Dead perkins....(ie, help...)

Richard · Jan 1, 2003

Well all.... ??

Call the dogs off. I rummaged through some old clothes, put on the dirtiest things I could find... in general, got ready for some engine climbing and getting dirty.

Went out to field.. thought.. hmm.. are the linkages working? (maybe if cable broke, throttle is pulled closed by the return spring and THAT could be preventing it from getting fuel??) Linkages are ok... rats.

Well.. let's turn engine over..what the heck..

As I crank it, it turned and turned and turned... then... I noticed a singular puff of smoke from exhaust.

Hmm.. I cranked again and it turned and turned and turned.. puff puff..chugga chugga...

VROOOOOOOOOOOM

Started right up and purred like a kitten.

Sort of like Brutus was looking at me saying.. "Man..what's your problem?"

I topped off fuel, stopped engine, restarted, and it cranked right up just as easy as ever, as though nothing had ever happened.

I am utterly clueless but I DO appreciate everyones input.

I'm left wondering... can TLB's be possessed by poltergeists? /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Seriously though, thanks again for input. I did not know that WD-40 would help an engine sputter to life, (in a diagonistic sense) so yet again, I've learned something here.

ya know... this website ought to be part of some college curriculum /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Richard

JohnMiller3 · Jan 1, 2003

...VROOOOOOOOOOOM...

Hurray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Happy New Year is off to a great start for ya.... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Now... get some clean and fresh fuel! /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Egon · Jan 1, 2003

That's a nice new years present hearing the perkins doing what's it's supposed to do.

"this website ought to be part of some college curriculum "

Golly, you do dat and I'll be left out after the first exams results are posted!!!
Egon

Richard · Jan 1, 2003

Now... get some clean and fresh fuel! 

I usually keep Brutus topped off and as often as weekly, or maybe monthly, refill my 5-gallon containers. All fuel comes from local co-op.

I HOPE that means I have as fresh of fuel as I can have??

None the less... all seems good now. Sure is frustrating having the wifey tell me to move an 18,000 pound eyesore when it won't even sputter for me.

Maybe I can get her to help push? /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif

Turfman · Jan 1, 2003

Glad to see you got her running. Too bad we'll never know the cause.

I really have to ask, what is a perkins?

JerryG · Jan 1, 2003

As far as I am concerned the Perkins and maybe the Valtra are the best diesel engines 200 hp and under there is. Perkins engines have been installed in lots of different tractors and equipment for a lot of years. I can't remember the years, but Massey bought Perkins (early 60's?). When agribusiness got so bad in the 80-90's and Massey almost went belly up, Perkins was sold to Caterpillar.

Bird · Jan 1, 2003

I have no idea how many different kinds of machines are powered by Perkins diesels, but tractors, boats, generators, and in 1967 when the old Dallas Transit System bought their first air-conditioned busses, they came with Perkins diesel engines.

Richard · Jan 1, 2003

I really have to ask, what is a perkins? 

I'll presume they have answered your question with FAR more brevity than I'd been able /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

JohnMiller3 · Jan 1, 2003

...I really have to ask, what is a perkins?...

Well.... /w3tcompact/icons/eyes.gif It has to be one of the best dang diesel engines ever designed... and then some.../w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif

/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

bgott · Jan 1, 2003

Glad to hear you got it running...Liquid Wrench will work, too. Just about anything that's petroleum based will work. You can even use a propane torch, just don't light it!

Richard · Jan 2, 2003

/w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif /w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif

JimMc · Jan 2, 2003

We just fixed a fork lift with a cracked fuel line INSIDE the tank. Would run fine with tank full the sputter and die and refuse to restart when fuel level dropped. Took forever to diagnose because on an incline it sputtered, then back on level ran good. Then it would sputter on level and run good on the next incline. Different operators didn't keep track of which way they were tilted, so it didn't seem to be a pattern, until after we figured it out.

Anonymous Poster · Jan 4, 2003

the WD-40 trick

Just realized..I have a nice new can lf "Liquid Wrench" and not a drop of WD-40....

Does that make a difference? will LW work as well as WD??


A few years back I went to community college "diesel school" at night. I went for my own edification, not for career purposes, but I managed to absorb quite a bit.

We worked on (played with) a small Yanmar, a Perkins 4-107, and a Detroit Diesel of forgotten nomenclature.

The instructor was the foreman at a very large industrial facility's vehicle shop. His crew maintained literally hundreds of heavy vehicles and other equipment, all in-house. When one of the students brought up the WD-40 trick, he was unequivical: "Never, never use WD-40 to start an engine."

