Decided to go with Kubota.

[Z-Michigan]

I think the point of the original post is lost here and it's turned into a east meets west thread. Not that I think there was any point to the original post anyhow to wit: poster does not own a deere. Poster says kubota is better built and heavier duty than deere because it "looks like it," poster has decided to go with Kubota, Poster does not own and has not bought a kubota. Poster has disappeared from thread. So why are we here again????

+1

This thread has ceased being useful (assuming it was even useful when it started).

IMHO, the differences among models made by any one brand are often as large as the differences between brands.

 

[Builder]

Well, their is no rule from posts taking a life of their own wether the original poster has disappeared or not. Let the discussions keep flowing I say.

That's because you're enjoying watching (1) "likes to buy American made" guy battling (10) "japanese is better than American" guys.

I know I'm outgunned here and that I'll never win

However, I'm really tired of reading the "foreign is better" attitude over & over. I think C/R has convinced the American public that it's cars & trucks are inferior compared to foreign counterparts because they don't seat 8 people and have a 80HP 4 cylinder engine that gets 52MPG and rides on 13" tires. American vehicles have more been traditionally built for American tastes-more leg/ shoulder room, more power, longer wheelbases & more comfort, bigger trunks, longer hoods, etc. That cuts down on efficiency. C/R hates that mentality. C/R doesn't think a car or truck meets their efficiency standards unless it has that "japanese car/truck efficiency". IMO, they're lib tree huggers in disguise and IMO, that's their agenda. Going back to the 20's, American cars were built with a different mentality. Their cars were built for fun & expression as much as a form of transportation, not just fitting in a compact car sized parking space and being super efficient on the streets of Tokyo or Hong Kong.

Were we talking about tractors?

 

[aesanders]

That's because you're enjoying watching (1) "likes to buy American made" guy battling (10) "japanese is better than American" guys.

I know I'm outgunned here and that I'll never win

However, I'm really tired of reading the "foreign is better" attitude over & over. I think C/R has convinced the American public that it's cars & trucks are inferior compared to foreign counterparts because they don't seat 8 people and have a 80HP 4 cylinder engine that gets 52MPG and rides on 13" tires. American vehicles have more been traditionally built for American tastes-more leg/ shoulder room, more power, longer wheelbases & more comfort, bigger trunks, longer hoods, etc. That cuts down on efficiency. C/R hates that mentality. C/R doesn't think a car or truck meets their efficiency standards unless it has that "japanese car/truck efficiency". IMO, they're lib tree huggers in disguise and IMO, that's their agenda. Going back to the 20's, American cars were built with a different mentality. Their cars were built for fun & expression as much as a form of transportation, not just fitting in a compact car sized parking space and being super efficient on the streets of Tokyo or Hong Kong.

Were we talking about tractors?

I'm definately not one of the Japanese makes it better than the US crowd. I know for a fact that we can make anything as well as anybody here in the good old US of A. We still lead the world in technology manufacturing. The construction manufaturing company I worked for when I lived in Maryland could compete with any company price wise and quality wise. They were a non Union company and kept their operating costs in check, but made very high quality products that were 'Made in the USA.' I just feel the big 3 auto manufacturing are getting eaten alive by the Union wages they pay, and all the retired benefits they are paying. Makes it very hard for them to compete.

 

[gemini5362]

wow I have so many things to say here I dont know where to start.

1. the other guys aregument is just silly. You kind of forgot to mention that i said on a couple of different occasions that most porsche models are cheaper than vettes and still in my opinion better cars.

2. Accura models are all flagship honda. They are the higher echelon honda products. All of them are so comparing them to a cavalier is once again not a fair comparison. Besides which cavaliers were a lousy car from the get go.

3. american cars have more legroom and headroom. Not in the ones I test drove Actually some of the foreign cars had more headroom and more legroom. Of course I ownly test drove cadillacs, impallas, buicks, fords, dodges. maybe there is something out there that i did not try.


4. Union bashing. What can I say I am a union official for our union I hold an office in my local union, my state union, and the national union. Most of the benefits that you see in a company was brought about by union action. before unions got a good start no one paid health care, retirement, guaranteed work hours etc. So go ahead and bash the people that brought improved working conditions to this country. Most hotels and restraunts are not union and look to see how well they treat their people.

 

[coasterez]

wow I have so many things to say here I dont know where to start.

1. the other guys aregument is just silly. You kind of forgot to mention that i said on a couple of different occasions that most porsche models are cheaper than vettes and still in my opinion better cars.

2. Accura models are all flagship honda. They are the higher echelon honda products. All of them are so comparing them to a cavalier is once again not a fair comparison. Besides which cavaliers were a lousy car from the get go.

3. american cars have more legroom and headroom. Not in the ones I test drove Actually some of the foreign cars had more headroom and more legroom. Of course I ownly test drove cadillacs, impallas, buicks, fords, dodges. maybe there is something out there that i did not try.


4. Union bashing. What can I say I am a union official for our union I hold an office in my local union, my state union, and the national union. Most of the benefits that you see in a company was brought about by union action. before unions got a good start no one paid health care, retirement, guaranteed work hours etc. So go ahead and bash the people that brought improved working conditions to this country. Most hotels and restraunts are not union and look to see how well they treat their people.

