Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced

   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #21  
A fully opened valve on a properly plumbed Open Center hydraulic system, as I understand it, will divirt all fluid to the cycliner and then back to the tank leaving no fluid or pressure for the next valve in line. I'm going to make a wild guess here that the input to the valve is on the same end as the #4 valve and the output(s) are on the end with the #1 valve. Am I correct?
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced
  • Thread Starter
#22  
I'm going to make a wild guess here that the input to the valve is on the same end as the #4 valve and the output(s) are on the end with the #1 valve. Am I correct?

No, if you look at the photos there are 3 hoses that go from the valve assembly under #1 and connect to the pump area.
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #23  
No, if you look at the photos there are 3 hoses that go from the valve assembly under #1 and connect to the pump area.

I guess I didn't stop to look at the pix yesterday or I would have answered my own question.

I still think you're dealing with a shortcoming of an Open Center system though.
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #24  
I went and tried to do a little research on your tractor. All I came up with was a Ford 545D industrial tractor. 66HP engine, 52HP PTO. Does this seem right?
TractorData.com Ford 545D industrial tractor information

If so, then you might very well have Closed System hydraulics. Better system IMHO. I'll sit back for a while and see what others think.
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #25  
i have run every thing from comp to heavy duty and all hydrolics work the same the oil goes the eases rout if you pull the other fist it will do the same the other will move first :thumbsup: just something you will have to live with --but if you want the one to move put a flow reducer in the line this will make a bit of a change to the speed of the two cyl it may work for you :thumbsup:
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #26  
I have followed this thread with some interest and I want to make a few points from observing the pictures....

1. This control valve is of an unusual type (very old design), IMO, it is more of a sandwich type CV rather than a stack valve.....because of there are to many layered segments in the valve...

2.Pump and return ports are at the same end (under) of the entire sandwich...that make me think the valves might be straightly plumbed in a series, eventually we are dealing with a closed center system (which I doubt)??

3. Extending the the two parallel arm-cylinders is depending on gravity force more than force/flow from pump (over running)....with that "heavy" attachment, cylinders should extend synchronized, (if there is nothing mechanical that sticks in linkage or friction in cylinders) as long as the is free drainage of fluid from the rod side of cylinders...


Question 1 to OP:
Does the operation of cylinders act the same with heavy attachment hanging in the arm as with out attachment load in the arms???


4. Ability to lift the arms synchronized will depend on load on each cylinder and/or back pressure on the capped side of cylinder. If there is uneven load or back pressure between the cylinders, control valves for each cylinder needs to be feathered differently to allow synchronized motion.


Question 2 to OP:
Obviously your tractor new to you. Have it had this problem since you got it??


I agree with some other posters here, system works as it supposed to work, and I do not think your valve is faulty.

I also think you will have to replace that entire control valve, with a modern 4-spool valve (mono block or stack valve doesn't matter, mono block is cheaper and less to worry about)

sandwich_valve.jpg


Edit:
My point with your valve is that it might be missing this "red" power core and the parallel return core , that connects valves parallel, and makes it possible for valves to operate functions simultaneously
stackvalve_parallel_core_painted.jpg
 
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   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced
  • Thread Starter
#27  
3. Extending the the two parallel arm-cylinders is depending on gravity force more than force/flow from pump (over running)....with that "heavy" attachment, cylinders should extend synchronized, (if there is nothing mechanical that sticks in linkage or friction in cylinders) as long as the is free drainage of fluid from the rod side of cylinders...


Question 1 to OP:
Does the operation of cylinders act the same with heavy attachment hanging in the arm as with out attachment load in the arms???

I believe so, but I had the mower on it and did not need the function I am seeking with the box scraper. I should also mention that when the tractor is shut off these cylinders will not extend smoothly by the weight on them. They will settle eventually but not like the FEL and 3pt hydraulics. So they will lift the attachment together under power, but will not extend together either with or without power.

4. Ability to lift the arms synchronized will depend on load on each cylinder and/or back pressure on the capped side of cylinder. If there is uneven load or back pressure between the cylinders, control valves for each cylinder needs to be feathered differently to allow synchronized motion.
Yes, this works as you say.


Question 2 to OP:
Obviously your tractor new to you. Have it had this problem since you got it??

Not sure, but I think so. I have had the tractor since last may but primarily used the FEL and the brush hog.
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced
  • Thread Starter
#28  
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced
  • Thread Starter
#29  
I need a source to read up on hydraulic terminology like open vs. closed system, spool valves, etc. Is there one online? Hopefully with pictures.
 
   / Dual Tilt Cylinder Valves not Synced #30  
PARALLEL VALVE is a multiple spool valve whereby all spools may simultaneously control different functions. The oil flow wil be divided equally providing the operating pressure requirements for all functions are the same. The function requiring the lowest pressure will operate first. The next function will operate when pressure reaches it’s requirements, before or after the first function is fully operated.

SERIES-PARALLEL VALVE is a multi-spool valve which feeds pressure to the cylinder ports from the open center passage, so that only the upstream spool, if fully actuated, would take priority over all pump flow. However, the return circuit is common to all cylinder ports.
 
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