DOT Audit

[tcartwri]

Now, here's a few tips. NEVER give more info in the log than what is required. NEVER do something such as "Wallahalla MI, fuel" in the remarks. This flag will have them asking for a fuel receipt.

You have to indicate fueling locations and change of status locations in your log. Not having any, will cause the questions.

FWIW, I have not had to show a log book in over ten years. Not sure if I'm just lucky or what.....

 

[The Haymaker]

Good post Haymaker. Keep your answers simple and short. When i roll through a check if they ask me for a log book, I just say I run under the 100 air mile exemption rule. Thats the end of it.


Off subject a little. Rolled into a weight check on the I-95. I haul a milk tanker. Two compartment trailer. I had loaded only the front. Up onto to portables. Young new recruit reading scale. Seasoned veteran behind him supervising. Front axle OK. Put drives on scales. Newbie thought he had a nice summons to write. I was way over for interstate weight laws. Pulled my trailer wheels on. He scratched his head, looked at his supervisor. Trailer was wicked light? He asked, You loaded? Nope. Empty? Nope. Well what to **** are you? Half loaded Officer. supervisor was chuckling. Pulled over and open both valves and leveled load out. Young recruit came over and asked why i didn't tell him I was only half full. Well sir, you didn't ask. I thought it was a little funny, until his ears got a little red. Thought i was going to have a level 1 inspection, but he just walked off grumbling.

Should've corrected him. You weren't half full, you were half empty!

I've had one attempt to write me on an HM placarding issue and I asked to go back to my tractor while he was doing the ppwk. I came back with my PHMSA book and pointed out what I had based my placarding on. He actually said, after a pause, "You're right.... Have a nice day" like a jilted housewife. I'm hoping it's been long enough and he won't remember me again.

I had one ask me once what I was hauling. "A full load of sailboat fuel" I answered. He asked me to open my doors so he could inspect my load, which I did. "I thought you said you had a full load" and got testy with me for lying. I'm not sure he ever did get the joke.

 

[The Haymaker]

You have to indicate fueling locations and change of status locations in your log. Not having any, will cause the questions.

FWIW, I have not had to show a log book in over ten years. Not sure if I'm just lucky or what.....

No sir, you do not have to overtly say "fuel", nor "Lunch", "pee break" etc. Only thing you need to show is change of duty status and what town it happened in.

Federal CSR's. 395.8 (d)(1 through 11)

Funny thing about these regulations, they are subject to interpretation by the using officer whichever way generates more revenue for the system. ALWAYS carry the regulations with you, they can save a lot of hassle down the road, no pun intended.

Freight securement is a great example of this. 393.100 (3)(c) states "Prevention against shifting of load. Cargo must be contained, immobilized or secured in accordance with this subpart to prevent shifting upon or within the vehicle to such an extent that the vehicles stability or maneuverability is adversely affected. ".

Yet, 99% of the time they are issued, officers are citing my company for pieces of freight under 50lbs being loose amongst a full LTL load in an enclosed van. Not worth fighting in court so we lay down and take it.

Last one I got for a securement issue was for a 3500lb lift on hardwood flooring loaded crossways in the nose of an otherwise empty 53' air ride. His explanation was that "it could slide the length of the trailer and go through the doors causing harm or worse."

My answer of "With no disrepect sir, but if that slides 53' and still has enough force to blow out the doors, it will be the least of my worries, because it would mean I am doing 65mph in reverse through the woods."

It didn't work.

 

[firedog]

In Jasper Texas a man i know was pulling a 20ft dual gooseneck trailer with single wheels with his one ton going to nome texas to a auction hauling his personal tractor to sell it his neighbor brother is a state senator and he bales hay for him and the other brother is the warden of angola prision they tried to beat the ticket and couldn't cost the man 1200 bucks when he was done paying. He has Farm Tags. The officer give him a ticket for improper drivers lincense no health card and no log book.

Farm tags were probably the kicker on that one. They are cracking down pretty hard on folks who run farm tags but use their trucks for personal stuff. Not quite sure what would have flagged it as non-farm use though (tractor and all). The one ton with trailer is still non-cdl until you get to 26001#.

 

[newbury]

louisiana just past a law last year if you have a dual wheel one ton and pull a trailer you must have a cdl no matter the wieght rating on the tractor. I know a man that got a ticket in his truck pulling a single axle bumper hitch trailer. They have not cracked down to hard yet but they was bad in texas. That is why i got a 3/4 ton when i bought in 09 and am looking for a big truck because if i have to have the cdl to drive the one ton i mine as wheel get a 18 wheeler for what i do.

