CK30HS vs Kubota L2800

[MessickFarmEqu]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Neil If the specs where taken for breakout at different points , the customer has no way of knowing this, ill hand you that. )</font>

Its published, you just have to know what your looking at. If you see anything that says "pivot pin" a red flag should go up.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( both machines use the same 3 point implements , brush hogs,mowers,rakes because of similar pto hp 24 to 23. )</font>

I would not say so, the grand L series machines will pull a 72" rotary cutter with no problem. A CK30/TC29/L3400 all would have a heck of a time moving such a moster around. The HP is there, but the machine are physicaly too small to really do it right. Same story with a backhoes, the grand L's will handle a 9 foot hoe with no problem, that would be too big for the smaller tractors.

The L3130 / L3430 are odd balls, they are way more tractor than most anything else in their HP class. The simularities really end at the engine HP, beyond that its more tractor is just about every way.

Talking to a good dealer is really the best way to sort these things out. Someone who is a shiester will use the confusion to their advantage, a good dealer will educate you about what your buying will explain how it works.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Neil If the specs where taken for breakout at different points , the customer has no way of knowing this, ill hand you that. )</font>

Its published, you just have to know what your looking at. If you see anything that says "pivot pin" a red flag should go up.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( both machines use the same 3 point implements , brush hogs,mowers,rakes because of similar pto hp 24 to 23. )</font>

I would not say so, the grand L series machines will pull a 72" rotary cutter with no problem. A CK30/TC29/L3400 all would have a heck of a time moving such a moster around. The HP is there, but the machine are physicaly too small to really do it right. Same story with a backhoes, the grand L's will handle a 9 foot hoe with no problem, that would be too big for the smaller tractors.

The L3130 / L3430 are odd balls, they are way more tractor than most anything else in their HP class. The simularities really end at the engine HP, beyond that its more tractor is just about every way.

Talking to a good dealer is really the best way to sort these things out. Someone who is a shiester will use the confusion to their advantage, a good dealer will educate you about what your buying will explain how it works.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

<font color="blue">
Talking to a good dealer is really the best way to sort these things out. Someone who is a shiester will use the confusion to their advantage, a good dealer will educate you about what your buying will explain how it works. </font>

Neil, how is a newbie supposed to know if the dealer is a good dealer or a shiester? I classify dealer knoweldge into 3 groupings based on the dealers I have personally talked with.
A) Good dealers who know the difference and EXPLAIN it to customers.
B) Stupid dealers how honestly do not know the difference and are just as confused as a newbie.
C) Dishonest dealers who use the numbers to their advantage to confuse buyers.

This may be hijacking the thread a little bit, but there are discussions on how to qualify dealers, but none of them discuss the shiester dealers. Most concentrate on making sure the dealership has the facilities, staff and resources. I've actually been shocked by reading that some dealers don't have people who can do hydraulic repairs or welding on their staff. OMG! How can they repair a tractor in a timely manner if they have to send out their hydraulics or their welding jobs? I don't think people need to go to Mega-Dealers (like yours /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif ) but the dealer should have at least one or two full time parts guys, the shop should be a nice size with several qualified diesel mechanics and the ability to make hydraulic hoses, bend hydraulic pipe, set fittings, etc. There should be at least the basics in metal working tools, grinders, welders, etc. I prefer a dealer who has a mobile service truck to do some repairs in the field. Any other thoughts?

 

[Bob_Skurka]

<font color="blue">
Talking to a good dealer is really the best way to sort these things out. Someone who is a shiester will use the confusion to their advantage, a good dealer will educate you about what your buying will explain how it works. </font>

Neil, how is a newbie supposed to know if the dealer is a good dealer or a shiester? I classify dealer knoweldge into 3 groupings based on the dealers I have personally talked with.
A) Good dealers who know the difference and EXPLAIN it to customers.
B) Stupid dealers how honestly do not know the difference and are just as confused as a newbie.
C) Dishonest dealers who use the numbers to their advantage to confuse buyers.

