CK30 HST Alternator

Alien · Jan 9, 2019

My alternator light is glowing. Not charging.
I tried removing the alternator but the lower pivot (main bolt) is too long to remove without removing the radiator which is a massive task.
Anyone else struck this?
Only just over 600 hours on this thing. Normally an alternator lasts a bit longer than that.

Alien · Jan 9, 2019

I removed the 4 main radiator rubber grommet mounting bolts (12mm) and the 5 (on each side) 10mm. Then I slid the main mounting plates up and out and this allowed the radiator to move enough so that I could (barely) lift the alternator out with the main pivot bolt still in the Alternator.

Not even sure the alternator is a repairable one yet as there is no external voltage regulator.

There is a metal label on the Alt that says, I.C. Reg. Built in. It is a Valeo brand.
Not looking good.
I undid the 4 body bolts and even tapping with a knock stick it won't come apart. I will persevere.....

DLTTrekkers · Jan 10, 2019

1can you remove the bracket that mounts the altenator to the engineblock ?
Thats how I remove the altenator from the CS2610

Alien · Jan 10, 2019

DLTT . As above , I managed to remove the half brackets on each side of the radiator which allowed just enough movement so I was able to remove the alternator with the main bolt in situ, without scratching the radiator.
That other bracket that is attached underneath doesn't come off as it is part of the motor and has a gasket behind it. (I tried that)

Alien · Jan 10, 2019

It was a mess. Cleaned it all up but I think the reg itself is cactus.

Threepoint · Jan 10, 2019

Very nice job with the cleanup! Good luck with this. Please keep us posted.

DK35vince · Jan 10, 2019

Looks like it was dug out of a mudhole.

Alien · Jan 10, 2019

Yes, i am totally mystified as to why the brushes were such a mess. Where did the goo come from? The motor has no oil or coolant leaks whatsoever. I have it running again but unfortunately I am suffering a back injury at present and can not follow up until I heal. Flat on my bed at present.

.

Lockport · Jan 11, 2019

Good luck

with that. Keep us posted.

xcgreene · Jan 11, 2019

Strange amount of gunk on those slip rings. Even if that bearing seal failed and grease leaked out still would not account for all of that. Impressive sized slip rings though.

Hope you and your alternator feel better soon.

Kioti Paul · Jan 11, 2019

I think (maybe) that gunk was actually ground up brushes and slip ring. I have absolutely no experience with Valeo alternators, but I have worked quite a bit on Delco, Autolite, Prestolite, Motorola, many with 100,000 miles +, and I have never seen such wear on slip rings! I have seen such wear on generator brushes & commutators, and it is a very similar amount of gunk build up, albeit off to the side, not right where the brushes ride.

As deep as those grooves are, apparently it is not unusual for Valeo, and there still can be a lot of wear left - although if they got that way in 600 hrs, what chance do the slip rings have of making it another 600 hrs?

Again, I didn't even know Valeo alternators existed, but a search of YouTube, turned up several videos of repairs of Valeo alternators, and it seems brush (& slip ring) wear is a common problem for them.

Below is a link to a video from a person who clearly has a lot of expertise with them! He has posted several videos covering different repairs. Pretty interesting.

Valeo alternator repair part 2 slipring change. - YouTube

EDIT: kind of a long video,, old worn slip rings shown 1:00 minute into video; new slip rings shown at 15:00 minutes.

Sorry to hear about your back injury. Hoping you recover soon!

Alien · Jan 11, 2019

Thanks guys. As a matter of interest....
I have done some research and alternators range in price from near $300 US and up. Not really available here. I still have some tests to do. I suspect the copper/carbon buildup shorted the regulator between the slip rings. When my back inproves I will be able to investigate further. The fuse is OK.
Now, apparently an alternator off a Mazda B2000 will fit straight on and it is only about Au$57.00!!
I still need to double check this before I proceed but it may be the solution. It is also a 50 Amp.

