JerryG
Super Member
If I may, I believe that he is referencing to the third arm bracket on the tractor end, as carrying the load. The chains attach to the 3/4" pin on the tractor and then, the 7/8" pins on the implement. (Cat 1)
Does your 3-point take a hydraulic beating
- Thread starter PineRidge
- Start date
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PineRidge
Super Member
OkieG I'm with you, I would like to see a picture as I can't make a visualization of the set up.
MMM
Platinum Member
I could cut quite a few acres in the time it took to figure this image deal out! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
JerryG
Super Member
MMM
Platinum Member
Well, the image showed up in the preview? Try it another way-
http://www.hpphoto.com/servlet/com.hp.HPGuestLogin?username=mnmmayhaw&password=38554331
http://www.hpphoto.com/servlet/com.hp.HPGuestLogin?username=mnmmayhaw&password=38554331
OkieG
Veteran Member
MMM,
Please excuse my ignorance, but what a peculiar looking set-up. Somebody put a lot of time in to figure that out. Does the bar with the pins on top connect to the toplink tractor mount?
Just when I think I'm starting to get a handle on things, something comes along that throws me. I appreciate the picture (and yours too Jerry). I think I have a little better idea of what you're talking about, but I've never seen anything like that at the tractor stores I've been to.
Remind me,...what does that set-up do for you?? Thanks again.
OkieG
Please excuse my ignorance, but what a peculiar looking set-up. Somebody put a lot of time in to figure that out. Does the bar with the pins on top connect to the toplink tractor mount?
Just when I think I'm starting to get a handle on things, something comes along that throws me. I appreciate the picture (and yours too Jerry). I think I have a little better idea of what you're talking about, but I've never seen anything like that at the tractor stores I've been to.
Remind me,...what does that set-up do for you?? Thanks again.
OkieG
MMM
Platinum Member
You won't see it in stores as it's an industrial cutter used in maintaining utility, etc, right of ways. Closest thing I've seen is BH406. The beast is rated for 4"dia, has 165hp gearbox and has 1/4" deck.
It is very heavy, hence the need for the lower link relief. The front of cutter is essentially carried by the chains instead of lift arms while mowing.
It is very heavy, hence the need for the lower link relief. The front of cutter is essentially carried by the chains instead of lift arms while mowing.
jinman
Rest in Peace
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2001
- Messages
- 19,898
- Location
- Texas - Wise County - Sunset
- Tractor
- NHTC45D, NH LB75B, Ford Jubilee
OkieG, I'm attaching a photo of my old Ford Jubilee with the setup Jerry showed. In principle, it works just like the one MMM posted. MMMs setup is adjustable in height by moving up and down the toplink whereas the chain setup is adjustable by taking up more or less links in the chain on each of the sidelinks.
In this photo I was also experimenting with using chain instead of a toplink because I was mowing on some very tough terrain. Some folks say this is dangerous if you hit something with the front lower lip of the mower and cause it to flip forward. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif I never had that problem. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Both of these setups are especially good if you have a 3PH that leaks down and you constantly have to correct for that leakage during mowing. It can also be used to relieve any pressure on your 3PH during mowing.
On my new tractor (NH TC45D) I never use this setup for mowing because the cutter is so light and the 3PH probably only has abotu 350# of load on it from my 5' cutter. I'd bet it is never over 500# even with the heaviest cutter as long as the tail wheel is on the ground. For long transports down a gravel road, I always just let my tailwheel ride on the road, and that also keeps more weight on the front wheels anyway.
PineRidge initially asked about his tractor's ability to lock the 3PH and I have checked my Repair Manual and have an answer for him. I'll do another post with the hydraulic circuit to discuss this issue separately.
In this photo I was also experimenting with using chain instead of a toplink because I was mowing on some very tough terrain. Some folks say this is dangerous if you hit something with the front lower lip of the mower and cause it to flip forward. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif I never had that problem. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Both of these setups are especially good if you have a 3PH that leaks down and you constantly have to correct for that leakage during mowing. It can also be used to relieve any pressure on your 3PH during mowing.
On my new tractor (NH TC45D) I never use this setup for mowing because the cutter is so light and the 3PH probably only has abotu 350# of load on it from my 5' cutter. I'd bet it is never over 500# even with the heaviest cutter as long as the tail wheel is on the ground. For long transports down a gravel road, I always just let my tailwheel ride on the road, and that also keeps more weight on the front wheels anyway.
