DK40HST Won't Start.

ritcheyvs · Nov 16, 2014

deleted duplicate

Coyote machine · Nov 16, 2014

That sounds right; that the cruise module is not allowing the ground to complete the circuit, after the tractor has run awhile. Maybe your dealer can 'loan' you a cruise brain to use to further diagnose the problem. If all of a sudden the problem goes away you're on it. I wouldn't bother with swapping out the ig switch, for now, but save it for when yours does crap out.

Nick61 · Nov 17, 2014

ritcheyvs said:
Now this is interesting and it also points to a sick cruise unit. When the key is on and the alternator isn't turning, you should always get a battery/alternator light. Assuming your DK40SE schematic is the same as an EX schematic (and I think it is), the circuit for this indicator light is dirt simple except the ground for the light, comes from the cruise unit.

http://kioti.dyndns.org/ex_Schematic.pdf

So I think Nick has a cruise unit that fails to provide the ground for the battery light and also fails to provide the ground for the start relay when the cruise unit/module gets hot. It would be nice to take voltage readings at the cruise unit connector during the failure mode, but that's hard to do given the unit location and sealing of that connector.

I predict that the new switch and relay from the dealer will make no difference. I think we know enough to recommend replacing the cruise unit. See if you can get the dealer to send a new cruise unit.

I will call my dealer this morning. How would I test the cruise unit? That schematic is great, It might as well be in Chinese though. I don't do that well with electricity. I am a quick learner though! anyone want to try and teach??

Nick

TJP89 · Nov 17, 2014

Nick61 said:
I will call my dealer this morning. How would I test the cruise unit? That schematic is great, It might as well be in Chinese though. I don't do that well with electricity. I am a quick learner though! anyone want to try and teach??

Nick

I'm no expert, and the cruise module looks like it does a lot. But the general gist of that is that that module takes inputs from the various tranny sensors and charges and outputs to a lot of other indicators and switches

Basically, if that things is messed up, something is going to go wrong, and from the fact that the battery light is not on when it should be, and no start, says that the inputs from the neutral start switch and charging system are not being read right, as everything else seems fine. The culprit for both these symptoms is the cruise module, as both run through it. Testing the module is apt to be interesting, because it has so many inputs and outputs. At this point, I would just replace it. If you don't feel comfortable doing that yourself, have the dealer do it, as I believe your tractor should still be under warranty.

I didn't look and the schematic that closely, and am no expert, and someone else will give a better and more technical answer.

Nick61 · Nov 17, 2014

I sent a detailed email to my dealer to forward to Kioti. They are also sending me out a new cruise module as well as the new ignition switch and relay. I will keep all of you informed on what happens next. I am going to cross my fingers that this will solve the problem.

Thanks to All,
Nick

ritcheyvs · Nov 17, 2014

Nick61 said:
I sent a detailed email to my dealer to forward to Kioti. They are also sending me out a new cruise module as well as the new ignition switch and relay. I will keep all of you informed on what happens next. I am going to cross my fingers that this will solve the problem. ...

Recommend you change only one thing at a time or you'll never be sure what really caused the problem. Because the problem is semi-intermittent, test the fix long enough that you are sure it's really fixed. Finally, based on your symptoms, recommend you swap the cruise unit first because it's the most likely cause.

kco · Nov 18, 2014

Nick61 said:
Here we go again. I had this problem 6 months ago and I have it again. Just a different problem now. The tractor wont start. I turn the ignition switch on and I have dash lights. I try to start and i get and hear nothing. I swap connectors on the relays on the firewall and it still wont start. I put a jumper wire into the starter connection after unplugging from the relay and she fires up. I also try to wiggle the key in the ignition switch and that does nothing. I got a lot of help on this one back then, I'm hoping I can get this fixed quick. It's a pain doing the jumper wire every time i need to start. Well, at least it starts. I have also cleaned the negative and positive battery cables.

Thanks,
Nick

My 2011 DK35SE HST (780 hrs) began shown the same starting problem 12 to 18 months ago. As in the OP case, the "N" light is on.

The first few times(which occured weeks apart)the tractor started simply by turning the key off/on. However this summer that did not work, so I started it by jumping the starter solenoid at the starter. I hung the jumper wire from the fender grab handle ("just in case") and had to use it one other time about three weeks ago.

So I'm watching this thread with interest. If mine does finally completely fail I hope it is the starter relay($24)or key switch($100) and finally cruise unit($210). Of course the final price would be more in $CDN.

Addition: Hmmm......just rereading after posting and realise my problem could be the connection on the starter relay from the starter solenoid. I know the battery and main connection are fine but I have not checked that connection. I'll do that.

Nick61 · Nov 19, 2014

ritcheyvs said:
Recommend you change only one thing at a time or you'll never be sure what really caused the problem. Because the problem is semi-intermittent, test the fix long enough that you are sure it's really fixed. Finally, based on your symptoms, recommend you swap the cruise unit first because it's the most likely cause.

For sure the cruise unit will be what I swap out first. I really don't think it is the ignition switch because it starts up cold. Plus, the tractor is inside and out of the elements.

Nick

Nick61 · Dec 10, 2014

So, I received my new parts from the dealer. (relay, key switch and cruise module) The dealer had me replace the relay and Module first, Ran it for a while doing work and FAIL. Shut it of and tried to crank over, no crank. Then I replaced the key switch. Couldn't run it because of work and weather. Ran it yesterday getting ready for a storm, shut her off after a while and NO CRANK. This is getting old. I think I am going to have to take her to the dealer which is 120 miles away. Anyone else have anymore ideas???

Nick

ritcheyvs · Dec 10, 2014

Nick61 said:
... Ran it yesterday getting ready for a storm, shut her off after a while and NO CRANK. This is getting old. I think I am going to have to take her to the dealer which is 120 miles away. Anyone else have anymore ideas???

Nick

Well, you replaced all the parts that are likely to cause this problem so, unless the replacement cruise module is also bad, it's starting to look like a wiring harness or main connector problem. Since (1) the tractor is under warranty, (2) the problem is very repeatable with a warm tractor, and (3) you aren't into reading schematics, the dealer may be your best option.

There are dtill things you could do to troubleshoot it yourself but without the real DK40SE schematic and wiring harness diagram, it's hard to advise detailed steps. As far as I can tell, you've replaced all the plug-in parts that could cause the problem, which suggests a problem with the wiring harness or wiring harness connectors (which are inconveniently located under the floor). I'm sure several folks here will be interested in whatever you eventually discover.