Does anyone have experience with concrete paint?

[JCS_in_KY]

Hopefully it's ok to ask this here, it's the building where I'm going to be storing my tractor so it's somewhat tractor related.

I recently had a 3120 square foot slab poured for a new metal building on our property. The guys that were doing the work came from out of town and were staying in a local motel. They poured the main floor late in the day and tt was cold so the concrete took a long time to setup enough to get a trowling machine on. It was about 11 PM and they told me they were going back to the motel to sleep for 2 hours and then they were going to come finish the work up. When I went out the next morning at 6:30 I found that they hadn't come back during the night. Turns out they went back, and fell asleep for hours. By the time they got on the floor with the machine it was setup so much they couldn't get out several high spots. Now I'm going to pay someone to come in and grind the high spots down but then I'll need to paint the floor to make it look right. I need a fairly thick finish to help hide some of the defects and I want something durable. Any ideas on what paint to use?
John

 

[Wesdor]

We just finished a new home in November and I want to paint the garage floor. I purchased floor paint at Menard's but the weather turned cold before I could paint. When I read the instructions, this paint said to not use it if the temperature of the concrete or air was less than 50.

I'm guessing you are going to find out much the same. I plan to give it an acid wash next spring and then paint.

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Hiya JCS, how goes it? God, what a pain in the a$$ for you that those guys fell asleep! I run toward the (recovering) perfectionist side, and that would have flipped me right out. But you know what, like anything else in life, best to look at the good things that come out of any situation. With every really bad thing that happens to us, there is always a good part of it. And sometimes, as in the case of your floor, you end up being better off in the long run - I think you're really going to like having a (2-part epoxy) painted floor.

I put a lift into one of my three bays, and decided to epoxy the floor in the lift area. It really is nice, and has a lot of advantages. The main thing is that it's easy to keep clean! A lot easier to clean than concrete, that's for sure. Some hot water, powdered "Tide" and a mop and your shop will look like the one those two TV guys have who soup up the trucks and never seem to get dirty and their shop floor looks like it came from the lobby of the Trump Tower.

Anyway, it's just a nice way to work and it makes for a great-looking shop. If you drop a big blob of grease on the floor, you just wipe it up insted of smearing it into the concrete.

You'll have to wait a while from the time of the fateful pour, 30 days minimum but I'd go 2-3 months at least. You're going to be spending a lot of money to do 3,000 sq. ft., and you don't want moisture problems.

I believe you'll have to wash the floor down first with diluted muriatic acid, then rinse, then allow to dry well, like another day or two. My floor was about 20 years old and pretty grimy, yours will be easier to clean and etch.

That's the nice thing about having the floor painted. You can clean small areas, or the whole thing, in stages if you want. You'd probably never be wanting to splash muriatic acid around in your shop to clean a concrete floor, and it would just keep getting dirtier and greasier. A good tough epoxy floor could stand up to probably 50 scrubbings with a nice powerful floor cleaning machine if you want it looking like new.

As far as brands, I used a good top-grade Rustoleum 2-part epoxy that I got from Grainger. Home Cheapo carries it too, might not be the same grade though. I would think that any brand-name 2-part epoxy you can get the best deal on would be the way to go. I'd definitely get it in 5's, 1 gal. cans would kill you. You might need 15-20 gallons to do your floor, more if you put a second coat, which might not be a bad idea at all. Now's the time. It's not a bad job, sure beats painting a ceiling. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif I happen to like the nice light-to-medium gray.

Anyway, good luck with it, enjoy your nice epoxy floor, and hey, you might even get your own TV show out of it - "Pimp My Tractor, with JCS". Don't forget to give me a "shout out" during your Emmy Award acceptance speech. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

John D.

 

[aloha]

You might try something like Tamoseal. As its name implies, it is intended to be a concrete sealer, but probably would be good for your purpose, too. I just used it to seal a CMU foundation and was impressed with the way it went on. It did an excellent job of filling the pores of the CMU blocks and with 2 coats gave a fairly uniform appearance. It comes in at least 3 colors, including light gray. Its surface would be less slippery than epoxy or similar. I have no idea how well it would wear.

The manufacturer says "TAMOSEAL is a portland cement based material for positive side waterproofing of concrete potable water vessels. TAMOSEAL is polymer modified (with AKKRO 7T) and when properly applied becomes an integral part of the surface. TAMOSEAL fills and seals the pores and voids in the surface but allows full breathing."

Tamoseal

 

[BB_TX]

I have a similar 1200 sq ft building. I just used the basic grey floor paint from Home Depot. Easy to put on and looks good and, as previously mentioned, makes cleanup a lot easier. Grease/oils clean up with a little soap and water. And also eliminates the inherent concrete dust. But. I sorta wish I had gone the next step and put on one of the epoxy based coverings. Not that I really needed it, but they sure look nice.

