DIESEL SPILL!

Dargo · Sep 26, 2004

I don't live in KY, but in KY they use motor oil on many county roads to control dust. I'm certain that they are not the only state to do so. A friend of mine works for them and told me that for decades they have used hundreds of thousands of gallons of oil for dust control on their county roads.

Not that I don't believe you, or have any desire to debate the issue, but using your tablespoon analogy every state south of KY should have highly contaminated drinking water in their wells for at least the next couple of centuries.

For weed control in my personal driveway, I've found that 6" of 5000 psi concrete with 6 gauge wire matting in it along with 1/2" runs of rebar seems to slow the growth of grass and other nasty weeds nicely. However, for other areas where I still have gravel, I've found a source for Paraquat that has proved to me that it works nicely, and for a longer time frame than the "toxic" diesel fuel. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

ronjhall · Sep 26, 2004

I've found a source for Paraquat that has proved to me that it works nicely /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Many roads in my area had oil put on them to control dust. It's been a few years since it was stopped.
I should be dead by now if the environmentalist are right about their claims. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

cp1969 · Sep 26, 2004

When the county quits laying down thousands of gallons of oil on roads (chip & seal) each year because of ground water pollution, then I'll start thinking about curbing my 1 gallon (maybe) per year use of diesel as weed control.

Soundguy · Sep 27, 2004

Dargo, Ron, and CP

I'll assume you guys don't work for the county public works dept, or the suppliers/contractors doing the oil/dust control.

We routinely do dust control oil applications near our airport. it is NOT motor oil.. .

Also.. chipseal is not MOTOR OIL. It is more like a tar in plain terms.. but specifically a bituminous asphalt or asphalt emulsion product that cures to an inert state. I can send you the MSDS on this material.. has an environmental impact listed as 0 on the little quad quick reference charts.

Same as tack coat or prime on a road... NOT MOTOR OIL.

Motor oil and gravel chips wouldn't do much to seal a crack in a road anyway... in fact.. it would further soften the asphalt around the crack, making it scab.

The tablespoon of oil/2kgal of water figure/info comes straight from the army core of eng's. You should be able to verify this and other 'exposure level threshold date at the EPA site.

Soundguy

Dargo · Sep 27, 2004

Again, I'm not saying that I don't believe you. I'm just telling you what I've seen with my own eyes, and heard from a 25 year veteran of a state highway department. Times are tough. Money is tight. There are a lot of county roads. Used motor oil is free. I'm not condoning the procedure, I'm just telling you that without a doubt it is happening as I type this message.

Don't shoot the messenger. Knowing what I know, when I built my house, I spent over 10K getting city water out to my house rather than digging a well and drinking the water that comes out of the ground here. If you want to turn in a company, you can start with a small one by the name of General Electric who has a large plant that produces Lexan two counties over from where I live. The county is very rural in nature with a small population compared with the land mass it encompasses. However, Posey County, IN has one of the highest cancer rates of any county in the country. I'll give you their phone number....get 'em! I'll sign any petition you want to start. I'm with you, I'm just stating the facts. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

beenthere · Sep 27, 2004

I don't believe it is toxic. My father worked on diesel engines (John Deere Model R design as experimental engineer beginning '36 through retirement in '76) and lived until age 90+. He was in diesel fuel "ALL" the time and breathing diesel fumes. He was very healthy, except some hearing loss.
To me, most of the panic over 'some' fuel on the ground or in the water is 'pure' hype. But it feeds a lot of the population by giving them work to do. Sorry, don't mean to inflame anyone. Just my opinion. (And I only get one vote, same as everyone else).

timb · Sep 27, 2004

Besides, no self-respecting dirt, wood, or gravel floor tractor bay / machine shed has quite the right ambiance until there's a few years of spills or drips of hydraulic oil, fuel, or grease to give that special aroma.

beenthere · Sep 27, 2004

Interesting, when my son built a house a year ago, he was having trouble getting the contractor to put in the septic system and the general finish grading finished before winter set in. This also included getting the garage floor rough grading done, and graveled. Too late to get the floor poured, it was recommended he wait until spring to pour the garage floor. When the final inspection came the end of Jan., the inspector said "Oh, the approval to move in will not be issued until the garage floor is poured". This came as a surprise, as it was not mentioned before that time. By then, the MN winter was mid-way through its freezing cycle, and the garage floor was frozen solid.

The reason given was "You can't have vehicles parked on the gravel in the garage, because the oil may drip off the engine and contaminate the soil, and get into your well water".

Duh, couldn't help but wonder what was happening when the vehicle was parked outside on the gravel.

After an extension on his building loan, and three months later, finally was able to move into his new house - just because the garage floor wasn't poured.

Maybe there is a law coming down the pike that vehicles won't be allowed to drip any oil on any surface for fear of contamination. Hmmm? /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Junkman · Sep 27, 2004

You can always tell where my Corvair was parked..... just look for the oil spot... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Actually it doesn't leak any more... just not any less.... I fixed the leaks and now the engine shrouds are rusting. Dripping oil has its benefits... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Soundguy · Sep 29, 2004

( I'm just telling you what I've seen with my own eyes, and heard from a 25 year veteran of a state highway department. )

I'm not discounting what you say.. but it is very possibly the guy didn't have all the facts.

I remember a job a couple years ago and we had our prime truck parked out there.. it had a slow drip that produced a puddle about 10" around under it. The material was the asphalt emulsion tack. One of the state road inspectors came by.. freaked out.. calle dthe epa, and never mentioned it to us. Epa shows up the next day.. talks to us.. asks what the material is.. we show him the msds and info from the production plant. EPA rep grumbles about his wasted time and drive from upstate.. thanks us and leaves. And I never saw the road inspector again.

Again.. I don't live where you live.. and they may actually be stupid enough to pour a hazardous product out on the road. History is full of dangerous practices. Lots of x-ray pioneers had problems. And smoking comes to mind. Funny that 'smoke inhalation' is the leading cause of death for fires.. yet cigarettes exist... yet.. suicide is illegal.... pretty much defies logic.

Every state has blunders left over from years past.

Marion county where I live... north end of the county.. one of our big east west roads.. SR 40 wher eit runs thru ocala.. all along it, there are drainage culverts installed by the army in the 50's these all finally exit into our silver river at the end of a pipe with nothing more than a strainer to catch large solids. 50 years ago that sounded ok.. and there was no epa to deal with. Nowadays it is dumping oily runoff into a body of water in contact with our aquifer... go figure..

As for the poster who mentioned drips of oil on the dirt barn floor. As I mentioned.. those are the expected more or less.. non-point source contaminations that we just accept, and live with..

I'm not preaching at anyone.. so no need to post the little faces with the angled eyebrows. Were' all adults here.. and it's the 21'st century... no one who has an 8th grade education or better should have to be told that pouring used motor oil on the ground is bad.. and no one should be surprised or angry to hear that either.

Soundguy