Draft horses anyone?

[GreatWhitehunter]

I'm looking for a resource for draft horse care and information. A little "big picture" info, the wife and I are on the search for land to build a hobby farm on and raise our kiddies. We've located a 5 acre lot that is exactly what we're looking for. I'd like to selectively clear the bulk of it for a log home and fence roughly 3 acres for 2 Belgian Draft Horses. They'll be pleasure horses for the most part but I'd like to use them for sleigh pulling at events during the winter.

We're not looking to have the pasture primary feed the horses but I'd like it to remain grass and not sand dirt. It seems there are a lot of opinions on how many acres per horse is correct. Since the horses are a big part of the picture for us, we want to make sure the land will work first and foremost. Land cost in my location are quite high so I'm limited by cost. I'd rather buy 20+ acres but we've not seem any lots that size that were level enough for horses yet close enough to work.
I'd love to hear what input the forum member have to offer.

Matt:confused2:

 

[lockhaven]

the concerns I would have would be the welfare of the animals. 3 acres would quickly become a baron lot with 2 1ton horses on it. as you mentioned you would be feeding but horses will still eat every blade of grass. So my suggestion would be have a hay rack that is very mobile so they do not create a mud hole that they would be standing in most of the time. Mud and waste can cause hoof problems. My second concern is exercise, horses need to be worked to maintain their health, so I would be sure that frequent wagon rides sleigh rides or just pulling a heavy drag around their lot to spread manure. Any thing to make them use their muscles.

 

[Stimw]

You don't mention how much experience you have with horses.

 

[hosspuller]

Have had horses at home for 18 years. Clearing land for pasture is a several year long process. After clearing the land and stumps, the soil is basically barren. You have to rebuild the soil and let the grass establish itself. Even sod will not stand a horse.

With only 3 acres, plan on feeding the two horses in a paddock, while the pasture is established. Then the 3 acres can be divided up with temporary fence for intensive grazing.

 

[Walkin Horse]

I doubt 3 acres are enough for 2 drafts. Unless you don't mind the mess. 2 or 3 walking horses
can go through 3 acres of grass in 2 to 3 weeks. I keep the paddocks with grass rotated so as not to beat them down. After you clear and plant it takes a minimum of 2 years to establish a half decent pasture. And still at that point you need to rotate frequently.

I keep between 7 and 10 horses and I feed about 150 4x5 roundbales a year. Mostly we have Tennessee Walking Horses and an occasional quarter horse. These horses are about half the weight of a draft. So you will be limiting what you can do with these horses on 5 acres. It takes a lot of room that could be used for grass to support horses. The house and yard. A garden. A barn. Trailer parking and a place to turn around. Tractor and tool sheds. Hay storage. Wagon and sled sheds. And then a place to work them. I
guess if you live away from a congested area you could work them on the road.

I don't know what your experience with draft horses are but they are going to eat a lot crap a lot and tear up fences. Plus they wear a size 4 or better shoe. Some of them have to shod in a shoeing stock.

So I would think this out carefully before buying. The events that you mentioned using them in will require insurance. A friend of mine pays $7000 a year for ins. so he can take the public on trail rides and do parties and such.

Enough of the negative. If you can make it work and have an endless supply of money it will be very rewarding. Great excercise and meeting good people.

 

[bullbreaker]

http://www.horseforum.com/draft-horses/

 

[WM75Guy]

They are pretty pulling a wagon, not many sleighs in Texas. We have 17 hand warmbloods at 1400 lbs each, not quite draft size. They each have a 1 acre turnout with a round bale. Our growing season is longer than yours, around the stables is bare but the rest stays covered in grass. It's a mixture of coastal and Bahai grass.

I agree that if it's not pasture now you need Plan B to be able to allow enough time for a pasture to develop. It's too late for pasture grass to grow this year. What is your time frame for clearing the land and planting grass plus allowing time for it to take hold?

You may already know that everything about large horses is more expensive and usually not available at the normal retail outlets. I cannot even get a halter for mine at TSC. Our trailer had to be ordered extra tall and extra wide. Have you ever had drafts before or is this a new hobby?

 

[vtsnowedin]

Been there , done that, For real, and not doing it again as long as the tractor runs and I can buy fuel for it or make it myself. The tractor has this wonderful think called a "Park gear" Horses do not.

 

[wolftree]

Consider Halflinger Draft horses. They are about half the size of Belgians.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

Wow, thanks for all the insightful reply's, the time frame for clearing and construction would be over the next 5 years or so. I have experience with quarter horses and the roping scene. But none with drafts, The horses are a hobby but the wife an I are set on Belgians as far as drafts anyways. I was planning on dividing the 3 acres in half and rotating them as needed. So the general consensus is 3 acres will be small for Belgians it seems. What would be the ideal acreage for 2 drafts? We're mostly concerned with buying a property that will fulfill our desire to own these guys. So perhaps this isn't the right property for them. I'd be interested in an other input on keeping drafts. I'll be sure to check out the link to the horse forum.

Matt

 

[hslogger]

I started with draft horses in 1978 and still own three but do not use them anymore. I got into them with loan from the bank to go logging with them. Times change. I never was into being a hobbyist with them and had them as a tool and partner. If you don't USE them then it is a crime. Being a weekend warrior aint safe when it comes to hooking up a team and taking people out in public. Get yourself on to Rural Heritage Magazine Bulletin Board and join in there. Three publications to consider are Draft Horse Journal, Small Farmer's Journal, and Rural Heritage, the last being the best value for dollar today. If you are going to keep a team you should figure on at LEAST five acres and have a spot for sacrifice grazing, ie the barnyard. Farrier work is different than working on some cowpony or warmblood or trotter or thoroughbred. The day of having working teams, working them for REAL is pretty much a pipe dream in America today. The Amish do and do well, but they have a different labor input in their community and families. Even today there are very few feed teams being used. Some new age farmers are using them and by and large, it is window dressing and a subscription to a lifestyle they aspire to. In most cases I can tell you, it is not economically feaseable. Before you dump a pile of dough into this endeavor, do a lot of homework and visitation. Honest.

 

[Fluid]

We have two draft horses and I think you are going to need more land. They can go though 5 acres in no time.

 

[kidr]

Consider Halflinger Draft horses. They are about half the size of Belgians.

Fjiords are interesting horses too. Small but powerful.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

The info I've been reading is very conflicting as well as the advise. Many folks say that draft care is no different than light horses. I've also read alot of folks usuing them as pleasure trail horses. I've seen no real mention of exactly how much room they need. I see anywhere from 1 to 2 acres recommended for light horses so does doubling the size get you there? Again this thread was for my education and I appreciate all the input. I guess I should try to find someone with this breed and find out what works locally? About the only input I find to be consistant is the farrier cost doubling.

Matt

 

[Walkin Horse]

I don't see the conflicting posts in this thread. Go ahead and get you an 8 team and a beer wagon. When we have our TBN camp out bring em and let us know how deep the mud is at your place.

Seriously though nothing say you can't put them on 3 acres but your going to be feeding them a lot of supplemental forage. And I can tell you from experience that nothing but grass is going to keep a healthy horse up on his weight. Roundbales and having to get them, keep them covered ,and worrying about running out in April is no fun. But like I said the experience is rewarding. What I have read in these posts are, people giving you something to think about.

 

[jrkaye]

When we lived in East Texas I had ~3.5 acres fenced for pasture and 4 horses, they laid the established grass to nothing in a matter of weeks. At that time I was putting out 8' diameter Coastal round bales not to mention graining them daily.

We moved in '08 to West Texas and a much bigger place. Fenced ~7 acres, built a horse shelter and round pen, keep 2 600 gallon water troughs for 4 horses and a mini donkey. The mini doesn't get fed as he helps himself to the grain that's dropped. I now feed alfalfa squares as a supplement (better nutrition) as well as daily graining. Our issue has been the drought which has decimated a lot of pastureland these past few years so it's essential to make sure the proper diet to maintain muscle and weight is carefully calculated. To be clear my horses are more pets/pleasure riding so they don't need nearly the intake a working horse will. I mix Senior Feed (high hay content) and 14% Impact from Purina in equal proportions and mix thoroughly in the buckets so they can't "pick out what they like the best".
Farrier work is every 6-8 weeks dependent on need. 3 of the 4 go barefoot most times but I have one that HAS to be front shod. Then you have vet work so make sure if the vet won't come to you, you have a sturdy reliable horse trailer (minimum 4 horse) with a sturdy floor, proper lighting and commercial type tires (last longer).

To keep my feed supply rotated properly I make a feed store trip every 10 days if buying only 500 lbs but if I get a 1000 lb load then I always make sure the older bags are either in my steel covered feed bins and the newer stock is stacked and protected from rodents. Get a good mouser, it's save your grain storage from infestation.

Pick your farrier WISELY. Make sure he/she is dependable and has references. They need to know everything about the equine anatomy and hoof. Thrush, foundering and a multitude of issues can present themselves at any time dependent on YOUR care of their feet. I check my kids daily with a hoof pic and visual to make sure nothing gets lodged in the frog or they didn't stomp on an especially sharp rock.

Horses are not for the faint of heart and as one ole cowboy told me years ago "them critters is accidents waiting to happen".

Best of luck on your adventure and planning but don't rush the details as they'll bite you in the butt if not carefully thought out.

 

[Walkin Horse]

Something else to think about. When you take your horses to events your going to need to get the wagon there too. That's 2 trucks or a big special built trailer. One time I cut the top off a 6 horse trailer and raised the back half up so he could load the horses in front and the wagon in the rear.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

I don't see the conflicting posts in this thread. Go ahead and get you an 8 team and a beer wagon. When we have our TBN camp out bring em and let us know how deep the mud is at your place.

Seriously though nothing say you can't put them on 3 acres but your going to be feeding them a lot of supplemental forage. And I can tell you from experience that nothing but grass is going to keep a healthy horse up on his weight. Roundbales and having to get them, keep them covered ,and worrying about running out in April is no fun. But like I said the experience is rewarding. What I have read in these posts are, people giving you something to think about.

I was refering to the internet in general on the conflicting info, not this thread. I'm not super hung up on the public wagon rides part. I was thinking more of having work for them. I'd ideally like to keep them pleasure and trail riding. I really appreciate all the objective advice.

I have heard many round bale references and dont believe anything but cows get round bales up this way. To many issues with the rounds spoiling for horses. So I'd likely need to get a solid supply of squares and a loft to store them in.

 

[jix]

Draft Horses are a VERY expensive hobby..harness alone will cost you the price of a new car. Farrier services..about 500 a month..Ditto the vet bills. Feed..if you buy it..about 4000 per year. Your time..four hours per day, minumum. These big horses can also be dangerous to handle in stalls because of their great weight, and who will train them? a good strong well founded draft horse which is well trained to harness will cost you megabucks per animal to buy. a recent sale here, of champion pulling Belgians saw prices of thirty thousand dollars per team, harness extra...pasture, fencing, barn, equipment..the sky is the limit.

oh yes..no holidays for the owner if he is also the groom/handler..and one horse alone will become insane in a barn if left without companionship... yes, human companionship. Horses get sick for thousands of reasons. Wet Feet, moldy hay, over feeding grain, insufficient exercise, poor handling, exhaustion, thirst, bugs, heat, flies, fright. Big horses have big bills..and demand knowledgeable ownership, care and affection.

A bad woman is easier to keep than a big horse is.

Once when I was a kid I was using a span of Clydesdales to pull a riding plow in a field near the roadway. After the plowing was done we headed for the barn down a 1/4 mile long dirt farm lane. Something spooked them and off they went at speed, with me clinging to the seat of the plow. I could not get them to whoa..and there was fast traffic on the road by the laneway exit. It was coming up to be a disaster, so I pulled the lever that dropped the plowshares into the ground. Dirt flew like water from the bows of a speedboat for a couple of hundred feet. The horses finally stopped after the lane way was
well furrowed and the team was lathered and blowing hard. Never did figger out why they ran away with the plow and me that day. Spent two more hours washing the team and curryring them down in the corral to gentle them, then put them into the box stall with a nose bag of oats apiece. Four thousand pounds of horseflesh has to be handled very wisely and carefully, always expecting the unexpected...and make no serious mistakes.

Tractors may be dangerous tools, but big horses are much more so..especially if they are not worked nearly every day. Big horse gets to feeling his oats, better be on guard..or you will get hurt real bad, real quick
If you have never been around draft horses and learned how they are trained, used, cared for and handled from someone who has spent a lifetime doing it..you would be better advised to go and play with dynamite.

Owning and handling draft horses is a lovely dream..doing it as a total greenhorn is just an expensive nightmare that well may get you crippled, or killed...and will be cruel for the horses, probably.

If you are determined to do it anyways..then add in the costs to hire a full-time hostler for about ten years while you cut your teeth:thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:

 

[ultrarunner]

Family used working Haflingers in Austria... stout, easy to keep and family friendly... they had something to do every day.

The team had 10 acres cross fenced and that was plenty.

Draft horses can be real sweet