 

[Deerlope]

Go to any building suppy store and ask what they have for a concrete sealer. When I built 10 years ago the concrete guy had me get a clear saeler made by UGL, he said that I could roll it on or put it on using a pump-up garden sparyer. I oped for the sparyer. Worked super.

 

[Eric_Phillips]

Just be aware that concrete sealers have changed a lot in the last couple of years. We just built a new house last year and the mason commented on how environmental regulations have forced out the really good sealers. So the stuff now might not be as good as the stuff you used 10 years ago. I am not saying to not use a sealer just do some homework first.

Eric

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Aloha, Aloha /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I like your suggestion about filling in voids or imperfections before painting, if the floor needs it. A coat of paint, epoxy or otherwise, won't make an irregular surface smooth.

But I just checked the Tamoseal website and in section 8: Cautions they say not to use Tamoseal on "traffic-bearing surfaces". I had suspected it wasn't for floors, but looks great for sealing concrete and masonry walls, tanks, ponds etc.

To the original poster: I've seen many other products that are used to smooth concrete floors prior to tiling, installing carpet, etc. Maybe check first to make sure they're compatible with epoxy paint if you go that route.

I still strongly advocate using the 2-part epoxy - while it's slightly more "slick" than concrete, it has never been an issue for me. Plus, that slight "slickness" is what gives it its good qualities like appearance, toughness and washability. (I've always heard that the glossier a finish, the more durable it is).
And the two-part epoxies will outlast a one-part paint probably 5 to 1 - one of those "pay me now, or pay me later" deals (although that line came from a commercial for Fram oil filters, which I wouldn't recommend to my worst enemy).

By the way, I hope the "Snooze Brothers" are paying for all of this - did they have liability insurance? It sounds as if you have a doozy of a claim. I'm sure they're nice guys and all, but business is business. You screw up, and you or your insurance company, or both, pay up.

Good luck, John D.

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Just to recap - from JCS's original post:<font color="blue"> Now I'm going to pay someone to come in and grind the high spots down but then I'll need to paint the floor to make it look right. I need a fairly thick finish to help hide some of the defects and I want something durable. Any ideas on what paint to use? </font>

 

[JCS_in_KY]

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I woke up this morning with a bad cold but when I'm feeling better I'm going to go up to Lowes and check to see what they carry. We've got a small local hardware store here but they are terribly expensive and all they carry are the 1 gallon / quart two part combos packed with the flakes to mox in and a DVD about application, all in a fancy box for almost $90.00. I know I can do quite a bit better if I find the 5 gallon cans.
To answer your question about who is paying for it, we've withheld final payment on the building and are making deductions for grinding, paint, etc. Unfortunately this contractor came highly recommended from the company I purchased my building from and they turned out to be a bunch of flakes. It only got worse as they got further into the project. The worst of the damages after the slab incident included taking my brand new 12x1`12 curtain rolling door, laying it on the back of their truck bed and on their scaffolding and getting a bunch of large dents in it. The directions with the door say to only lift it using soft forklift blades or something similar. Hopefully we can get everything straightened out soon, it's frustrating to have a new building sitting there and not be able to use it because of water leaks, not being able to close the door, uneven slab.
John

 

[JustGary]

Ouch.

I helped install an epoxy floor in a showroom about 20 years ago. It really came out nice, but they occasionally do touch-up on high traffic areas.

We mixed the paint in a low-sided wheelbarrow and then dipped our rollers and started painting. It was big enough that a half dozen guys could reach it and keep painting. The wheelbarrow lasted many years out in the weather after that.

Be sure to use adequate ventilation, because the fumes from the epoxy will eventually get to you. If the job seems like it's getting easier and more fun as you go, step outside for a breather. It's not quite that fun.

If you have concerns about the slick finish, sprinkle a bit of clean sand on the floor while the first coat is still wet. Try a kitchen sifter if the sand is small enough, but practice somewhere first to get good at putting out a little sand without making piles anywhere. A coffee can with an appropriate screen bottom would work also. Just tap the side of the can to dispense a little. The trick is in using very little sand. The second coat of paint will seal it in, and you'll still be able to wipe up spills.

- Just Gary

 

[Farwell]

JCS,
Not sure who makes it, but there is a cement product made for your problem. It is a self leveling coat that adheres to the cement and is approximately 1/2 inch thick, or as thick as you need, if I remember correctly. I saw the product at a home show in Mid Michigan a couple of years ago. Research it on the Internet before you do any painting. Do not know the cost either. There are paint coats out there that will adhere to cement, but it has been my experience that they will eventually wear through from frequent use.
Farwell

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Here's an idea: have the Bobsey Twins' insurance pay for jackhammering your floor out and having a new one installed by someone who won't fall asleep halfway through the job. Assuming they're insured, I'd be on the phone to their agent, their insurance company, my homeowner's insurance agent and my lawyer, in no particular order.