Kioti Paul

That does not appear to be wear on the slip rings. It appears to be machined grooves. I haven't seen that before either but the edges are too clean and sharp to be worn away especially in the bottom of the groove. I looked hard at that. (yes it is unusual)
Luckily the retaining pin holes were still in the brushes so I was able to get them back in safely without damaging them but not sure how they will come out 'next time'.
Thanks for the vid. I will watch it later today.

Avondale · Jan 11, 2019

I would be very interested in knowing of any common parts fit these machines. I am not having any issues right now (2250 hrs on my DK35), but if I did, it would be good to know what other options might be available.

Alien · Feb 25, 2019

Back again and the operative word is BACK. I have been out of commission so only just managed to get back to my Kioti today.
Yesterday I called in to see my neighbour who has a number of wrecked cars lying around. 2 of those happened to be 1980 series Ford Lasers
One had the alternator removed so I did a comparison and it looked promising. Slightly larger diameter but the brackets were pretty much the same.
It was also a 60 Amp rather than a 50 Amp like the original.
Neighbour told me it came off his car and it had been working OK and I couldn't argue as he gave it to me for nothing.

I had to extend the Sensor and Warning Light wires and fit the earth wire from the original. The Main Battery wire I had to remove the silly big connector and fit a normal insulated washer and nut.

The only other mod was the bottom main bolt goes in from the rear instead of the front and had to be shortened 1" The Ford had a thread in the front bracket where there was none in the original. Much better as you don't have to loosen the radiator stays to get the alternator on and off now.
Incidentally it is a Mitsubishi brand Alternator. It also has an internal regulator.
The pulley was also the correct size but I could have used a slightly longer fan belt. It would have been easier to put on.

I found the reason for the goo in the old one. Not easy to see, but the Oil Cooler in front of the radiator has been seeping at the top pipe on the RHS. The fan has been dragging the oil back through the radiator and into the alternator. As I said, It is hard to see unless you have good light and have your glasses on.

Anyway, all working well. It's charging at 13.8 volts.

Ranchofla · Feb 26, 2019

Alien said:
Back again and the operative word is BACK. I have been out of commission so only just managed to get back to my Kioti today.
Yesterday I called in to see my neighbour who has a number of wrecked cars lying around. 2 of those happened to be 1980 series Ford Lasers
One had the alternator removed so I did a comparison and it looked promising. Slightly larger diameter but the brackets were pretty much the same.
It was also a 60 Amp rather than a 50 Amp like the original.
Neighbour told me it came off his car and it had been working OK and I couldn't argue as he gave it to me for nothing.

I had to extend the Sensor and Warning Light wires and fit the earth wire from the original. The Main Battery wire I had to remove the silly big connector and fit a normal insulated washer and nut.

The only other mod was the bottom main bolt goes in from the rear instead of the front and had to be shortened 1" The Ford had a thread in the front bracket where there was none in the original. Much better as you don't have to loosen the radiator stays to get the alternator on and off now.
Incidentally it is a Mitsubishi brand Alternator. It also has an internal regulator.
The pulley was also the correct size but I could have used a slightly longer fan belt. It would have been easier to put on.

I found the reason for the goo in the old one. Not easy to see, but the Oil Cooler in front of the radiator has been seeping at the top pipe on the RHS. The fan has been dragging the oil back through the radiator and into the alternator. As I said, It is hard to see unless you have good light and have your glasses on.

Anyway, all working well. It's charging at 13.8 volts.

Nice work and good write up on what you had to modify to get it to work.

Ranchoi

Amvcane · Feb 26, 2019

Excellent, glad you got it all sorted out. Thank you for reporting back with some very useful info.

Alien · Feb 27, 2019

I should point out that the original Valeo alternator had double raced bearings at each end. It was a well made alternator but just far too expensive.
I can't see a problem with having normal bearings as it has a normal V belt and no more load than a normal car motor.
This alternator was obviously made in the same factory as a lot of casting and design was virtually identical.
Just to ease some minds. I do have to wrap insulation around the extended wiring to protect it.

VictorW · Feb 27, 2019

I couldn't find the post but a year or so earlier, a member posted about using an alternator from a mitsubushi vehicle. He actually found a part number somehow and bought a new one at a auto parts store. He just had to make a few changes like you and it worked fine.