't aggree with that either. </font>
You got a good $ deal, but you didn't understand what that meant, or why the price was so good. Wouldn't that be a clue with any other item you went to buy? If someone offered you a JD for 20% below what any dealer was going to give you, site unseen, would you just jump on it, or check it out?

<font color="blue"> I know that when you spend several thousands of dollars, you should get what you pay for, and not a whole lot of excuses. </font>
When you spend a couple thousand less than anyone else, you need to understand why?
When I spent several thousand dollars, for the same, I knew EXACTLY what could happen. Would I had been happy if there was a major issue? No. Whould I wine or blame the exporter? No, I would kick myself in the butt, for risking too much. Spending that kind of money, on importing for the first time, you should have asked specific questions about "what happens if there is shipping damage?" "what happens if there was missing or non-functioning parts?". What documents did you receive that told specificly any terms of the deal?

<font color="blue"> I did get a writteh reciept from CBP showing all of the parts that I ordered. </font>
It doesn't sound like the proforma invoice, but not sure.

<font color="blue"> I would consider another broker, but never again CBP. NEVER </font>
If went with another broker, and it happened again, would you blame that broker? or would that be enough for you to realize that what I say is true? Overall, even with the $500 charge, you are cost wise still ahead of the game.

PS: I don't have Shanghi pricing on the swivel seat mech or plate and misc parts. These are last years prices, rounded up to the nearest dollar, with the exporter I used: Sunshade $45, Cyl sleave $3, exhaust manifold $6, shaft $22, bearing $4, fuel bowl $3, hose $1, for a total of $84. The swivel mechanism is probably $20 or less. This is close to what CBP gave you. You are probably not on speaking terms with CBP, but you might be able to find someone else getting an order, and have the equivelent dollar amount of other parts (alternator, starter, a few other elec items) shipped. Would have to pay UPS from the person to you though. Anyhow, just a thought.

 

[SPIKER]

hi guys:

I'm not going to defend CBP or say that it's all their fault or blame the end user.

The problems that were/are being mentioned sounds to me like some shipping damage... Broken exhaust manifold!? that is normally pretty protected inside the shipping crate and inside the container. I didn't see how it was delivered was it a crate tractor??? I'm assuming so. the back hoe and FEl would have came in their own crates usually stacked on top of the tractor. The damage you are describing sounds like some joker with a fork lift caused it...

Is that something that a dealer would have fixed most definitely. is that something that CBP would fix I'm sure so the big problem was waiting the time needed to ship them. a dealer had them and the end user bought them... If you fix a part that FORD is supposed to warranty on you're own because FORD didn't have it that day and the auto parts store down the street did you buy it and fix it then expect FORD to PAY for it!? Not sure you would get very far!...

Anyway I know what you pay to CBP and a couple of other BROKERS for the tractors. needless to say you can buy a crate tractor from at least 5 other people/ "DEALERS who are state side" and get a deal that is with in $500 of the price you paid form them! Did you contact any of the dealers people recommended for price quotes? and once seeing a $500 dollar savings, go for the better deal? You saved on the initial purchase but got a tractor which was damaged in shipping. Was It a $500 worth of damage in parts no, not at dealers price or CBP price. They CBP shouldn't be getting the bad rap for not wanting to pay retail prices when they buy at whole sale.

I'm sure that if you had bought from PUMA MACHINE, BOLTON POWER, TRACTOR OUTLET or NORTHERN TOOL you would have gotten a tractor with all the parts, (when they shipped it out) as you ordered it. If it arrived with damage from freight carrier between them and you then that is the freight carriers responsibility but the parts more than likely would have been replaced at little or no cost to you. It is what dealers do for that $500.00 payment you didn't choose to make.

I worked with STEVE PUMA of PUMA MACHINE and even though not evey thing was 100% smooth (it was a big order I got 4 tractors 4 fel and 2 back hoes with several other implements too 2 tillers a finish mower & spare parts up the yazoo) I had some things damaged missing and or lost... Not my fault, not his fault it happens, did I get them pretty much the stuff I needed and wanted was there a few small items that I wanted wasn't there and not worth worrying about. wanted 10 extra filters, didn't even notice they weren't there and after finding them gone I never bothered even caring... I'm sure they ended up in a crate with some ones stuff... Yea for them. I got my tractor and have been really happy with it.


I ended up selling the other 3 2 ahead of time and one I assembled and sold to a local guy. I am still in contact with all 3 gents. and had a few items that were damaged in shipping that steve puma replaced yes it took a while to receive the parts. I could have went to one of the big dealers of JINMA tractors and had parts shipped a few days later got them. I wouldn't have expected steve puma to pay for it though... If I had bought it I would have paid for it and been done with it. I will order more tractors from him for sure and was going to this spring, sell my 1 year old one and have a brand new one, my plans didn't work out because of a major lay off and $ was/is too tight. Will I be able to next spring I hope so! will I have problems ? maybe so maybe not... will expect to get 100% of the stuff I order ya, if I get 90% will I want the rest yes, and if it is a part that is 100% needed I may buy a part from a big dealer near by and have a new one sent out for a spare, if it takes 90+ days so be it.

yes you're tractor was damaged, did CBP cause it? I doubt it. Would they have fixed it? 95% sure they would have. Would it have taken a while? probably so... Would I have gone into the deal expecting problems? no, but I would have been prepared for them knowing I was saving $500 over what the dealers were quoting. I would have talked to them about getting the needed parts from a state side location PRIOR to buying them, I'm sure CBP has some state side parts stored someplace and maybe would have even worked with a dealer that did have them... I think you may have jumped the gun a bit...

ANY HOW I'm done with my 2 cents worth...

I wish everyone all the luck and hope that others who want to go through the problems of importing a tractor will see what can happen and will learn from it. I'm sorry you got a badly damaged tractor delivered... It happens to dealers every now and again too. am I dealer NO am a person who would risk my hard earned money sending it over seas in todays high risk market place NO! I dealt with a guy state side who got me what I wanted with less risk than you took.

Hopefully people will listen to JohnS and you and me, the small amount of savings you gain from 1 tractor purchased direct from across the ocean is not worth it. Spend you money through a dealer and get some state side assurances.

Mark M /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif