Coyotes killing livestock

   / Coyotes killing livestock #51  
"Also, the possession of a firearm and flashlight at night in an area with wildlife is enough to get one cited/arrested for poaching."

Uh oh, I always have a loaded gun in my pickup and I also always have a flashlight in the pickup. Looks like I'm a poacher? BS.
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #52  
When we are shooting wild dogs and coyotes, I usually have a SWAT team member from our county Sheriff department with me, he's almost as well armed and a good a shot as I am, and for sure he ain't no poacher! :D
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #53  
Highbeam said:
Uh oh, I always have a loaded gun in my pickup and I also always have a flashlight in the pickup. Looks like I'm a poacher? BS.

You may think it is BS but it is in the state statues of two states where I'm familiar with the law. It very well may be in the statutes in your state.

Now if you are pulled over for a burned out license light, and the officer see the firearm and the flashlight, and you are on the road leading to my house, in my state you could be written up for poaching. Would it pass the Magistrate? The judge/jury? Flip a coin. Depends on who you get and the particulars of the case. But it is in the statutes. You could be arrested per those statutes.

Since it is a wildlife violation, all equipment used in the act of poaching can be taken. Those your flash light, firearm, and vehicle could be siezed. That too is part of the statutes.

Back to this thread topic, I think the land/stock owner should be able to wipe those coyotes out. Period. But in NC I can't legally do it at night. That is my understanding of the statutes as well as talking with a wildlife officer hoping to find an out. I did not find an out. There could be an out but I don't see a legal one. :D

Later,
Dan
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #54  
SkyPup said:
When we are shooting wild dogs and coyotes, I usually have a SWAT team member from our county Sheriff department with me, he's almost as well armed and a good a shot as I am, and for sure he ain't no poacher! :D

He better be careful, he might have to arrest himself. :D

I don't remember if vermin removal had an exception in FLA. There should be one that is for sure. Most of these laws rely on the officer, its really only going to be a wildlife officer looking for these violations, using good judgement. And of course the rest of the system has to use good judgement. :confused: Frankly I would prefer to NOT have them using judgement regarding me. :D

There was a case in FLA back in the 80's where a guy was out on a boat with his young child. He had been out lobstering and was checked by a WO. The guy showed some lobsters to the officer and he was legal. Then the child said, "But Daddy you did not show him the lobsters in the tackle box." The tackle box was filled with undersized lobster. The boat, trailer, truck and SCUBA gear was seized as part of the arrest. The judge gave all of the equipment back to the offender and just fined him. A different judge could have kept it all...

Later,
Dan
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #55  
He is the chief of our county's Rural Deputy Service and also a qualified member of the SWAT team as well. Not only does he come out to kill wild dogs and coyotes decimating our livestock, but he also has a pack of hounds that nail wild hogs too!

At least when we manage to get a couple of hogs, we also get some real good BBQ..... :D

The only time we call the Fish and Game officer over is to take out gators over six feet long. :eek:
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #56  
Wow Dmccarty, I did not realize they were that nasty. Amazing the laws that we break without even knowing it.
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #57  
The Fish and Game laws here in Florida allow the confiscation of everything associated with the poaching - got undersized lobster? ->lose boat, trailer, truck, RV, and everything in them. Got an illegal doe or hen turkey -> lose guns, truck, and everything else associated with the poaching. Even much worse is breaking any of the Federal Waterfowl laws while duck, snipe, woodcock, or dove hunting, a trip to the Fed slammer is always much longer than state pen.

The Game and Fish do auction off the property, so you can always by it back if your not incarcerated at the time of the auction!! :D
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #58  
Hmm.. that's a hard one to grasp.

I have a CCW.. I -always- have my gun in my truck. There's always a flashlight in my truck.

I've been stopped at night for things exactly like you mention... a burned out tag light... never once did the police ever mention that I might be a poacher.. they were only interested in my license, registration , DL, and CCW permit, and wanted to know the location of the firearm.. etc.

