Current pricing L2501 and transmission choice

[WADFL]

I have a L2501HST, was planning to purchase a 3025E, and I'm glad I wound up with the Kubota.
They're light years different and after operating the Kubota there was no comparison.
Just the fact that the Kubota has a fuel gauge in the dash + the loader control feels so much better engineered on the L2501.

 

[Fallon]

Would love to see where your getting 25-30% power loss from. even messic's did a video on pulling, and I actually think the hst beat the gear model.

I wouldn't touch a gear tractor for a subcompact. doubht I would ever touch one, and i drove stick for years. when my wife can inch the bucket to within a inch of something without my help. that says more then enough for me. hst is so much quicker then using a gear its not even a consideration.

PTO difference on my tractor is 7% according to tractor data. If you need that 7% you bought too small of a tractor

The numbers I've always seen is a 15% HP penalty for a HST over geared machine. There are losses converting from mechanical to hydraulic & back. Seals aren't perfect, fluid has friction as does all the pistons pumping & sliding. Packaging the HST as a unit with little external plumbing makes it more efficient than other hydraulics. Running a hydraulic PHD or other motor on the end of a loader is around 70% efficient due to plumbing losses. Which may be where some people get the really bad numbers from then misapply them to a HST

A SSQA on the loader or Quick Hitch on the 3pt also decrease lift capacity a bit. But I believe in them as well. In many cases ease of operation makes for more optimized work than power transmission efficiency or pure luft capacity.

 

[tradosaurus]

Looking back at my invoice, the Equine discount only applied to the tractor + loader, and not to the additional hydraulics or implements. (I may call Kubota and confirm it shouldn't apply to the hydraulics -- I could see an argument for that)

I believe the equine discount applies to tractor+loader and any implements you buy. Not sure about the additional options but I thought the 20% covered what you could build on the Kubota build site.
Looking at my quote from Feb of 2021 the 20% covered tractor, heavy duty bucket, tire choices, remote valves, level rod indicator kit,

 

[jaydee325]

The difference in PTO HP between the gear and hydro in the L2501 is 7.3%. Move up in HP the difference is less. The L4701 has a difference of 3.8%.

Who remembers when tractors were sold/purchased based on draw bar horse power or later, PTO horse power! If you need 20 PTO HP, buy a tractor with 20 PTO HP, regardless of gear or hydro transmission choice.

 

[Fallon]

The difference between HST & gear HP at the PTO shaft is different from total efficiency.

HSTs have a charge pump that is always running & will eat a little HP. Even when sitting still & running their PTO but not driving.

When operating a HST is slightly less efficient than a geared machine as well due to leakage, extra mechanical or hydraulic friction, etc.

It ends up being more HP robbed in operation than just comparing HST to geared HP ratings. The numbers i usually see from OEMs & reliable sources is around 15% less efficient total.

 

[ericm979]

The PTO difference would be measuring the drag from the charge pump and whatever extra gear train is needed to get drive from ahead of the HST to the PTO shaft. The latter is probably minimal. The HST vs gear loss to the PTO does vary quite a bit from manufacturer to manufacturer and even within models of the same manufacturer.

I've not been able to find any measurements of the losses to the wheels and would love to see published numbers.

Even if its 20% or whatever, for my use it's worth it. If my main use was plowing consistent soil on a flat field I'd maybe think about geared, but I'm not doing that. For loader and especially pallet fork work the ability to inch the tractor easily and reliably is a huge bonus.

 

[DVR]

There is only 1 reason to avoid hst in an L series- the noise.
I own a L3301 & don't like the noise. Got hst anyway.

 

[rScotty]

I had an L2501 gear model. If you don't mind the stoppage to shift from forward to reverse each time your doing loader work, it's OK.

With that, it's a work horse. Just takes longer than an HST to do anything using the loader.

Well said. I like gears myself....probably just because I grew up with them and understand clutches. But the HST on our M59 has kind of spoiled me. It is so amazingly more convenient when doing anything with the FEL bucket. It's not just that it is faster. Because of the way it works I use the edge of that bucket like a painter uses a brush. And that is all because of the HST. I guess I could do it with a clutch, but I never did.

Yes, at 1000 hrs plus I still wonder if it will be as reliable as a gear tractor. But honestly I would buy it again. If you read through a decade of TBN, there are very few HST problems that were not caused by dumb things like busting a line and ignoring the sounds as it ran out of fluid. Not even outright abuse seems to damage them.

Do a search on Kubota transmission failures and see what you come up with. I'm betting there is very little.

So I am gradually beginning to be a HST believer. If I can do that, so can anyone.
rScotty

 

[3gunr]

I have a gear , a shuttle and a hydro tractor , go with the hydro hands down. Shifting constantly doing loader work or even when brush hogging will suck after a while , listen to the other hst fans on here,

 

[rScotty]

Unlike lawn mowers, tractor PTOs don't shut off when you reverse. The HST makes it easy to back the mower into stuff. Just let off the one pedal, let the tractor come to a stop and push on the other pedal. The mower will be running the whole time.

The L2501 DT has a transmission driven PTO which means that when you shift gears or into reverse or just push in the clutch, you also interrupt drive to the PTO. While that would work ok if your mowing is all forwards driving on uncomplicated terrain, if you have places where you have to mow in reverse, it will make that more difficult.

Is that true? A top of the line tractor intended for mowing has a transmission driven PTO and not an independently clutched PTO? I would like to confirm that. If so, that pretty much makes the case for a HST.