Dont over think rear remotes

[nyone]

I was needing another pair of rear remotes to add to my factory set. Looking around I saw options from $600 plus hoses to $1500 for another factory pair. Not really liking those options I decided to put my own kit together. What you see is a $65 open center valve body and about $280 in hydraulic hoses and fittings. I simply disconnected the feed line to my loader valve and connected it to this. The output of this new valve went back to the loader valve. It just fits behild the seat of my NH TC40. Point being you dont need to over think this like I originally did.

 

[ptsg]

It may actually have to be over thought slightly, at least on how open center valves work.

Every time you use your factory remotes or the 3 pt hitch, you're pressurizing the Tank port and internal passages on the new valve which is not design for it at all.

You need to get the proper Power Beyond sleeve for that valve (those are specific to the make and model of valve), then this new line will feed the factory remotes and 3 pt hitch.

 

[oldnslo]

Another thought is if this is before the loader valve where is the relief valve located and operating the loader would then also pressurize the tank port.

I like your thinking but might need a little fine tuning.

 

[Harry in Ky]

Without a power beyond sleeve in the valve you risk having the downstream circuits blocked if/when you need the relief valve to function.

Overthinking might not be necessary, but underthinking can be dangerous. Probably a good thing you decided to show us your engineering. Better order the sleeve.

 

[old and tired]

You need to get the proper Power Beyond sleeve for that valve (those are specific to the make and model of valve)...

So his NH TC40 is open center but no mention of needing a "Power Beyond" plug... I'm just trying to learn what an "Open Center" system is vs. "Open Center with Power Beyond".

Is it two different animals???

 

[LouNY]

An "open center" hydraulic system circulates all the fluid the hydraulic pump is pumping through all of the control valves until a valve is actuated which is literally just blocking the normal circulating route and rerouting oil out of another port which is opened as the flow through port was closed.
This has the effect of pressurizing every thing in the flow path prior to that valve.

The following picture is how multiple control valves should be plumbed.
The internal porting in the control valve will direct high pressure oil to the activated A or B port at the same time the other A or B port will be directed to the tank line.

If T port is piped to a P port the first control valve will see pressure on the low pressure internal ports of it when the second valve is operated. This will often result in unintended operation of cylinders on the first valve because of pressure on the backside of the porting which should have been returned to the tank, very low pressure.

Also going in series using the T to the P port eliminates the relieving properties of the first valve.

These valves should always have the T port going to the "tank" reservoir which is a low pressure side of the system regardless of want the control valves do. The P and N ports are designed for the periodic applications of the system pressure when operated. The T port and line is not. The T ports and hosing can be tee's together as long as the sizing does not create back pressure.

 

[CalG]

My trouble with "under thinking" is the positioning of both the hose couplings and the control levers.

I did add a three spool "loader valve" to the Hurlimann. (That was an effort!) I used a Lamborghini valve just to keep in the spirit of the effort. (This Hurlimann 435 Prince was sold by Lambo dealers , but painted white...The SAME version was red ;-)

 

[nyone]

It may actually have to be over thought slightly, at least on how open center valves work.

Every time you use your factory remotes or the 3 pt hitch, you're pressurizing the Tank port and internal passages on the new valve which is not design for it at all.

You need to get the proper Power Beyond sleeve for that valve (those are specific to the make and model of valve), then this new line will feed the factory remotes and 3 pt hitch.

So I need the sleve on the T port and that's it? No 3rd line

 

[nyone]

An "open center" hydraulic system circulates all the fluid the hydraulic pump is pumping through all of the control valves until a valve is actuated which is literally just blocking the normal circulating route and rerouting oil out of another port which is opened as the flow through port was closed.
This has the effect of pressurizing every thing in the flow path prior to that valve.

The following picture is how multiple control valves should be plumbed.
The internal porting in the control valve will direct high pressure oil to the activated A or B port at the same time the other A or B port will be directed to the tank line.

If T port is piped to a P port the first control valve will see pressure on the low pressure internal ports of it when the second valve is operated. This will often result in unintended operation of cylinders on the first valve because of pressure on the backside of the porting which should have been returned to the tank, very low pressure.

