Does Grubbing Mesquite Work?

[C4Ranch]

I have 3 old fields that have mesquite starting to take over. Fields haven't been in production for over 10 yrs and mesquites are about 4-10' tall.

Does grubbing kill it for good or will it just cause the root to sprout back with avengence? If it does kill it, is it depth dependent? Do I need to spray in addition to grubbing?

TIA!

J

 

[yellowdogsvc]

Getting it out by the roots should kill it. Of course, other beans that get turned over or small mesquites you missed, will help it take over again.

I suggest getting them out and then mowing as low as you can to get any young ones. You may have to mow a couple of times before you kill it but the roots can only hold so much energy for regeneration before they give up and die.

Using an excavator will probably turn over the soil less.

 

[RDrancher]

Browne Bros. makes a QA grubber. Browne Bros., Inc. - Colorado City, TX - TEXAS - Excavator Grubbers and Rakes - Dozer Grubbers and Rakes - Range Management Tools - Grubbing - Mesquite Control - Brush Control - Hotshot Trucking Oddessa Texas - Advanced implements for brush management

Member tmc_31 has a version of it that he says works good. He has a thread on it here... What price for grubbing mesquite?

 

[tonyoz]

The university of Texas have some real good info about grubbing mesquite, it's well worth a look

 

[texasjohn]

This question comes up every year.

Mesquite « Texas Natural Resources Server

The above is the only way to get rid of mesquite, IMHO. I have used their formula for both Reclaim and Remedy...with great success. Now is the time of year to use these products.

Yes, getting the plant out by the roots (not cutting off at ground level) will work...BUT ONLY IF YOU GET ALL ROOT BUDS OUT OF THE GROUND...AND THEY GO DOWN A FOOT OR MORE ALONG EACH ROOT.

I have lots of experience, over years, with eradication of mesquite exactly like you say you have. For me, mechanical removal was beyond the equipment I had, thus herbicide was my only option. And, it's a continual battle since beans will be dormant for 15 or so years and then sprout.

 

[C4Ranch]

Thanks texasjohn! So do you think this will do any good?
Jones Machine Shop

Medium size, 27" blade, is said to be for 40-80hp.

Thx

 

[texasjohn]

Yes, that underground blade will do the trick assuming you have the horsepower to pull it thru your soil. Only you know if you have sandy or black land or rocks, etc...and can get to the mesquite you need to get to with your equipment. One advantage of a spray rig is that it goes anywhere a hose will go. I would think you would want something in the range of 65 hp or up...just kinda guessing...you are going to need lots of traction...any chance you can try several different sizes to see which works best for your conditions??

You said you have 10 ft tall mesquites.... I am not sure how these will flow thru the blade....will they get tangled up and you have to back up/get off tractor to get them loose?? You will need to run the blade about a foot deep and hopefully soil conditions will allow roots to pull out some rather than just cut off the root. This will address the root bud problem I mentioned.

Then, how are you going to avoid flats??

Yes, you will also need a spray rig...for those you can't get to, and those which come up after grubbing, and those you spot and don't want to re install the grubber at that moment. And, there will be a lot of these. You just gotta plan for a several year program....think at least 5 years.

Hmm...I see you have a L5240...about what I have...again, I think you should really find a way to try out the blade on your tractor to see how it works for your conditions of soil and trees. Also, I worry a little about you driving over the bigger trees and having them punch into some underpart of the tractor...the hydraulic filters, for example, are exposed, maybe other stuff, wires, etc.....It feels like you are on the lower end of the horsepower needed for your larger trees...but a trial would tell the tale.

 

[C4Ranch]

Great input, thank you!

Yeah, I've got concerns about the underbelly and getting flats.... Was considering chainsawing the taller ones and grubbing the smaller stubbs but that may result in more work than just spraying.

The fields are rather soft and have been plowed with terrace berms here and there.

Looking across the fields as the mesquite are starting to leaf out looks a little undaunting, couple hundred.... Was thinking it would be easier to sit in the a/c cab than running around spraying everything but maybe not.