I think statuates like that are for 'strawman' type arguments where law engorcement need something to hold somebody under suspicion.. IE.. just a step above 'trumped up' charges.. etc.

( i live in florida... a state that is big on self defense.. ie firearm ownership)

Soundguy

dmccarty said:
You may think it is BS but it is in the state statues of two states where I'm familiar with the law. It very well may be in the statutes in your state.

Now if you are pulled over for a burned out license light, and the officer see the firearm and the flashlight, and you are on the road leading to my house, in my state you could be written up for poaching. Would it pass the Magistrate? The judge/jury? Flip a coin. Depends on who you get and the particulars of the case. But it is in the statutes. You could be arrested per those statutes.

Since it is a wildlife violation, all equipment used in the act of poaching can be taken. Those your flash light, firearm, and vehicle could be siezed. That too is part of the statutes.

Back to this thread topic, I think the land/stock owner should be able to wipe those coyotes out. Period. But in NC I can't legally do it at night. That is my understanding of the statutes as well as talking with a wildlife officer hoping to find an out. I did not find an out. There could be an out but I don't see a legal one. :D

Later,
Dan
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #59  
It's interesting timing, but The Dallas Morning News has a story this morning about using guard donkeys to protect Texas herds. And my limited experience has been that the story is pretty good; especially the part about jacks being aggressive toward cattle if they're not raised with the cattle.
 
   / Coyotes killing livestock #60  
Soundguy,

Its not really a strawman argument its just a statute that is a bit too open for my taste. The statute in NC and as I remember it in FLA, contain similar wording. The statute needs some verbage like "possess a light and fire arm as well as acting in a manner that a reasonable person would believe to be poaching." The statues use the term Prima Facie(sp?) which as I understand it, means an established fact/presumed fact. So in this case you have the firearm and a light therefore its on YOU the accused to prove you where not poaching.

I think very few city officers would now about these statutes and in a city environment its going to be tough getting a conviction. Sheriff deputies would have a higher chance of knowing these statutes and might make an arrest but I doubt it happens very often. As I said, the most likely LEO making this arrest will be a wildlife officer.

But the statue is on the books open to all LEOs.

So if I go for a walk on my land at night. Say to go lock the gate at the road. I grab a pistol and and a flashlight. On the walk down I find a WO sitting at the road and the end of my driveway. He sees me openly carrying my pistol. I have a flashlight in my left hand. On the way down I scared up a couple of deer. Should the officer arrest me for poaching? Would he? Could he?

He most certainly could which leaves the should and the would. :D

There are lots of laws on the books that could get one arrested. The "crimes against nature" laws that just recently was struck down as Unconstitutionable is a good example. We have an area in the woods on a lake that is a known place for gay men to hang out. Its a surprise to be in a canoe or kayak paddling along the shore and suddenly one sees naked men frolicking on the shore. :eek:

The old sheriff would not do anything about The Gathering. He said there was nothing he could do which was BS. He was also the same numb nut that sized tons of Mary Jane and instead of burning it he buried it at the dump. Gomer said, "Surprise Surprise Surprise" when the backhoe operator who buried the Mary Jane went back and dug it up. And to add insult to injury the bales being kept in a trailer as evidence at the Sheriff Office where stolen. Gomer said?

There is now a new Sheriff in town.... :)

But the "crime against nature" statute would have allowed the old Sheriff to solve the problem of The Gathering. Heck just having deputies walk through the woods would have stopped it. But I would venture to guess that the statute, before the latest ruling, would make most people Class I felons in NC. :eek:

There are still laws on the books about people living togather without being married or sharing a "room for rent" aka a motel/hotel without being betrothed. Every once in awhile there are prosecutions and convictions.

Which brings me back to my origional point. Look up your local laws and act as you see fit. :D But at least know the laws or try too.

Later,
Dan
 

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