Toplink DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LINK ?

tc35dforme · Jul 17, 2003

Hi,

I recently installed a Tisco Hydraulic top link on my TC35D. The rear remote is a factory NH setup. I notice when using the box blade that the piston will move in and out with the force created by the movement of the tractor against the blade. If I twitch the lever, the problem seems to go away for a while.

Do I have an air bubble trapped somewhere in the loop ?? The unit has been on for a month and has been moved full stroke many times.

Do I need to add hydro check valves on the piston ??

Thanks ...again

Mosey · Jul 18, 2003

I'm starting to regret buying a Tisco! See Hydraulic side link settles. My Gearmore top link has never settled or moved unless I move the lever.

tc35dforme · Jul 18, 2003

Danny,

I think I had an air bubble in the cylinder. I dropped it down and let it hang...cycled it full stroke several times and it seems fine. We'll see how it runs over the next couple of weeks.

It seems to be plenty tight when I operate it ( good seals ). It can flop my heavy duty boxblade ( Midwest BB30-72 ) back and forth even when full of dirt. And it will stay there now that the air is out.

Mosey · Jul 18, 2003

( I think I had an air bubble in the cylinder. I dropped it down and let it hang...cycled it full stroke several times and it seems fine.)

I guess I'll give that a try. I usually leave it most of the way up, so I'll extended it all the way out and let it sit overnight that way and see if that helps. Thanks.

Slamfire · Jul 18, 2003

If you were to put a check valve in the hydraulics, and hit something immovable you couldn't see the implement will be unable to kick up, and the tractor can go over backwards.

John_Mc · Jul 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

( If you were to put a check valve in the hydraulics, and hit something immovable you couldn't see the implement will be unable to kick up, and the tractor can go over backwards. )

Can't see how this would be much of a danger, since a cylinder with a check valve should work pretty much like the manually adjustable link that came standard with the tractor... at least as far as not letting the implement "kick up".

John Mc

Slamfire · Jul 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

Oh yeah, that was them old drawbar tractors that flipped over. Danged old timers disease. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif On your 3 point, if the top link is ridgid and you hook somethin' immovable, you either run out of traction or bend the heck outa your implement. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

OkieG · Oct 18, 2003

tc35dforme, Mosey, John Mc, and anyone with hydraulic Top Link experience,

Can you give an update on the Top Link settling issue?

Last weekend I finished my hydraulic Top Link project (Prince control valve and cylinder), and though I am pleased with it, it allows implements to settle. But, that's no different than with my Front End Loader or BackHoe. They also settle.

While at first, a faulty cylinder was what I was thinking, I've been told that hydraulic fluid most likely leaks back through the control valve (rather than the cylinder) and tolerances are such that leak back should be expected. Something about "metal to metal fits" in the control valves always allow some leakage.

I haven't used my BoxBlade yet, but I've noticed that the back end of the BrushHog drifts down about an inch a minute when up in transport mode.

Thanks,

OkieG

Rowski · Oct 18, 2003

I have a toplink from CCI. It has double pilot valves. No setting, even if not in use for a while.

My thread about my HTL... with pictures of the double pilot valves.

OkieG · Oct 18, 2003

I have a toplink from CCI. It has double pilot valves. No setting, even if not in use for a while.


Rowski, your feedback is appreciated. Good to hear settling is not a problem using the check valve. Does having the check valve cause any problems that you know of??

I have talked to CCI (Mark) several times over the past months. First time, the end of May. I wanted the HTL for summer. Mark had just sold his last Top Link cylinder with the intregral check valve. New ones were to arrive in July. July came, and no cylinders. Exchange rate was the culprit. Maybe new cylinders by September, I was told. September came and no cylinders. Cylinders are a side-line and not our bread and butter business. Maybe this winter or next spring, I was told.

Well, I don't blame Mark. Cylinders are not his main business. I was willing to wait, cuz I thought a built-in check valve was a too cool idea and I couldn't find that type cylinder anywhere else. But, I got tired of waiting.

Some folks may be lucky enough to not have any drift down of their implement cylinders, but I have noticeable drift with my FEL, BackHoe and my new hydraulic Top Link. Each uses a different control valve and different hyd. cylinders. So, for me, I think check valves are the solution.

I don't know anyone who has check valves on their tractor, so Rowski, you are answering my main question...check valves work!