I have a 25gal spray tank with booms/wand sprayer Ive used around my main house so I might try that out, remedy/reclaim ain't cheap stuff....

This guys shop is in Vernon so it's about a 2hr drive, I may see if he has any I can try and he does state a satisfaction guarantee.

 

[texasjohn]

The only reason to grub mesquite is to get rid of the brush in a short time so you can further plow/plant the field.

If you are not going to do this, then, by far, the cheapest approach is to use spray. The time involved and fuel for tractor is vastly less than a grubbing approach. And, if you already have a spray rig, then you also save the cost of purchasing the grubber. If you spray, under optimal conditions, you can get about a 90% kill rate every time you spray. So, make a round, wait a couple of weeks and see which plants you missed and make another round, repeat. The following year, repeat. If you use a foliar spray, you MUST get EVERY branch/set of leaves sprayed. If you miss a branch, the following year all the plant will be dead EXCEPT that branch and its related roots...so just spray it again.

The basal spray method works very well on the size trees you have as long as the bark is smooth...but you must spray ALL around EACH trunk, regardless of size, for about a vertical foot near the ground.

Foliar spray should be done just after the leaves turn from "new" green to the dark green...at this point the roots are replenishing their resources and spray is most easily absorbed and transported to the root system.

I've used both spray systems with excellent results...it is clear that careful and complete application is the secret. Get sloppy, you get erratic results. I have found a hand wand to be the best for spraying...can be precise in placing the spray, and puts expensive spray exactly where you want it...minimum lost spray.

If you, truly, have only a couple hundred plants, the spray approach would definitely be my recommendation, as long as you don't need an immediate clean field. I fear you may have under estimated the actual number.

 

[C4Ranch]

Thanks John! Yeah, I'll bet you're right....I'm sure I have 2x or 3x the number... Man they're evasive...

Spraying seems like the best route... I'm not planning on putting the fields in production anytime soon, maybe a few smaller food plots, just want to keep from being taken completely over by mesquites. Would love to get several hundred live oaks planted around the perimeter but the drought has taken a toll and haven't figured out how to get that started yet.

J

 

[texasjohn]

Use the Brush Busters formula, you'l be happy.

Only solution for keeping small trees going during drought is to add water. Labor intensive way is to stake down a 5 gallon bucket adjacent to tree, fill and let small hole do drip irrigation for you. fill daily

 

[tmc_31]

C4Ranch, I have done several land clearing projects (mesquite clearing mostly) over the last several years for customers. I live and work just west of you around the Abilene area so I am familiar with what you are dealing with. I use a skid loader with a sheepsfoot grubber similar to the one shown on the Brown Brothers web site. This works very well for what it is. As long as the diameter of the Mesquite is less than 2" or so and the soil conditions are right, they will come out pretty readily. If the soil is dry they can be a real pain to get out. The sheepsfoot grubber seems to work best within a week after a 1"-2" rain in our area. When the soil conditions are right, I can take out a Mesquite in this size range in one swipe and usually get it tap root and all. That is the ideal method of removal. Even if you don't get the tap root, as long as you get the basal nut (usually about 6"-8" below the surface) the tree will die and not come back. My sheepsfoot grubber usually contacts the plant 12"-16" below the surface. You can take out a much larger Mesquite with this tool by using it to dig around the tree on at least three sides, then getting under the tree and lifting it out. This can take a good bit more time. Another issue that affects how well the grubber works is whether the plant is new growth or regrowth from a root that was not killed. A lot of times a land owner will just mow his mesquites. In that case the trees will come back with a vengeance. Usually, if a tree just has one trunk, it will be new growth. If it has multiple trunks growing from a single point (more like a bush) it can indicate that there may be a big root down there. Again, you can still get that out, it just takes more time.

The grubber that I use actually belongs to a friend of mine that bought it for use on a small tractor with a front end loader. After he bought it, his tractor dealer warned him not to use the grubber on a tractor fel for fear of putting too much strain on and breaking the fel. He said that they were designed to be used on a skid steer where at initial plant contact the loader arms were down against the loader frame and well supported (not so much with a tractor). I can attest that you will put a lot of stress on the loader frame using a grubber like this.

