Coolant Ph

[SRF34]

A friend was advising me to make sure the coolant Ph in my 1320 was a neutral 6.5-7. He commented that over time, if the Ph becomes too acidic, it can burn pinholes in the head or the block (cant remember which.) In searching the forums, some guys claim not to worry if the motor is sleeved. Any comments in general as well as on my specific motor?

 

[Soundguy]

Ya got 'half-correct' info.

Some diesel engines are prone to cavitation and or electrolysis issues. There are addatives which will prevent this, and most of them are calculated by adding a specific volume of addative to a specific amount of coolant, and a test strip is used to verify the concentration.. usually by ph. CNH makes an addative called fw-15 that does this.. etc. It's not that the coolant becomes acidic and etches the cylinder wall.. or sleave wall.. it is actually that cavitation causes the wall to erode.. the reason this happens is due to the vapor pressure of the coolant, and the vibrations from the cyl.. etc. ( very basic explanation )

I'm not sure if your machine has sleaves.. or if so.. if they are wet or dry. Check your manual to see if it calls for the addative.

Soundguy

 

[SteveInMD]

If you don't have the test strips to see if you need more FW-15 you can check the pH. 6.5 - 7 sounds low to me. What's the pH of fresh antifreeze?

 

[Doc_Bob]

I just got some diesel rated antifreeze and changed my antifreeze.
Easy to do for peace of mind.
Bob

 

[Soundguy]

I don't have a bottle in hand.. but if memory serves me.. the fw15 bottle states the proper ph to shoot for. Also.. check your manual. My 7610s manual tells exactly how many ounces of fw15 to mix with x gallons of water to make the correct strngth mix... etc.

soundguy

 

[VIEWQUEST]

What's your thought on using extended service antifreeze for a 5 year period?

 

[Soundguy]

I'd prefer to use regular stuff, with the fw15 added, and change out at intervals.. the ph may need to be modified before 5 ys.. as well as water pump lube.. and the electrolysis and corrosion inhibitors int he fw15 are likely time sensitive / used up.. etc..

Soundguy

 

[Turbys_1700]

My 1720 calls for anti-freeze maint. change out every year but does not state anytihing about using an anti-cavitation additive...I think that my unit holds 2 gallons of anti-freeze so cost is not a major issue...I use additives in my old F-250...They were prone to cavitate around teh 150K mile mark...You can go several routes here...Prestone and Zerex have anti-freeze that has additives already in the anti-freeze...My 03 F-350 had this anti-freexe in it from the factory and it does not need to be changed until 100K miles per factory maint. schedule...So, you could buy that and not worry about your levels...Another route would be to buy the FW-15 and add it to your anti-freeze...It doesn't take much for me to add to a small 2 galon capacity system...You can get the Fw-15 additive at your local Ford dealer...I bought the Winns equivalent at my local International truck dealer...Cheap stuff...I think that a 1 quart bottle treats like 50 galoon or so...Very cheap insurance...

 

[Farmwithjunk]

What's your thought on using extended service antifreeze for a 5 year period?

One of the factors involved in electraulysis/wet sleeve pitting is dirt in the cooling system. (improper Ph, cavitation, certain engines more proned than others, ect.) Prolonged use anti-freeze heightens the possibility of dirt/rust particles being allowed to stay in the cooling system. Particles of dirt or rust mixed with the coolant increase the rate at which cylinder walls are eroded. Drain, flush, re-fill with new anti-freeze, then treat. (I use a product sold by Fram) (SOME diesels even come with cooling system filters to reduce the likelyhood of dirt staying in the coolant.)

I've seen 3 engines destroyed by wet sleeve pitting. 2 were in less than 750 hours from NEW. Suddenly finding 2 or 3 gallons of coolant in the oil pan isn't a pretty sight. A few gallons of anti-freeze isn't a big investment compared to a new crankshaft.

