Correct hydraulic oil for Yanmar FX32?

[winston1]

I want to think two old hands MJ Peterson (cold climate in Europe somewhere), and the retired and I might say "revered" dealer from Washington state (now relaxing on an island somewhere but my old mind can't recall his name for nothing) both used automatic transmission fluid. Certainly, just an opinion, but I think is has been proved to work.

 

[YanmarFever]

I don't doubt that you have, and it says a lot about Yanmar quality. But it doesn't tell us anything about the which oil to use other than that ATF is adequate in a limited test....so far. I wish we could say it told us about future wear and lifespan, but I don't think we can say that.

What we have on the one hand is your real world experience that ATF will work.

And on the other hand we have whole industries full of scientists and engineers - as well as the factory guys who actually designed and built these Yanmar tractors - all saying that trans/hydraulic fluid is what they recommend.

Does that about sum it up?

rScotty

Not so fast there...
Scientists ? For Pete's sake, its tranny fluid not covid fluid.

Don't forget Yanmars were designed in Japan, they were serviced by Japanese dealers and farmers. Do you think that Yanmar corp would let the dealers use ATF if it was hard on the tractor?
These are thousands of 30 - 40 year old machines that come over from another country, with ATF in them.
I tend to believe that they know a bit more than we do on this side of the lake about the tractors that THEY built...

 

[rScotty]

Not so fast there...
Scientists ? For Pete's sake, its tranny fluid not covid fluid.

Don't forget Yanmars were designed in Japan, they were serviced by Japanese dealers and farmers. Do you think that Yanmar corp would let the dealers use ATF if it was hard on the tractor?
These are thousands of 30 - 40 year old machines that come over from another country, with ATF in them.
I tend to believe that they know a bit more than we do on this side of the lake about the tractors that THEY built...

It doesn't matter if it is transmission oil, time and space, or drinking water, the argument is the same. We are talking opinions here - or more precisely about how opinions are formed - either through study or by belief.

I'm still not sure that what you are dealing with is what you think it is. I'm not sure it is ATF and not some more suitable transy/hydaulic fluid with the typical red dye that both use.

The basic room temperature visosity is very similar between ATF and Trans/hydraulic (J20) fluids. They look and even smell the same.
The difference is that transmission fluid responds to shear and impact forces by forming a more resistant boundary layer. That type of impact and shear resistance isn't something obvious to casual observation, and is not encountered in power steering - where the emphasis is on maintaining a constant viscosity over a temperature range. And those are contrary effects.

BTW, I don't think that the Japanese dealers and farmers are any more knowledgeable than our own. Or that Yanmar corp dictates what people can use.
And I don't even say that the Yanmar engineers were necessarily right when they designed the tractors and specified an oil. But until our experience equals theirs, I do think that our best bet is to go with their opinion.

rScotty

 

[YanmarFever]

This is only going in circles, I only know what I saw with my own eyes and spoke with the yanmar dealers in Japan where they are made.

The Fx 32 tractors have their own power steering reservoir by the way.

 

[bmaverick]

This is only going in circles, I only know what I saw with my own eyes and spoke with the yanmar dealers in Japan where they are made.

The Fx 32 tractors have their own power steering reservoir by the way.

I know in eastern EU countries FCA Mopar ATF+4 is used in various Yanmar machine series due to cost and it's synthetic. The key to the fluid is not to have seal swelling in the system. FCA Mopar uses ATF+4 as both transmission fluid and power steering fluid.

Early Yanmar and Deere manuals called out JD303. Then a huge change happened with technical bulletins to upgrade to J20A for the compacts. Even the YM276 service manual called out JD303 till it was superseded. J20A was superseded with today's J20C and J20D.

Now, JD303 was a really poor fluid overall. As engineering scientist learned, oils improved in the past 20, 30 and 40 years, use as owners now benefit.

ATF is all over the map due to each unique brand for application. It would be nice to know the properties for a comparison. Yet, Joe Public is kept in the dark. Hints are available via the MSDS or SDS data sheets.

Like the Mopar ATF+4, Deere J20C is used in the transmission, differential, wet brake, power steering, and hydraulic systems. See the spec link below.

https://www.49northlubricants.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/3331-Product-Info.pdf

As these are synthetic based oils, the industry itself has shifted into.

 

[careyo63]

I won't hit 900 hrs. on my Tac until maybe end of this Yr.. I changed the Hyd. around 015-025 Hrs. which was what was showing when I bought it. The Hyd. fluid was super nasty!! looked like Crisco oil came out from the bottom of the pan. No doubt decades since it's was changed. Thick and White looking. The screen was repaired even which I replaced while at Fredricks for parts. I have a 5 gal. Bucket. Waiting until I hit 1000hrs. One thing I can say it wasn't Trans fluid. I've seen some !!!! come from Automatic-Trans. before pulling the pans. A close friend owned a Transmission shop which I would help on weekends and Evenings. Fluid changes or pull the Trans to rebuild mostly. I'll do a clutch but no automatic Trans. for me. I've had to pull a couple that wasn't right after rebuilding them. Newer models mostly. This is what I plan on replacing the 303 with. Just being Gear and what I seen was in it that came out I'm probably good for 1000Hrs more. But with a new filter screen and clean pan I'm actually wanting to see what it looks likes.
My guess is real clean and they did use Crisco oil in it..............

 

[California]

Isn't that yellow-pail stuff just a new name for JD303?

Does it claim compliance with any later standard?

Hmmm. On their website

used as a hydraulic medium or as a general lubricating fluid in non-critical applications. Super S® Agri+Plus is formulated as a SAE 20 with additives

Not recommended for use in mobile, farm or construction equipment.

 

[careyo63]

Not a universal Hyd. fluid but meets all SAE20. Was it actually whale oil that I changed?. It very well could have been. Super Nasty............... and it did stink come to think about it.

 

[ponytug]

@California So agricultural hydraulic fluid, NOT recommended for use in farm equipment, which leaves what? Spraying on fence posts?

All the best,

Peter

 

[rScotty]

This is only going in circles, I only know what I saw with my own eyes and spoke with the yanmar dealers in Japan where they are made.

The Fx 32 tractors have their own power steering reservoir by the way.

Yes, I think we've pretty much beat the subject into the ground. There are no answers, only opinions. But even so, I like to look at as many opinions as I can before deciding. Don't you?

It would help us if the world of hydraulic and transmission fluids had the same testing and reporting requirements as engine oils do - with their standardized SAE and API tests and defined certifications like engine oils have.

But right now for hydraulic and transmission oils it's like the Wild West - every mfg. for themself.

That just leaves opinions.
rScotty

Oh, BTW, yes, I agree. Separate sumps and reservoirs is the best way. It's expensive, though.