There's no way you should be going through all this because of their obvious screw-up. And I'd like to see you get a brand-new overhead door while you're at it.

 

[CAMinTX]

Epoxy paint is probably your best bet. I would like to suggest that you contact a "real" paint store. Sherwin-Williams, for instance, specializes in industrial coatings. It would be a good idea to contact you closest SW store and run it by those guys. It would also be a good idea to ask to speak with the manager or assistant manager as they will have the best product knowledge.

 

[Cormac]

Sherwin Williams is the largest paint manufacturer in the world. They seem to have a quality product for everything. They have a product called H & C concrete stain. While a stain won't provide the "hide" that you are looking for, a nice thing about stains versus paints is that stains do not peel. For the ultimate in durability and coverage (and price) some are using Polyureas (bedliner) to cover flooring. I would guess that Polyureas will easily run $3-$5 per square foot or more though. There is another product that may be appropriate called Skid Proof by Seal Krete. It comes in a 5 gallon bucket that contains 4 gallons. You add a gallon of paint in your favorite color and mix. Seal Krete is out of Florida, does not allow tire marks, and you can get it at Sherwin William, ICI, and other major paint chains. BTW, other than the stain you may have to prep the floor via acid wash or shot blasting to get adhesion with most coatings. Finally, another option could be a deck coating like those used around pools, just don't apply the texture coat and knockdown, just the skim coat.

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Here's a link to a site that contains just about everything one might ever need to know about epoxy products, including floor coatings. The site is a little disorganized, but there's a LOT here, including a link to a very informative Rustoleum page. Epoxy Products.com

I really can't concur with some of the "negatives" that have been expressed about epoxy floor coatings. Mine is not slippery, will probably NEVER peel, and after 4 years shows virtually no sign of wear. Epoxy is very tough stuff, that's one reason it costs so much. And if I want to recoat it ten years from now, I won't have to do very much prep work to have it looking brand new.

Sounds to me as if you don't want any reminders of this fiasco down the road, so a nice epoxy finish might be just the ticket.

Good luck, John D.

 

[BigAl]

I had an old building that was rebuilt for my shop . The concrete floor was a mess. Scarred up ,rough and uneven . After painting it for years and always having to redo it, I went to Home Depot and bought a thin set material to overlay the old slab .It is made to do just that . I pressured washed the old paint and removed whatever would come off . I applied the thin set as directed and have not had any problems since . No flaking,cracking or peeling . I went over paint in places too . It has been 6 years and the stuff is still perfect . Cost to do about 700 sq. feet was $125 plus my time . It varies 1/8" to 1/2 " thick where it filled in my low spots . It looks just like a fine finish concrete slab that no one can tell the difference .It even filled the old cracks and never cracked .

 

[JCS_in_KY]

I will probably go the epoxy route. Having the guy we hired pay to have the slab removed and replaced would be ideal and I considered trying to go that route that but the way he's setup he's really got no assets to go after, no bank account from what we can tell and it would probably all be a big waste of time for us. It's a big mess and I think we are better off making the best of a bad situation and moving on. We just need to get the building finished up so we can use it. It was disappointing because he came highly recommended by the building company (Kentucky Steel Truss Inc.) and they use him to sell their buildings. Once we can get the building fixed up it will be a nice building but to get to that point we need to fix these slab issues, take care of the door problems, fix some crooked windows that also leak, and a bunch of other things like that. I'm going to see if I can find a Sherwin Williams dealer near me and see what they've got for paint. Around here lots of people use Porter Paint but it doesn't look like they make an epoxy concrete finish.

 

[cmuncy]

If you are withholding the last payment for the labor for installation then I would NOT do any kind of repairs to the building, including leveling/grinding/painting the slab.

Check your local laws but I believe that given notice, the company that provided the labor has a given amount of tiem to make amends, which, after that, you would probably have to take them to small claims court.

Also, here in Texas, most steel building manufacturers will only provide a list of conttractors that will erect the building, not specify a particular company. Limits liability. So if your metal manufacturer did specificly mention the contactor, they might be held liable as well.

I just wanted to bring this issue up to make sure you don't get stuck.

 

[CT_Tree_Guy]

Good points cmuncy, I sure don't want to see John get stuck either. John, did these guys have liability insurance? Even if they have few assets, their insurance company is another story.

Here in CT, small claims is limited to amounts of $3,500 if memory serves, but the system works well.

Also, I'm wondering just how bad the floor really is? When I first read your post it conjured up quite a mental image. Have you talked or met with the guy who would be doing the smoothing/grinding? If so, what's his "take" on it? Piece of cake, or rip this mess up and start over?