Is there any downside to having a check valve in the circuit?? I've heard the double pilot valves can chatter sometimes. Is that a problem?? Do you notice any difference, in general, using a circuit with a check valve versus one without?

Has anyone used a single pilot check valve for anything? To keep a BackHoe boom from drifting down, it seems like a single pilot check valve would be the ticket. Any ideas?

OkieG

John_Mc · Oct 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

( I haven't used my BoxBlade yet, but I've noticed that the back end of the BrushHog drifts down about an inch a minute when up in transport mode.)

Are you talking about an inch of cylinder movement, or an inch of drop at the back end of your brushhog? If it's cylinder movement, an inchper minute is definitely an excessive drop. If it's the back end of your BrushHog, I'm not sure, but it still seems high to me. If not measured the drop rate on my toplink, but with the Brush mower or my Boxblabe on, I seem to get about 0.5-0.75 inches of cylinder movement in about 15 minutes on my hydraulic side link.

If you don't hear what you need here, Bird is also very knowledgable on "Top-N-Tilt" systems. Try dropping him a line.

John Mc

JerryG · Oct 20, 2003

Your doing better than I am with CCI. I e-mailed Mark several months ago and he got right back with me that time. I had several things that I wanted to order, but I wanted to get them all at once. The HTL was not available and Mark said that it would be a few months before it would be in. I have sense e-mailed them two more times and haven't gotten any replies. I know that Internet sales are a pain and that e-mails must seem endless sometimes, but you would think that I would get some kind of reply. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

OkieG · Oct 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

 Are you talking about an inch of cylinder movement, or an inch of drop at the back end of your brushhog? 

John Mc,
There's about an inch of drop/minute at the back end of the brushhog. I didn't measure it, but as I sat in the tractor seat, I could see it slowly dropping.

Do you have any check valves in your 3PH system?

OkieG

Junkman · Oct 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

considering the demand for them, I would think that they would put a rush on the order....... that is, unless it is a supply issue at the manufacturer.. .. I am patiently waiting for them to return to inventory..... Paul

OkieG · Oct 20, 2003

you would think that I would get some kind of reply 

JerryG,

The feeling I get is that CCI has a lot of irons in the fire, trying to grow and manage his business.

OkieG

OkieG · Oct 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

 I am patiently waiting for them to return to inventory 
So was I.
The cylinder is an import from Italy. I don't think supply is the issue. Though, as I recall, there is a minimum order Mark has to make and he felt the exchange rate would require him to raise his price on the cylinders.

Some companies sell small check valves that can be plumbed into the Top Link circuit. That is the path I am considering now.

OkieG

Junkman · Oct 20, 2003

Re: DO I NEED A CHECK VALVE ON MY HYDRAULIC TOP LI

even if the exchange rate isn't as favorable as it was in the past, to be out of product when there are sales waiting is like turning away customers...... even if the price needs to be adjusted, it is better than loosing sales..... You can't sell out of an empty basket!!!!!!!!

HayDR · Oct 20, 2003

These hydraulic toplinks are made in Italy. Realize that we need to fill a container with $40,000-60,000 of value to keep the shipping cost down. That means we have to purchase that amount of products or wait until the correct time to purchase. The US dollar has lost 25% since we last purchased most of the European goods. We have looked at Chinese and Indian MFG's but currently we have not been able to work a deal with them yet. We can offer the TISCO hyd. cylinders as others but their quality is not consistent. I sure apologize for not being able to fill your orders in a timely manner. We even flew in some hyd. cylinders and sold them at dead cost but selling at cost does nobody any good. We have containers from Italy to arrive in Dec. and we will have some cylinders on these containers. We understand if you can not wait until we are restocked and purchase from other sources. Thanks for giving us a chance for your business.

Junkman · Oct 20, 2003

Thanks for the explanation... I am going to wait. I rather have the one that works, than one that sometimes works. Didn't realize that you had to fill a container to get them. When I was importing from the orient, I would get partial shipments that came in mixed containers because my products would never fill a container, no matter how much I tried. If they did, it would last into the next millennium. I assumed that you were sourcing them inside of the USA.
Thanks for the update......

JerryG · Oct 20, 2003

Mark,
Thanks. I don't think that anyone was upset or anything. Everyone just wanted some information so that we would know when to contact you again. Thanks again and waiting patiently /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif