CK 25 will not start

gravel13 · Oct 7, 2018

I was saying to my dad, who was my extra hand when needed, that when I gave it throttle from idle it almost had a little stumble at first. My sleeves didn't have any index marks on them per say, but on the bottom of them on one side was slightly different than the other side which corresponded to the ones that came out. So I put the new ones in that way. I was wondering if they moved slightly while trying to reinstall. The idle did seem stable with no stumble or anything, just that I couldn't get it to idle below 1000 and it may also just have been me that thought when stepping on the accelerator pedal that it had a little stumble at first not a continuous one. I just kept thinking that after reading where the lever for the control rack in was supposed to be on the outer side of the fork lever as in this pic

in which it would have to have been almost all the way to the left when installing whereas I had it kind of in the middle of the slot of the pump. Also, is there any trick to keeping everything lined up when installing back into the pump? It just seemed like there was a lot of "slop" while trying to insert everything back up into the pump so I'm not sure something didn't move a tooth off. I wish my pump had a "cut out" at the rail so I could see the marks like this pump

ritcheyvs · Oct 7, 2018

Well, if it starts, runs, and stops (with SS) you can't be too far off. It's unfortunate that your new sleeves didn't have index marks. Mine idles a little faster with new sleeves but that's no problem for my gear transmission. Is the high idle causing a problem? The idle position is set by the balance of the throttle springs on arm 2 and the centrifugal governor. Arm 1 and 2 should be full forward when the engine is stopped (from the springs) and you pretty much must install the IP with the rack centered to get it through the hole. So I don't think you did anything wrong there. If it were me, I think I'd just use it as is unless the high idle causes a problem. To slow it down, you'd reduce the spring pressure from the throttle springs on arm 2. Not sure there is an adjustment for that. and don't have time to research.

gravel13 · Oct 7, 2018

Ok. Don't worry about researching as I don't want to get into spring pressure adjustments as with my luck I'd make it worse. The high idle isn't a problem that I can foresee, it's just that anything that is different from what it was caught me be surprise. It does start, run and stop (with the SS) so I guess like you said it can't be too far off. Hopefully that doesn't cause any issues down the road. I too have a gear model. I just wasn't sure if there was a way to make sure the sleeves were index properly while trying to reassemble as once I inserted it up into the pump if something moved I wouldn't have known, as I inserted it as a complete assembly or was I supposed to insert the sleeve then the plunger, spring, etc.. I just don't think I could get the sleeve up inside without doing it as a complete assembly.

thepumpguysc · Oct 7, 2018

The new gear either has a dot or a chamfered tooth..
they are hard to see when they're down inside the pump bore..
A flash lite is A MUST..
I've gone so far as to mark the chamfered tooth w/ "white out".. so its easier to see..
I hope that helps.. TPG

Fuggley · Oct 8, 2018

hummm.... looks about right to me. I think your idle speed is correct too. Here’s a pic of mine before I fixed the twisted governor springs and a book pic of a correct setup, can’t see from your photo what is much different. Good job.

thepumpguysc · Oct 8, 2018

I just re-read your post about assembling it as a whole assembly..
U put the gear in, aligning the dot or chamfered tooth w/ the line on the rack..
Then u put in the spring seat, followed by the spring..
Then u put in the plunger, making sure its going the correct way, WITH the spring seat attached to the plunger.
Then the shim & tappet.. then the tappet keeper pin, then the pin keeper "band"..
Its assembled piece by piece..{except the plunger & spring seat}.. NOT as an assembly..

gravel13 · Oct 8, 2018

thepumpguysc said:
I just re-read your post about assembling it as a whole assembly..
U put the gear in, aligning the dot or chamfered tooth w/ the line on the rack..
Then u put in the spring seat, followed by the spring..
Then u put in the plunger, making sure its going the correct way, WITH the spring seat attached to the plunger.
Then the shim & tappet.. then the tappet keeper pin, then the pin keeper "band"..
Its assembled piece by piece..{except the plunger & spring seat}.. NOT as an assembly..

BINGO!

I took it all apart today and sure enough they were off slightly, each one about 2 teeth, I was putting the control sleeve in how the old one came out but keeping everything together but I would have to wiggle it a little to get the control sleeve to fit the rail and that is how the control sleeve teeth moved from the mark on the rail, and this time I did as you just described and I was able to find the index mark on the control sleeve. Put it all back together and when it started it idles just like before and no stumble or excessive smoke. It works great for now. Thank you everyone for all your help and comments.

thepumpguysc · Oct 8, 2018

Good deal.!!! Happy to help.. I'm glad u took the time to re-do it, correctly.. Happy tractoring.. TPG

ritcheyvs · Oct 9, 2018

Minor technique variation when I did mine. I started with the plunger inserted in the cylinder and then slid the gear (control sleeve) over the plunger shaft and aligned the dot (they were dots in my case) with the line on the rack. Like TPGSC said, you really need a good flashlight to see these gear marks (love those new mini LCD jobs). Then I put the spring and keeper on the plunger shaft by withdrawing the plunger just enough to slip the "keyhole" over the end of the shaft. The flats on the shaft were always in the control sleeve which was still engaged in the rack. I don't recall if it is possible to see the gear dots with the spring in place.

In any case, congrats to Gravel.

thepumpguysc · Oct 9, 2018

No, you cant see the gear w/the spring in place.
Heck, once u put the spring seat in place, you cant see..
I do about 5-6 of these pumps every month.. & you REALLY have to be confident that u hit the mark, EVERY TIME..
My process is, I put ALL the gears in at once..
..then I double & triple check them w/ a lite.. then once I'm SURE, absolutely SURE.. then & only then, the rest goes in..