This may be hijacking the thread a little bit, but there are discussions on how to qualify dealers, but none of them discuss the shiester dealers. Most concentrate on making sure the dealership has the facilities, staff and resources. I've actually been shocked by reading that some dealers don't have people who can do hydraulic repairs or welding on their staff. OMG! How can they repair a tractor in a timely manner if they have to send out their hydraulics or their welding jobs? I don't think people need to go to Mega-Dealers (like yours /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif ) but the dealer should have at least one or two full time parts guys, the shop should be a nice size with several qualified diesel mechanics and the ability to make hydraulic hoses, bend hydraulic pipe, set fittings, etc. There should be at least the basics in metal working tools, grinders, welders, etc. I prefer a dealer who has a mobile service truck to do some repairs in the field. Any other thoughts?

 

[albmn10]

Bob, you said that Kubota does not submit any of their tractors to the Nebraska tests.. I just looked up on yahoo under " the Nebraska test laboratory " and indeed they have submitted tractors to their testing. They submitted 4 tractors, and yes they may be utility, but all 4 failed to meet their stated capacities..And the failed capacities are still on the Kubota web sight. ( look up the m9000 3 point lifts as an example ). Not trying to hijack the thread but a few months ago this thread was in the main discussion room. Perhaps someone can find it for us. Im trying not to judge, and its fine that you and Niel promote your tractor brands, both of you have interests in Kubota and New holland, thats no secret here, but ironically you dont seem to have as much input in your own brand rooms when these tractors have their problems, and they certainly have had their share of issues. Bob, its also fine that you dont prefer after market loaders, but ironically it was a large Kubota dealership by me who recomended the Woods loaders to me, he preferred them to the Kubota loaders. As did my Kioti dealer, and its done everything i have asked of it.

 

[albmn10]

Bob, you said that Kubota does not submit any of their tractors to the Nebraska tests.. I just looked up on yahoo under " the Nebraska test laboratory " and indeed they have submitted tractors to their testing. They submitted 4 tractors, and yes they may be utility, but all 4 failed to meet their stated capacities..And the failed capacities are still on the Kubota web sight. ( look up the m9000 3 point lifts as an example ). Not trying to hijack the thread but a few months ago this thread was in the main discussion room. Perhaps someone can find it for us. Im trying not to judge, and its fine that you and Niel promote your tractor brands, both of you have interests in Kubota and New holland, thats no secret here, but ironically you dont seem to have as much input in your own brand rooms when these tractors have their problems, and they certainly have had their share of issues. Bob, its also fine that you dont prefer after market loaders, but ironically it was a large Kubota dealership by me who recomended the Woods loaders to me, he preferred them to the Kubota loaders. As did my Kioti dealer, and its done everything i have asked of it.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

Then this must be a new development for Kubota to have their tractors in the Nebraska testing. They had previously taken a company stand not to submit their tractors. I guess I will be revisiting the Nebraska tests. As recent as a year ago I stated I would not buy a larger Kubota because they are not tested in the Nebraska tests. I've been considering taking over the farming of land that I lease out to a farmer and this year is that last year he is farming the property so I will need another machine if I take over the fields. For an agricultural machine, I won't buy a machine that does not test submit to the Nebraska tests. It should be noted that it is very rare for the Nebraska tests to find a tractor that meets all the claims of the manufacturer as most tractors are found lacking in a couple points.

As for the loaders, I have no real problem with an aftermarket loader, although I prefer OEM. HOWEVER the reality is that the CK30 with a curved arm loader is a nice machine, it has good forward visibility, and you can clearly see in my writings that I strongly favor sloped hoods and low profile curved loaders. They are faster, safer and more accurate to use, therefore more efficient. I will gladly give up a modest amount of capacity to pick up the added benefit of the curved arm loaders. So while you think I have something against the Woods loader, what I have is something against the old dog-leg loaders. And remember, I own both types of loaders so I've made real world comparisons.