Also going in series using the T to the P port eliminates the relieving properties of the first valve.

These valves should always have the T port going to the "tank" reservoir which is a low pressure side of the system regardless of want the control valves do. The P and N ports are designed for the periodic applications of the system pressure when operated. The T port and line is not. The T ports and hosing can be tee's together as long as the sizing does not create back pressure.
View attachment 3635621

Going by this diagram I need the power beyond sleve and to connect the T port to the cover on the 3rd function cap.

Does the valve in the pic even have a N port?

 

[Harry in Ky]

You're still not getting it. The sleeve goes in the N port and yes you need the third line. T port needs to connect to tractor sump by whatever means necessary. It can have a dedicated line to the tractor case or to a tee in the existing sump return line from the loader valve.

If the valve doesn't have an N port you bought the wrong valve.

 

[LouNY]

Going by this diagram I need the power beyond sleve and to connect the T port to the cover on the 3rd function cap.

Does the valve in the pic even have a N port?

That looks to be a P40 valve which could have come from Summit Hydraulics.
Yes it should have N port.
Viewing your picture on the upper right side is a plug right next to the T port.
That is were the power beyond spool would thread in and then your existing line on the T port would go to it and a new line from the T port to the tractors reservoir.


Power Beyond sleeve

 

[old and tired]

...what an "Open Center" system is vs. "Open Center with Power Beyond".

Is it two different animals???

This is for future readers (let me know if it's "bad" information!!!)

So looking more into it... Open Center (without power beyond) is a single valve with no more valves being powered down stream. Power IN and return to tank are the only 2 lines used.

Power Beyond can have multiple valves in series downstream if they also have power beyond (sleeve plug installed). They have 3 hoses going to the valve (in addition to the hoses for each valve).

 

[Gordon Gould]

This is for future readers (let me know if it's "bad" information!!!)

So looking more into it... Open Center (without power beyond) is a single valve with no more valves being powered down stream. Power IN and return to tank are the only 2 lines used.

Power Beyond can have multiple valves in series downstream if they also have power beyond (sleeve plug installed).

Yes you have it right. BUT, Just to confuse you, you can have valves in series down stream from a valve w/o a power beyond if the tank port on that valve is designed to take high pressure. Many electric 3rd function valves are like this - no power beyond capability but high pressure specs on tank/power out port. They are placed after the loader to ensure there is an active relief valve. Just check the valve specs carefully.

gg

 

[nyone]

That looks to be a P40 valve which could have come from Summit Hydraulics.
Yes it should have N port.
Viewing your picture on the upper right side is a plug right next to the T port.
That is were the power beyond spool would thread in and then your existing line on the T port would go to it and a new line from the T port to the tractors reservoir.


Power Beyond sleeve
View attachment 3635766

Thank you. I kind of figured that was the N port but it isnt listed as such.

 

[kneedeep]

This will do about the same thing

Fasse Valves Economaster 700-1002 - Shoup

Fasse Economaster. For mounting on implement or tractor. Includes 2 circuit selector valve, toggle switch box w/mounting bracket, wiring harness.

www.shoupparts.com

 

[nyone]

This will do about the same thing

Fasse Valves Economaster 700-1002 - Shoup

Fasse Economaster. For mounting on implement or tractor. Includes 2 circuit selector valve, toggle switch box w/mounting bracket, wiring harness.

www.shoupparts.com

You still need to buy all the hoses and fittings.

I thought I should update this with a pic including the power beyond plug. I had to order some fittings from surplus center to make everything work. Tha is to all those who told me about this. Adding another hose wasn't that big of a deal but would have been way easier when I was initially ordering stuff.

 

[5030]

All very interesting and glad not something I have to explore. When I bought my tractors I speced them with the maximum numper of hydraulic ports plus flow control on th the topmost stack.

When I got my new bailer, it dumps directly into (tank) which is the gearbox so my dealer had to install yet another poineer coupler there. Not all that savvy with hydraulics in the first place but I believe my M's are open center. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Sportsman762]

Not all that savvy with hydraulics in the first place but I believe my M's are open center. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Yep they are open center.

 

[RayIN]

Now I have a headache.