Cheap FEL cylinders keep bending

[CH4Ohio]

Hitting mechanical stops before cylinder fully extended shouldn't cause this....infact you WANT the stops to be hit just shy of full extend.

I don't think so. Your cylinders should be able to travel freely and completely in both directions without hitting any solid stops. Otherwise you're constantly using your hydraulic system to stretch / stress metal rather than simply position your implement.

 

[LD1]

My view is that a hydraulic cylinder simply pushes 2 pins apart or pulls those 2 pins together, nothing more. If the cylinder rod buckles, it’s a sign that the rod is longer than it’s diameter supports, and/or that the extend pressure is excessive.

Cannot speak for this particular loader....but loaders arent new science. MOST manufactures use cylinders that can handle full hydraulic pressure even at full extent.

Its not about too much hydraulic pressure/force.

But rather when an outside force acts upon the cylinder......like back dragging with the loader curled down. There are literally dozens of posts on this forum of that exact same thing happening with only a stock bucket. now you add on a LONGER bucket and it is much easier to do.

If one were to take a hydraulic pressure gauge and TEE into the curl circuit....and replicate back dragging with the bucket dumped....you could easily see pressure spikes in excess of 5000 psi. Which is about double what that cylinder is ever designed for and double what the tractors hydraulics are capable of. I think THAT is the problem here.

 

[Cycledude]

 

[LD1]

I don't think so. Your cylinders should be able to travel freely and completely in both directions without hitting any solid stops. Otherwise you're constantly using your hydraulic system to stretch / stress metal rather than simply position your implement.

You can easily test your theory.

Take one of your curl cylinders off the bucket and extend it fully. Measure it. Put it back on and dump the loader until it hits the stops. You will find the cylinder did NOT extend all the way.

On tractors, this is curl only. keeps you from blowing the gland cap out of the cylinder. Dumping a heavy load while raised (like dumping into a dump truck) the weight of the material in the bucket and the speed of dump when it comes to an abrupt stop, the piston inside the cylinder constantly hammering against the gland cap and trying to escape.....it wont take long and it will be free.

There is mechanical stress/stretch on the loader anytime the hydraulics are used. They are designed for it.

 

[DK35vince]

Unless they were already compromised by attempting to backdrag with that big bucket already.

See my post above

Possibility

 

[RickB]

Cannot speak for this particular loader....but loaders arent new science. MOST manufactures use cylinders that can handle full hydraulic pressure even at full extent.

Exactly, and also partially extended.

 

[LD1]

Pivots are missing according to parts diagram.

View attachment 721447

In my own quest to try and figure out if the loader was supposed to have those pivots, I too pulled up the parts diagram.

IMO, that photo is just a stock photo they use as a parts diagram for different loaders as well.

Notice the near side loader arm does NOT show those pivots, and there are NO part numbers assigned to those pivots either.
So that in combination of videos I found on masseys site, as well as all the other pictures of tractors for sale....I think its safe to say that the loader is assembled correctly....and that they just use this same main boom for different loader combinations, some of which "MAY" use the pivots.

That seems alot more reasonable to me than dozens of dealers assembling wrong and leaving parts out, including videos on masseys own website

 

[RickB]

It is cheaper and easier to eliminate the 4 link feature and extend the bucket cylinders while retaining the same boom for use (probably) on lower spec loaders.
Putting the boom part number in a 'where used' search may be helpful.

 

[ptsg]

It is cheaper and easier to eliminate the 4 link feature and extend the bucket cylinders while retaining the same boom for use (probably) on lower spec loaders.
Putting the boom part number in a 'where used' search may be helpful.

The issue is when the manufacturers decide to increase the rod length without increasing the rod diameter instead of increasing the length of the spacer welded on the back of the cylinder.

 

[LD1]

The issue is when the manufacturers decide to increase the rod length without increasing the rod diameter instead of increasing the length of the spacer welded on the back of the cylinder.

Yup. It is indeed poor engineering.

But the question is still whether it is acceptable.

As the current loader sits, with the rod extended in lieu of the linkages or lengthening the back of the cylinder.....is it still "enough" to handle the full column load.

Id really like to know:
1. The rod diameter
2. The length of the rod when fully extended (included the extension part)
3. The bore of the cylinder
4. The tractors operating pressure.

With the bore and operating pressure it is easy to calculate the force that the tractors hydraulics can exert on the cylinder
With the Rod diameter and Rod length, it is easy to calculate its buckling strength.

If its within spec....while not a great design...I think the MFG is covered and can chalk it up to operator error.
If it is NOT within spec....I think there is a great case to get massey or the dealer to eat the cost of replacing the cylinders.....then upgrade asap.

I believe the owner of the tractor mentioned on the AR15 site that they were 1.25" rod diameters.
With that rod diameter and rod lenght @:
16" = 17,670# column load
18" = 12,690 #
20" = 10780 #
24" = 8050 #
28" = 6240 #
30" = 5550 #

If the tractor is 2500psi:
50mm cylinder = 7680#
2" cylinder = 7853#
55mm cylinder = 9206#
2.25" cylinder = 9940#
60mm cylinder = 10,957#
2.5" cylinder = 12,271#
65mm cylinder = 12,858

Wish I had more info on that loader cylinder......