As far as where I post, it is all over the forum. If you look at this thread, you will see my assessment of the CK30, L2800 and L3400 and you will see that I trashed the L2800, was lukewarm about the L3400 and complimented the CK30. It was actually a Koiti owner who suggested that Jeff not buy the Kioti 130 loader. Further, I did not comment on an L3130 until after Jeff asked how it compared. You will also notice that I only discussed the CNH product after it was already mentioned in a prior post so I simply responded to it. You will also notice I suggested the Rhino curved arm loader as a possibility, but as it is brand new, it is yet unproven. To my mind, the Rhino on the CK30 might be a good choice, and could be far better than the Woods, simply because of the benefits offered by the better design. But also I believe you will find my posts in this thread to be informative, non-confrontational, and pretty brand neutral (except where I state my personal opinons) so I'm not so sure why you are being so defensive and thinking I am pushing my brand, but really I'm just trying to discuss tractors objectively.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

Then this must be a new development for Kubota to have their tractors in the Nebraska testing. They had previously taken a company stand not to submit their tractors. I guess I will be revisiting the Nebraska tests. As recent as a year ago I stated I would not buy a larger Kubota because they are not tested in the Nebraska tests. I've been considering taking over the farming of land that I lease out to a farmer and this year is that last year he is farming the property so I will need another machine if I take over the fields. For an agricultural machine, I won't buy a machine that does not test submit to the Nebraska tests. It should be noted that it is very rare for the Nebraska tests to find a tractor that meets all the claims of the manufacturer as most tractors are found lacking in a couple points.

As for the loaders, I have no real problem with an aftermarket loader, although I prefer OEM. HOWEVER the reality is that the CK30 with a curved arm loader is a nice machine, it has good forward visibility, and you can clearly see in my writings that I strongly favor sloped hoods and low profile curved loaders. They are faster, safer and more accurate to use, therefore more efficient. I will gladly give up a modest amount of capacity to pick up the added benefit of the curved arm loaders. So while you think I have something against the Woods loader, what I have is something against the old dog-leg loaders. And remember, I own both types of loaders so I've made real world comparisons.

As far as where I post, it is all over the forum. If you look at this thread, you will see my assessment of the CK30, L2800 and L3400 and you will see that I trashed the L2800, was lukewarm about the L3400 and complimented the CK30. It was actually a Koiti owner who suggested that Jeff not buy the Kioti 130 loader. Further, I did not comment on an L3130 until after Jeff asked how it compared. You will also notice that I only discussed the CNH product after it was already mentioned in a prior post so I simply responded to it. You will also notice I suggested the Rhino curved arm loader as a possibility, but as it is brand new, it is yet unproven. To my mind, the Rhino on the CK30 might be a good choice, and could be far better than the Woods, simply because of the benefits offered by the better design. But also I believe you will find my posts in this thread to be informative, non-confrontational, and pretty brand neutral (except where I state my personal opinons) so I'm not so sure why you are being so defensive and thinking I am pushing my brand, but really I'm just trying to discuss tractors objectively.

 

[KiotiJohn]

This discussion, as so many, has simply become a technical fight. All you need to do is go see the few tractors you're interested in, try them out with implements on, and see which one you like the best and can get the best deal on.

Most of the loader capacities will probably be sufficient for most of your uses unless you're going commercial and really need a lot more lift, in which case, you might not need a compact tractor anyway.

John

 

[KiotiJohn]

This discussion, as so many, has simply become a technical fight. All you need to do is go see the few tractors you're interested in, try them out with implements on, and see which one you like the best and can get the best deal on.

Most of the loader capacities will probably be sufficient for most of your uses unless you're going commercial and really need a lot more lift, in which case, you might not need a compact tractor anyway.

John