All good points (mostly). Unions have and do serve to keep the balance between employers and employees. However, in some cases (UAW being one), the pendalum has swung too far the other way: High wages, high benefit burden, apathy about quality, and low productivity, etc. Now this is not entirely the unions' fault. The Employers have let it get this way, and even tried to use it to their advantage. There are a lot of spineless, unqualified people running these companies. GM, Ford, and Chrysler are struggling right now, and must push the pendalum back a bit if they are to survive.

The auto market also exhibits the "bandwagon effect": everyone else is driving a Camry, then so will I. Wait a bit and there will be a new bandwagon model that is the "best" to own. Tractors aren't much different. There's preceived and real safety in sameness.

I also think that just about every manufacturer is making a quality automobile these days. So, then it comes down to personal taste and luck in whether or not you get one of the few "lemons" that they all produce. This is also true of tractors.

For me, I keep an open mind. Will buy just about any brand, and couldn't care less what everyone else is buying.

 

[Builder]

A camry is just a Japanese Buick. Boringggggg!!!!!

 

[CDsdad]

I wonder where Mr. Artwhoeverheis that started this thread got off to. You'd think he'd want to see all this.

Art, did you ever get that tractor? I'm curious as to the model you bought. How about some pictures. Or did you just want to simply stir up a big pot of fecal matter and bail out?

 

[jbrumberg]

I wonder where Mr. Artwhoeverheis that started this thread got off to. You'd think he'd want to see all this.

Art, did you ever get that tractor? I'm curious as to the model you bought. How about some pictures. Or did you just want to simply stir up a big pot of fecal matter and bail out?

CDsdad:

Mr artVandelay is over in the Help! First tractor... post by Metropolis 488 in this Forum. It is my opinion that he still has not gotten a tractor, he just flamed NH (I have to apologize for my response.), and he is still stirring up the fecal material . Jay

 

[2520tlh]

In central Indiana, Deere and Kubota run the same price on the sub-cut and cuts up to 30hp. Dont know about bigger tractors as thats not what I was interested in. Dunno, but seems like this is not the case everywhere else.

 

[Volfandt]

Whats that term, deja-vu

Kubota vs JD.
It's up there with Ford vs Chevy and many other rivalries. Competition = good.
Kubota basically invented the CUT/SCUT market in the US. Why was JD so slow to recognize this industry leading market and not develope it before foreign competiton defined it?
Why does JD still have to import SCUT's & CUT's instead of building them here?
Does my money do more good for this country paying the salaries of domestic workers -or- making investors richer?

Big 3 vs Big 2 (Toyota & Honda)
It's up there with Ford vs Chevy and many other rivalries. Competition = good.
The Big 2 basically invented the compact car market in the US, or at least saw the oppurtunity and exploited it. Why were the Big 3 so slow to recognize this industry leading market and not develope it before foreign competiton defined it?
Why does The Big 3 still have to import compacts instead of building them here?
Does my money do more good for this country paying the salaries of domestic workers -or- making investors richer?

Anyone see a pattern here?

The USA is the biggest consumer market this world has ever known so it's going to attract the most competition to win this very lucrative business.
Large Domestically owned and operated industries had a virtual lock on these markets just 30 yrs ago but is playing catchup now. Many have either closed their doors or have been bought up by others.
How could these large companys loose such an advantage?

Glad you asked, heres MHO
1) Greed, both in management and labor. The goal became making as much profit as possible, even if it sacrificed quality.
Would a union have been necessary had the profits been more fairly distributed?
Would a good working relationship between management and labor fostered a better quality product?
Can a high quality product be manufactured when management & labor don't work together and only communicate through highly paid intermediaries that have NO phyical contribution to the product's manufacture?

2) Incompetence, we have the best institutions of primary & secondary learning available to all citizens and yet both management & labor must have decided that short term profit was a better business strategy than a long term investment strategy. As evidenced by OUTRAGIOUS salaries, benefits and bonuses awarded both. I guess it's better to bleed the cow dry than be able to feed off it's nurishment over the long haul.

3) Ignorance. Big domestic business apparently felt that there was no other country / labor force that could out produce them and do it with an as good or better quality product at a lower price.

4) Shortsightedness, kinda works with ignorance. Basically, foreign manufacturers came into this very lucrative market and re-defined the most lucrative part of it. They did it with a good affordable product, a long term strategy, an unheard of good working relationship between management & labor that required no MIDDLEMEN and have been able to maintain the leadership of these markets by their long term business strategy.

Theres more but I digress.
I didn't buy my 1st foreign badged NEW big ticket product until 2001 and in SOME instances the domestic product was better (my Ford pickups) but when it came to compact cars, I'm sorry to say, American owned manufacturing just must not think their products in this class is not worthy of their best efforts. I guess they'd rather make a large profit on a single high $$$ product than the same profit on several smaller $$$ products.
Oh well, at least someone values the compact market as much as the luxury market.....