 

[MikeD74T]

(SOME diesels even come with cooling system filters to reduce the likelyhood of dirt staying in the coolant.)QUOTE]

My workplace has two stationary 6cyl Cummins diesel fire pumps. They have coolant filters & the filters have disolvable chemicals in them to treat the coolant. MikeD74T

 

[Doc_Bob]

Some diesel engines are prone to cavitation and or electrolysis issues. There are addatives which will prevent this, and most of them are calculated by adding a specific volume of addative to a specific amount of coolant, and a test strip is used to verify the concentration.. usually by ph. CNH makes an addative called fw-15 that does this.. etc. It's not that the coolant becomes acidic and etches the cylinder wall.. or sleave wall.. it is actually that cavitation causes the wall to erode.. the reason this happens is due to the vapor pressure of the coolant, and the vibrations from the cyl.. etc. ( very basic explanation )

Soundguy

I have assumed that if I use an antifreeze made for diesel tractors that I do not have to be concerned about adding any additives. Does this make sense?
Bob

 

[AlanB]

While it makes sense, it is not neccessarily always true.

You need to read your particular brand / package of antifreeze and insure that you are using it correctly.

Even some brands, have different flavors of antifreeze that will be used in different manners, or need different additional add packs depending upon application.

Usually what you would be looking for are the words "fully Formulated" or With SCA (supplemental coolant additives)

Different manufacturerers get there different ways, and some manufacturers offer several ways within their own lines.

You may find this interesting reading.

Fleet Charge Frequently Asked Questions

 

[LRH]

My NH 1925 will be 10 years old in a few months and it has had the coolant changed at 2.5-3 year intervals, first time I used a good green; regular ethylene glycol coolant with a little SCA added (NAPACOOL). tested with the strips and it was on the strong side of normal. Next 2 times I used a pre-charged fleet type coolant and it was about normal on the test strips, added 2 oz SCA a year later to bring it from just the low side of normal range to the high side of normal. Changed it again last week and used the GO5 formula and as of yet I have not checked the readings (test strips expired) and do not know if the strips will even read 100% correctly on all 3 pads with GO5. Too much additive is not good as it is abrasive to water pump seals. Most folks will say SCA's are not needed in non sleeved blocks and of course too much is bad, but all my vehicles cooling systems work well and there is no buildup on the tube openings of inner tanks. If antone wants to read more go to Wix/NAPA Filters or the major filter brand of your choice and read up. NAPA also offers a refractometer #4584 (F readout) #4585 (C readout) to help determine dillution level.

 

[AlanB]

As an added point, you have to know what antifreeze you have, to select the proper tests / test strips to run.

There are various chemistries used and you have to insure that the strip that you are using, is applicable to that chemistry.

As a general statement, I strongly suggest going with one manufacturer, and sticking to one type of chemistry, ie add packs, SCA's etc. that are intended to work together by that manufacturer, and use their test strips (or other tests as they deem appropriate)

Mixing chemistries can lead to problems, I am not sure how these newer "mix with all" antifreezes are doing it. Personally, I think they are playing the odds.

 

[LRH]

As an added point, you have to know what antifreeze you have, to select the proper tests / test strips to run.

There are various chemistries used and you have to insure that the strip that you are using, is applicable to that chemistry.

As a general statement, I strongly suggest going with one manufacturer, and sticking to one type of chemistry, ie add packs, SCA's etc. that are intended to work together by that manufacturer, and use their test strips (or other tests as they deem appropriate)

Mixing chemistries can lead to problems, I am not sure how these newer "mix with all" antifreezes are doing it. Personally, I think they are playing the odds.

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Yes; I know what you mean about the "mix with all" coolants. See a lot of auto shops spec it so one coolant does all. I just can't see how one formula can mix without some loss of performance/protection. I myself will prob use the G05 formulation from now on in all my vehicles unless it specifically requires a more robust additive package. In my opinion DexCool is prob the worst of the ELC's and G05 seems to be the best unless one needs the "adjustabillity" of adding SCA's. I don't think DexCool would have goitten the bad rap it got if it wasn't pushed as a 100,000 mi coolant. Anything other than a regular old ethylene glycol coolant mixture is prob overkill for our compact tractors, just changing it out every few years is the imortant part.