Mowing Cub Cadet, no more reverse mowing.

MBDiagMan · Nov 25, 2004

Rainbow,

I doubt that there is anyone that makes a practice of mowing any distance at all in reverse. The problem is that while in tight maneuvers, you will be backing up a foot or two. The reverse cutout drops out the clutch, then actuates again when you start forward. This wears out the clutch in short order.

Happy Thanksgiving,
Doc

Rainbow6 · Nov 25, 2004

Thats exactly my point, the whole thing should have never started. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

DmansPadge · Nov 25, 2004

/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Ahhh... I thought everyone mowed in reverse! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I might have to do that one day just to see what the neighbors think!

Bob_Bainbridge · Nov 26, 2004

I doubt if anyone does extensive mowing in reverse. I have some 20+ trees to trim around, many of which barely have room to get the mower deck between them. This requires many backward/forward gyrations and having to turn the PTO off and on everytime the blade stops in reverse is really an aggravation and I'm sure creates much wear and tear on the PTO. IMO Cub Cadet took a giant step backward when they replaced the electric PTO clutch with the vacuum operated one with 2 belts on the 3000 series. I chose the Cadet over a Deere because of the shaft tractor drive and the shaft driven mowing deck. This left only one belt to worry about, the one around the 3 blade spindles. Now they have to go and add 2 more belts for the PTO clutch. It's supposed to soften the load on the engine when applying the PTO but I never had a problem with the electric clutch outside of an occasional adjustment.

Bob B.

Bob_Bainbridge · Nov 26, 2004

( Rainbow,

I doubt that there is anyone that makes a practice of mowing any distance at all in reverse. The problem is that while in tight maneuvers, you will be backing up a foot or two. The reverse cutout drops out the clutch, then actuates again when you start forward. This wears out the clutch in short order.

Happy Thanksgiving,
Doc )

It's actually worse than that. The PTO drops out when going in reverse and DOESN'T engage again when going forward. You have to manually turn it off and then back on again, at least on the 3000 series.

Bob B.

Rainbow6 · Nov 26, 2004

Yes, its the same on my 2518. You have to push in the PTO switch, then pull it back out again to start it. Funny though, my 04 Kubota BX2230 mowed in reverse, it came new that way. Maybe its because it is classified as a subcompact tractor instead of mower. I dunno... /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

ducati996 · Nov 26, 2004

(I doubt if anyone does extensive mowing in reverse. I have some 20+ trees to trim around, many of which barely have room to get the mower deck between them. This requires many backward/forward gyrations and having to turn the PTO off and on everytime the blade stops in reverse is really an aggravation and I'm sure creates much wear and tear on the PTO. IMO Cub Cadet took a giant step backward when they replaced the electric PTO clutch with the vacuum operated one with 2 belts on the 3000 series. I chose the Cadet over a Deere because of the shaft tractor drive and the shaft driven mowing deck. This left only one belt to worry about, the one around the 3 blade spindles. Now they have to go and add 2 more belts for the PTO clutch. It's supposed to soften the load on the engine when applying the PTO but I never had a problem with the electric clutch outside of an occasional adjustment.

Bob B. )

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Just a couple of quick notes here and I think you should be aware of regarding the reverse disable, and the vacuum PTO.
For starters the vacuum PTO clutch is the better design (less expensive to repair), and it sounded like they retrofitted your machine to it? With the vacuum design, you can spool up at any speed either a full RPM or lower without damage to any electrical clutch. As for the two belt design, it dosent get any easier to replace than the way Cub has it set up. Remove the panels and you have complete access, simple and straight forward. Two belts are always better than one, and they rest right next to each other with no slippage. Never an adjustment needed, the vaccum rachets itself on the belt. Belts are good for shock absorbtion from sudden impacts and to provide give in the PTO drive train.
The reverse disable is the simpliest well documented process to defeat. Just follow the foot peddles and notice were the contact switch is. A total of 5 minutes in all, and no more complaints...besides I mow consistantly and for lenghts of 50 feet or more in reverse, because it works for me and makes my efforts more efficient. I wouldnt be so doubtful on who uses the reverse mowing feature...
I not sure why you are so critical regarding your 3000 series. Everything you mentioned is simple to fix. I have over 150 hrs on my 3204 and I have some of the best attachments for it (blower). Its the easiest machine I have to maintain, and to setup my attachments. Everything is accessible and within easy reach for maintence..