Grubbing is an effective way to get rid of Mesquite. It is not fool proof. You will have some regrowth and you miss some trees while grubbing. It can be expensive and or time consuming and it is a never ending battle. I tend to agree with Texasjohn in that the best use for grubbing is for land that you want to put into production, such as the food plots that you want to clear. Most of the grubbing I've done has been to land that was going into production with one notable exception. That was a 34 acre pasture that I grubbed for a fellow that wanted the Mesquite out to improve the grazing on his pasture. Mesquites consume an inordinate amount of water, robbing more beneficial plants of needed moisture.

I have a grubber like the one shown on the Jones Machine Shop site for my tractor. It works pretty good if you knock the tree down and break it off at ground level with the fel first then get the root with the grubber. I quit using mine when I bent the top link on my tractor (it puts the top link in compression). I thought about trying a solid top link but decided I would rather sacrifice a top link as opposed to tearing up the axle housing on my tractor. I have found that the sheepsfoot grubber on the skid works better and faster than the one that goes on the 3pt on the tractor.

Tim

 

[texasjohn]

Wow, tmc, you did a superb write up of your experiences. Very complete and accurate. The OP now has a very complete understanding of what his options are for grubbing mesquite and pros and cons of using a grubber, either front or rear.

Great job!! Never seen better. It can't get any better.:thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[tmc_31]

Ha texasjohn, I can go a little overboard sometimes. Probably way more information than C4ranch wanted to know. He really probably wanted to know if C4 will take out Mesquites (it will).

Tim

 

[texasjohn]

tmc, no, no, no....you're keeping it real....the answer to almost any question can be yes, but....there are some things you need to know...

and, it's the things you need to know that determine the ultimate understanding and decision criteria...at least if one is going to be satisfied in the long run.

Otherwise, one can just purchase stuff, try it out, and learn for your self.

"experience is a hard school, but some fools will learn in no other."

Well, I MUCH prefer to benefit from the experience of others, stand on their shoulders, and make my own new mistakes!!

Hmm...I have been told that, on occasion, I get carried away....could this be true??:anyone:

 

[joeu235]

I have 30 acres of neglected range land that is full of 10 year old mesquite bushes. I use my skid steer and root bucket shown in the picture. I can clear about an acre in 2 - 3 hours. Pulling the bushes out is almost fun, smoothing out all the ruts and stacking the pulled bushes is less fun. That grubbing attachment link above would take one **** of a tractor, at least on my clay land.

 

[C4Ranch]

Tim and Joe, great detail! Thank you!

Tim, still digesting it all and I love your real world experience.

What size tractor were you using when u bent the top link?

I can't imagine using a sheeps foot on FEL unless it was offset, I'd never be able to see it. Don't see how it could damage it though since the FEL would go into relief first wouldn't it?

Do they make a 3pt sheeps foot? Wondering if I could achieve similar results as a SS with my hydraulic top link to angle down then do a vertical lift with 3 pt? Even better if there was a hydraulic clamp to hang on to it after ripping out so I could drop off in a burn pile.

I like the idea of using my own equipment since that's why I have it but don't want to be bending over dollars to pick up dimes either...

 

[yellowdogsvc]

get a land plane.. You won't regret it. The JD LP78 works great to smooth out the ruts/dirt and even has hydraulic rippers for those few roots you miss.

 

[tmc_31]

C4ranch,

The tractor I was using when I bent my top link was my TN70D New Holland, 70hp(58hp pto), Class II hitch.

You are right, The sheepsfoot grubber was designed for use on a skid. You can see exactly where you are putting the grubber, not so easy on a tractor. I sure don't don't think I would want to offset the grubber an put an asymmetric load on the FEL on a tractor.

I have never seen a 3pt sheepsfoot grubber but I don't see why you couldn't have one built. It might pull through the ground easier than the standard 3pt grubber.

Talking about adding a hyd grabber so you can carry the tree to the burn pile, check out the root-n-all
Home Page

Imagine a 3pt version of that