PineRidge initially asked about his tractor's ability to lock the 3PH and I have checked my Repair Manual and have an answer for him. I'll do another post with the hydraulic circuit to discuss this issue separately.
Attachments
jinman
Rest in Peace
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2001
- Messages
- 19,898
- Location
- Texas - Wise County - Sunset
- Tractor
- NHTC45D, NH LB75B, Ford Jubilee
PineRidge's original question related to not having a physical lock feature for his NH TC40D. The attached hydraulic diagram should clear up this issue for our specific model of tractor, but there are no guarantees any other tractor is the same. My guess is that there are several with similar designs, but I'm the kind of person who wants to see the actual schematic and make my own personal decisions about my comfort level with the design.
In the attached diagram, the hydraulic pump and filter are shown on the left and immediately after the high pressure fluid leaves the pump, it goes to a relief valve. Therefore, the pumps outlet pressure is always limited by this relief valve (150 bar, 2135 lb) on our Boomers.
The fluid continues into the HPL control valve that provides position control to our 3PH. Inside the HPL valve, there is no pressure relief valve. Any pressure feedback from the lift cylinder assembly (ref no. 7 & 8) is felt by the HPL valve components. The pump relief valve will only be in the circuit while the 3PH is actively lifting a load. When the position control nulls out the control handle input, the lift cylinder becomes isolated from the pump circuit because the unloading valve opens and directs input fluid back to the reservoir.
There is, however, a pressure relief that is always in the system. That is a high pressure relief valve that is an integral part of the hydralic lift cylinder. That valve relieves pressure at 3650 psi (250 bar). It's function is to relieve extreme shock loads from the lift cylinder.
When the flow valve (ref no. 8) is fully closed, the shock pressure is relieved from the HPL valve and is only felt by the lift cylinder. The flow valve effectively isolates the entire HPL valve circuit from the shock. If there is damage, it will be limited to the lift cylinder only. Therefore it is my contention that this valve could be useful for locking the 3PH position because ultimate protection is still supplied by the high pressure relief valve and the HPL valve is completely protected. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
In the attached diagram, the hydraulic pump and filter are shown on the left and immediately after the high pressure fluid leaves the pump, it goes to a relief valve. Therefore, the pumps outlet pressure is always limited by this relief valve (150 bar, 2135 lb) on our Boomers.
The fluid continues into the HPL control valve that provides position control to our 3PH. Inside the HPL valve, there is no pressure relief valve. Any pressure feedback from the lift cylinder assembly (ref no. 7 & 8) is felt by the HPL valve components. The pump relief valve will only be in the circuit while the 3PH is actively lifting a load. When the position control nulls out the control handle input, the lift cylinder becomes isolated from the pump circuit because the unloading valve opens and directs input fluid back to the reservoir.
There is, however, a pressure relief that is always in the system. That is a high pressure relief valve that is an integral part of the hydralic lift cylinder. That valve relieves pressure at 3650 psi (250 bar). It's function is to relieve extreme shock loads from the lift cylinder.
When the flow valve (ref no. 8) is fully closed, the shock pressure is relieved from the HPL valve and is only felt by the lift cylinder. The flow valve effectively isolates the entire HPL valve circuit from the shock. If there is damage, it will be limited to the lift cylinder only. Therefore it is my contention that this valve could be useful for locking the 3PH position because ultimate protection is still supplied by the high pressure relief valve and the HPL valve is completely protected. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
Attachments
OkieG
Veteran Member
<font color="blue"> third arm bracket on the tractor end, as carrying the load. </font>
Is that a bracket that's not on a small tractor like mine? Is the toplink connector so strong that it's better to chain implement weight to it, rather than allow the lift arms to carry the load?
I can see the utility of the chains to limit drift down on a 3PH w/o position control.
Jerry, MMM and Jinman, thanks for your patience. I appreciate the education.
OkieG
Is that a bracket that's not on a small tractor like mine? Is the toplink connector so strong that it's better to chain implement weight to it, rather than allow the lift arms to carry the load?
I can see the utility of the chains to limit drift down on a 3PH w/o position control.
Jerry, MMM and Jinman, thanks for your patience. I appreciate the education.
OkieG