Good luck with your machine either way....

Oh I forgot, I also back up my machine in reverse for well over a hundred feet or more, and I want my PTO running when I'm blowing snow

Ducati

Bob_Bainbridge · Nov 27, 2004

( For starters the vacuum PTO clutch is the better design (less expensive to repair), and it sounded like they retrofitted your machine to it? With the vacuum design, you can spool up at any speed either a full RPM or lower without damage to any electrical clutch. As for the two belt design, it dosent get any easier to replace than the way Cub has it set up. Remove the panels and you have complete access, simple and straight forward. Two belts are always better than one, and they rest right next to each other with no slippage. Never an adjustment needed, the vaccum rachets itself on the belt. Belts are good for shock absorbtion from sudden impacts and to provide give in the PTO drive train.
The reverse disable is the simpliest well documented process to defeat. Just follow the foot peddles and notice were the contact switch is. A total of 5 minutes in all, and no more complaints...besides I mow consistantly and for lenghts of 50 feet or more in reverse, because it works for me and makes my efforts more efficient. I wouldnt be so doubtful on who uses the reverse mowing feature...
I not sure why you are so critical regarding your 3000 series. Everything you mentioned is simple to fix. I have over 150 hrs on my 3204 and I have some of the best attachments for it (blower). Its the easiest machine I have to maintain, and to setup my attachments. Everything is accessible and within easy reach for maintence..
Ducati )

My mower wasn't retrofitted - it's a 2004 model and came from the factory with the vacuum PTO. I didn't intend to come across as critical of the mower. I like it very much. I disabled the reverse no-mow feature the second or third time I used it so that's no longer a problem. My point was I believe if something works fine - leave it alone. I never had any problems engaging the electric PTO and although I agree that the vacuum PTO is easy to service I never had to replace the electric clutch after 26 years of use. I doubt if the dual belts will last that long. I'm just not a big fan of belts. I saw a 5000 (or maybe it was a 7000) and it had an electric clutch PTO. I love the 3235 and have about 50 hours on it now. Another 1150 hours and it will beat the 1450.

Bob B.

Rainbow6 · Nov 27, 2004

Does anyone know why they started this "can't mow in reverse" thing in the first place? I guessing because of a lawsuit, but don't really know. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

MBDiagMan · Nov 27, 2004

You can bet the farm that the reason is that there was a lawsuit or multiple lawsuits that led to this.

About 15 years ago, as an engineering manager, we went through a whole seminar about product liability. One of the example, real world cases that they covered involved a walk behind, self propelled lawn mower that was over 10 years old. Every safety device on the mower had been "cheated." A man was having trouble starting the engine with the pull starter because the mower would move, so he had his wife SIT on the top of the mower while he used the pull rope. The mower started, ran into the house and hurt his wife and his house.

He took the manufacturer to court and got some unbelievable 7 figure settlement. How unfair is that? Very unfair. THAT is why there are so many laws and gadgets to protect us from our own stupidity. In other words there are too many of us that are not willing to take responsibility for their own actions.

I can almost guarantee you that your lawn mower manufacturer, whoever they may be, have seen these types of suits. I'm sure that their not interested in seeing more of them.

I have cheated the anti reverse interlocks on my new mower, but I can promise you that if anything happens as a result I will take full responsibility.

If EVERYONE took responsibility for their own actions, our mowers would be much less expensive.

I won't start in on the lawyer jokes, because there are some good, conservative, honest hardworking lawyers out there. I don't believe that one should shoot all the dogs because one of them has fleas.

Have a great day,
Doc