Here's the LA DMV FAQ:

Q. Who needs a CDL?

A. A CDL is required to operate the following:
Any vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of 26,001 pounds or more.
A vehicle pulling a trailer if the trailer has a (GVWR) of 10,001 pounds or more.
A vehicle designed to carry 16 or more passengers including the driver.
A vehicle hauling hazardous materials in amounts required to be placarded.

NOTE: A vehicle or combination of vehicles which is in excess of 10,000 pounds but less than 26,001 pounds may require a Class D Chauffeur痴 license.

no mention of duallies.

 

[whodat526]

Farm tags were probably the kicker on that one. They are cracking down pretty hard on folks who run farm tags but use their trucks for personal stuff. Not quite sure what would have flagged it as non-farm use though (tractor and all). The one ton with trailer is still non-cdl until you get to 26001#.

hauling a tractor isn't that farm related

 

[whodat526]

Here's the LA DMV FAQ:
no mention of duallies.

yes that was the law i have a 2 good friends that is state represenatives and another that is a state senator and another a state trooper the state trooper is the one that told me the law they was passing and i call the 2 state reps. and they told me it was true and me and a man from beaumont went to a meeting in dallas texas and they state dual wheel vehicles you must have a cdl no matter the tags or the use

 

[newbury]

yes that was the law i have a 2 good friends that is state represenatives and another that is a state senator and another a state trooper the state trooper is the one that told me the law they was passing and i call the 2 state reps. and they told me it was true and me and a man from beaumont went to a meeting in dallas texas and they state dual wheel vehicles you must have a cdl no matter the tags or the use

need to see it in print. From the TEXAS CDL Drivers Handbook:
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/DriverLicense/documents/DL-7C.pdf

You must have a CDL to operate:
A single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating GVWR
of more than 26,000 pounds.
A trailer with a GVWR of more than 10,000 pounds if the
gross combination weight rating is more than 26,000
pounds.
A vehicle designed to transport more than 15 persons
including the driver.
Any size vehicle which requires hazardous materials
placards.
(Your state may have additional definitions of CMVs.)
To get a CDL, you must pass knowledge and skill tests. This
manual will help you pass the tests

Do you have a link for

the law they was passing

?

Lot's of laws are proposed, not all pass and get signed.

Not saying it's not true, but it's the same rumor my BIL heard for Mississippi a year ago.

 

[whodat526]

need to see it in print. From the TEXAS CDL Drivers Handbook:
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/DriverLicense/documents/DL-7C.pdf


Do you have a link for ?

Lot's of laws are proposed, not all pass and get signed.

Not saying it's not true, but it's the same rumor my BIL heard for Mississippi a year ago.

it might have not past but i know the last year they have been hard on 1 ton trucks and not having a cdl. I will call tomorrow and find out exactly what it is know. Because like i said the state rep. and trooper are the ones that told me not to buy a 1ton to buy a 3/4 ton

 

[firedog]

yes that was the law i have a 2 good friends that is state represenatives and another that is a state senator and another a state trooper the state trooper is the one that told me the law they was passing and i call the 2 state reps. and they told me it was true and me and a man from beaumont went to a meeting in dallas texas and they state dual wheel vehicles you must have a cdl no matter the tags or the use

A one ton with a gvwr of 13K and a trailer with a gvwr of 14K would put the gcvwr over 26K and require a CDL.
There is no mention in the state regs about duallies. TxDPS - CVE Publications
Somebody's giving you some bad info.

 

[whodat526]

A one ton with a gvwr of 13K and a trailer with a gvwr of 14K would put the gcvwr over 26K and require a CDL.
There is no mention in the state regs about duallies. TxDPS - CVE Publications
Somebody's giving you some bad info.

they was stopping people in jasper and giving them a ticket if running a 1ton and gooseneck trailer i got one thats why we try not to go through there any more with the trailer if in my dually. I dont know what the drill was they have slacked off here recently but last year at this time they was terrible

 

[sparc]

Farm tags were probably the kicker on that one. They are cracking down pretty hard on folks who run farm tags but use their trucks for personal stuff. Not quite sure what would have flagged it as non-farm use though (tractor and all). The one ton with trailer is still non-cdl until you get to 26001#.

When i drove many years ago for a commercial florist we had farm tags on all our rigs. We hauled our own product anywhere withon 500 miles of 'home'. Wemkept no logs and never stopped at scales. I drove all over pa, nj, de, md, va, ny and other states, never got stopped once in 3 years and i did over 1000 miles/week.