It seemed that one of his employees had managed to lunch a very expensive engine that way.

As I understand it, the propellant in WD-40 is propane.

Food for thought.....

SnowRidge

bgott · Jan 4, 2003

"As I understand it, the propellant in WD-40 is propane."

I've heard that too. You can buy propane injection systems to use as a power additive for diesel engines.

MDNick · Jan 6, 2003

"As I understand it, the propellant in WD-40 used to be propane."

My understanding is that the new formulation does not use propane in an attempt to make it less flammable. Which is really to bad, because it was great for taking bumble bees out of the air. Looked like a Zero augering in, flaming wings and all! Of course the reasonably new can I have at my desk lists all matter of cautions about flammability, so I may be wrong.

Nick

Kiohio · Jan 7, 2003

I use the cheap carb cleaner available at the local parts depot. Around $1 a can. I don't light it. It'll still knock 'em out of the air as soon as you hit them. Just don't spray it onto vinyl siding or anything painted. /w3tcompact/icons/eyes.gif
KO

Richard · Jan 23, 2003

Sadly, I hate to bring this thread back up...

Update, when all the original issues happend, it was cold out...it wasn't freezing, just cold.

Today, it's freezing out. We had snowfall last night, I fired up Brutus to go clean the roadway and be a good neighbor..

As with the first time, I "stalled" the engine... THIS time, I was using the loader, low rpm's, and I think I again, stalled the engine, "my fault". As with last time, it would not start (and was warm)

I found a small can of WD-40 after 30 minutes of looking, and after using it... fired up, and ran like a top.

I worked furhter down the road, and it died again. THIS time when it died though... I didn't stall it... it acted more like fuel starvation.... it's rpms weren't up, and couldn't get them up...so, I stopped, put into neutral, and died right there, blocking the road /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif

again...after maybe 10 minutes of sitting, (and spraying into breather) got started... so went to check out rest of road.. got couple hundred yards, died again.

10 minutes... spray into breather..fired up..

THIS time..I'm heading straight home.. no passing go, no $200.

got 1/2 way home, died again. Waited 10 minutes, sprayed... started (would NOT start without spraying, yet when started, ran absolutely fine) ???

Drove home parked and posted this.

Some 'facts'...

* Brand spanking new 950 cca battery /w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif
* New fuel filter put in, early this past summer
* I DO have fuel conditoner in it, though I can't attest that I have "enough" (though I think I do) Looking at the fuel return line, it looks like red kool aid.. no visible signs of anything floating (gelling) Then again, I've never seen "gelled" diesel, and don't really know what I'd be looking for, or if it'd be visible.

* When it dies like this and I crank engine over, I get NO smoke at all out of stack... NONE (infers to me, fuel starvation)

* If fuel starvation... why does it run fine after the WD starts it?
* Why will it start with the WD, but not PRIOR?

I only had 1/8 can WD, so I'm getting more next time I'm at store... and I thought that stuff was only good for arthritus... /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

* One of my thoughts, is either minor blockage in fuel system somewhere, or since this is more cold related, possibly water freezing/collecting in system... or perhaps filter stopping up somehow (which might be why it works after 10 minutes... fuel can seep past obstruction?)

Thanks for any thoughts..

Bird · Jan 23, 2003

Richard, I won't claim to know, but it sure does sound as if the fuel is flowing from the tank to the cylinders, but in too small a quantity; i.e., an obstruction somewhere that's not a total obstruction, but just a restriction. I had a somewhat similar problem with an LPG generator on an RV once; start and run fine for very brief moments. LPG pressures checked fine and everything else worked, but after two different mechanics played with it for two days (still under warranty), discovered that the regulator was defective and just wouldn't allow the necessary volume through. I also once had a new manual transmission pickup truck; ran fine up to 50 mph and if you passed that speed, the engine died until it dropped below that speed again. Found that kids had put some trash in the gas tank that was causing a partial obstruction./w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif

Justaplain · Jan 23, 2003

Change the fuel filter. I'll bet it is waxed up 50%. bcs

dmccarty · Jan 31, 2003

Richard,

As Justasplain said, try changing the filter. Its simple, quick
and cheap. If it is clogged with wax or water that could be
your problem.

I'm no expert and I have not had a problem like this on my
trucks or tractor but reading some of the discussion on
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.thedieselstop.com>http://www.thedieselstop.com</A> leads me to think of the
fuel filter. There have been some long discussions on fuel
filters and water.

Let us know what happens...
Dan McCarty