CK30HST Wiring Disconnected

[LeTempt]

Gittyup,

I am not sure I understand what you suggest I try with the relays, can you describe how to check this?

Thanks,
Jeff
Enterprise, AL

CK30HST...how with 10 hours on the hour meter (it came with 6 from the dealer)

 

[MichiganIron]

Jeff,

We can get you the color coding tomorrow at the shop. You are getting signal voltage to the relays, we need to check if you are getting base voltage on the relay. The base is constant, and should be at the relay without signal voltage.

Our guess is that you do not have base voltage at the relays. Both relays being bad is unlikely.

We'll give you the color coding for the base voltage wires tomorrow.

 

[MichiganIron]

Jeff,

The base voltage wires at the relays are green. The Orange and Brown are signal voltage.

If you don't have base voltage at the relays, check for voltage next at the fuse box. You may just have a loose harness plug. If you start at the fusebox, we should be able to pinpoint the disconnect.

Hope this helps.

 

[Gittyup]

Gittyup,

I am not sure I understand what you suggest I try with the relays, can you describe how to check this?

Thanks,
Jeff
Enterprise, AL

CK30HST...how with 10 hours on the hour meter (it came with 6 from the dealer)

MichiganIron is talking about the same thing. Since they have access to documentation and more specific experience with the particulars, I'll stop guessing. They'll get you straightened out. Probably is something simple like a loose connection.

But, in general on relays: There are at least two "signals" to each relay. One is the signal being switched by the relay (the power to your headlights in this case). The other is the control signal that causes the relay to switch open and closed. Sometimes the control signal is a lower voltage, like say 5 Volts. Sometimes it's the same, like 12 V. The dash light switch initiates the control voltage to the relay causing the relay to close, thereby sending the 12 V to your headlights. One of the reasons that relays are used is because they can handle much higher currents than small switches. They also add a layer of safety. To verify a relay is bad, both are tested. if you want to understand better, get the manufacturer's number off of the relay and do a google search. You should be able to find the schematic for it on-line. A lot of times it is printed right on the relay too......... Long story. Too much information, I know.

 

[LeTempt]

Jeff,

The base voltage wires at the relays are green. The Orange and Brown are signal voltage.

If you don't have base voltage at the relays, check for voltage next at the fuse box. You may just have a loose harness plug. If you start at the fusebox, we should be able to pinpoint the disconnect.

Hope this helps.

Michigan Iron,

Thanks for the additional troubleshooting information, I REALLY appreciate your help!!!

I checked the base voltage (green wires) at the relays and have no voltage when the headlight switch is the on position (low or high beam). With the headlight switch off (and even with the key turned off) there is about 7 volts at the green wires on the relays. I ran a jumper wire from the negative terminal on the battery to the relay mounting tab just to make absolutely sure I had a good ground and that made no difference.

I do have 12 volts at the fuse box on all fuses and all of the fuses are good.

Once again, I appreciate your assistance with this. I am getting more help from you guys than I am getting from the dealer where I purchased the tractor. They are willing to try to fix the problem, but I would have to drive 4 hours one way for them to just find a loose wire (I hope) or I might have to leave the tractor for them to work on and have to go back and get it once they get it figured out. I explained to them that I am mechanically inclined (I am a licensed A&P aircraft mechanic) and grew up on a farm, but they do not seem to be interested in assisting ME with fixing the problem to save me many hours on the road (and about $150 in gas per round trip).

I actually could have used the headlights last night. We were out at the property putting the tractor to work digging and pulling trees and was having so much fun that I did not want to quite when it got dark. With about 4 hours of work on the machine I am impressed so far. Had a minor hydraulic leak at one of the quick disconnects on the loader, but it (hopefully) was just a loose fitting. I will find out this weekend!!

Looking forward to more advice on what might be causing the headlight problem. THANKS in advance!!!

Jeff
Enterprise, AL
Kioti CK30HST....10 hours on the hour meter (it came with 6)!!

 

[MichiganIron]

Jeff,

A couple of thoughts:

You should have 12v at the base terminals with the switch off. You stated you have 7. Check both sides of the fusebox and also change the fuse, even if it looks ok. The relays are obvoiusly working for the voltage to drop when the signal terminal is powered from the switch.

With both relays acting the same, the problem appears to be between the fusebox and the relays. Try a continuity check between the fuse holder and the base terminal on the relays. We want to make sure there isn't a problem with the harness.

Let us know what you find.

 

[LeTempt]

Michigan Iron,

This is just like school...the professor gives you homework!!

I did check the continuity of the fuse, but I will change it out just to rule out a simple fix. I also checked to ensure I had 12 volts on both sides of every fuse in the fuse box.

Just so I understand you correctly, I should have 12 volts at the base terminals (green wires on the relays) all the time regardless of the (headlight or ignition) switch position - right? If so, I think we have found out why the headlights are not working. Now we need to find the root cause of why the voltage is not what it should be.

I sure do hate buying new stuff that doesn't work as it is supposed to right out of the box, but I have enjoyed getting your advice!!

I will let you know what I find out tonight.

THANKS!!!

Jeff

 

[LeTempt]

Michigan Iron (a.k.a - the professor),

Changed out the fuse, no change.

Checked both sides of the fuse block on the 20 amp headlight/horn fuse (as well as both sides of every other fuse again) and had 12 volts.

Checked for contunity on the green wire running from the fuse box (green wire at the back of the 20 amp headlight/horn fuse) to the relays...NO GOOD. Then I disconnected the plug from both relays to double check continuity on the green wire (between the fuse box and both green wires at the relays) and it was not good (no suprise, but wanted to make sure I just had the wire isolated).

So I connected a jumper wire from the battery to the green wire on the front relay and turned the headlight switch on...nice bright headlights on both high and low beams. Then just for giggles I ran a jumper wire from the back of the 20 amp fuse box to the front relay green terminal and when I turned the switch on I got nice bright headlights on both low and high beams. It certainly does appear that the green wire that runs from the 20 amp fuse box to the relays is bad.

It does not look like there is any kind of plug between the fuse box and the relay, but it was dark and kind of cold (down to a cool 41 degrees in LA - Lower Alabama) and well it is almost past my bedtime. Is there any kind of plug between the fuse box and relay hidden in between the frame rails or under a panel that is not obvious?

I am feeling better now that I know what the problem is. I am kind of a neat freak and like things being the way they are supposed to be. Not sure I will be happy with just running another wire from the fuse box to the relays on a one week old tractor. How would you handle something like this on a brand new tractor?

Once again, I REALLY appreciate all your help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeff
Enterprise, AL
CK30HST

 

[Gittyup]

If there are no connectors in-line, examine the crimped on lugs at each end. One might be improperly crimped onto the insulation or damaged. If would be easy to cut them off and reterminate. Assuming you have enough length, it would be as good as new. It would be very unusual for the wire to have failed internally. But, worth checking before reterminating. Anyway, I'd at least demand from the dealer a new wire/cable.

 

[BTI]

Locate the green wire in the connector under the right side floor board.
You have to pop the little covers off of them to see the wire colors.
I think it is in the one with red tape on both ends.
They are shown in picture #1 you put up.
I'm betting when you pull apart the large connector you'll see the spade is not making contact.

I just went through this.
At the customers wish we wired around it with waterproof connectors and heat shrink.
Oh and lots of dielectric grease

BTI