 

[Scooby074]

This has been a great read.

My grandfather and 2 uncles were truckers. One uncle drives bus now and the other is still in the business although i dont talk to him much.

I dont know how you guys put up with all that paperwork:thumbsup:

 

[lostcause]

i have a homemade 2 axle trailer. because it is homemade it has no gvwr. i just have to register my vehicle to an amount that will cover the weight of vehicle, trailer, and cargo. there's no issue coming in at under 26k, if there's a 10k limit on a manufactured trailer, it makes little sense that you could bypass it with a homemade trailer.

 

[LHS Inc]

Some of the stories I've heard here in Maryland:

Lawn Service truck n trailer stopped for a routine check. The guys trailer wheels went thru the wet grass off the shoulder and the officer noticed one of the tires bubbling from a tiny pin hole and shut him down right there until he changed it.

Asked to look in his large cooler he had in back of the truck, got permission, found a leftover beer in there. 1000 buck fine.

He said comercial vehicle, no alcohol.

Don't even think about stopping by and picking up a six pack at the end of the day.

The guys are so rattled they removed the signs they have on a couple of trucks that they don't use for the business anymore so they wouldn't get stopped.

I can understand the alcohol rule but the problem is guys don't realize the catagory of business they are in because no one knows until you get stopped.

I never got going on getting in compliance until I started hearing stories like these.

 

[Cranky]

That is referring to commercial vehicle. As long as you are driving for your self you do not have to have a CDL even if you pull your horse trailer with a Peterbuilt. BUT if you take anything in return for work with a vehicle no mater if it is a VW or a Mack truck its commercial and all CSA laws are enforced. And don't fall for the "not for hire" on the door thing. That is like blood in the water. If an officer see's that I promise you you will be pulled over and class 3 inspected because they feel you are trying to beat the system I run 7 trucks and trust me the new CSA sucks and its gonna get worse.

I am pretty sure none of the 20 year old pizza delivery drivers around here have CDLs.

 

[schoolsout]

10,000# or greater GVWR constitutes a commercial vehicle requiring some sort of physical/medical card in SC

over 26k is when CDL license is required. DOT numbers may need to be applied to lesser GVWR trucks, though.

 

[The Haymaker]

I am pretty sure none of the 20 year old pizza delivery drivers around here have CDLs.

THIS is how CMVSE officers make their revenue. Far too many people base their interpretation of THE LAW as the law. When my drivers come to me with a "fact", I hand them a copy of the FMCSR's or Maine Title 29 and politely ask "Show me".
vehicle enforcement laws are etched in stone. The issues appear because many, if not most, of the regs are so loosely written that many are up to the interpretation of the officer(s) involved. Here's a good example:


Which types of commercial motor vehicles are subject to the cargo securement standards of this subpart, and what general requirements apply? - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

Check out, in particular, (c). We have officers making notes and citations for loose 3lb boxes loaded into a vehicle that weighs 30k lb when empty. A company cannot protect itself from this sort of interpretation unless possibly if the driver carries the regs and politely calls the officer out on it, and it is not cost effective to battle them in court.


Anyway, for THE LAW, you should go to the CMV bible, or FMCSRs. You'll save yourself a lot of headache. Another method is to talk with the personal responsible for writing a potential ticket, the officer. BUT, do not talk to just one, talk to a couple, AND ask for the particular FMCSR that applies, or if a town cop (who often don't know their arse from a hole in the ground, especially with CMV code) ask for the local law.

After being in the safety being in the business for many years, trust me, there are a lot of myths floating around.

 

[Ken]

I thought PA was bad, it nothing compared to what I reading here...The only people who get picked on around here are "pro" drivers and guys with 5 ton or better dumps..

Never heard of anyone getting nailed for anything while towing with a pickup of any size unless the load/trailer isn't properly secured or absurdly overloaded.

As DP said, if these rules were applied, all of the grey hairs in the 40+ foot motorhomes or the 40 ft 5th wheels being pulled by a quad cab dulley would be liquidating their SSN checks to pay the fines. Never heard of that.

I am actually surprised this is going on in Texas...Aren't you guys the leave me the H*ll alone state?

A friend driving a U-Haul truck with his wife and spending the night in a Hershey Pa.Motel was stopped by highway police that wanted his "log bookl" Told him he didn't have one and was carring personal property.
It took several hours to convince the highway policeman that he was legal .
By this time the wife was in shock thinking he was to be jailed .
not all read the same book gets the same information.
ken