EAA Young Eagles

[njrqs]

GG - Yes your MTOW was my MTOW. OK so it weighs close to a Cessna 152.

No stall - What happens?? - Can you just doodle along at 20 knots??

Elevators at the front - Cool.

 

[TresCrows]

The forward canard wing stalls first which pitches the aircraft down reducing angle of attack. Reducing angle of attack prevents the main wing from stalling--thus it is at least semi stall proof in the normal way we think of stalls. Like Glueguy said, stall speed is about 50 knots for a Long Ezi----NOT 20 so he cannot doodle along at 20 knots, my ex-Kitfox could however when lightly loaded because it is in fact a STOL aircraft and while not stall proof uses a Junkers type flaperon to achieve extremely high lift and fly at very high angles of attack. Wings fly on angle of attack, a wing can stall at any speed once it's critical angle of attack is exceeded for that airspeed, which is why many aircraft including jet fighter aircraft use an angle of attack or so called reserve lift meter so they do not stall out when pulling G's during an aggresive manuver. Stalls are not really the problem because the canard wing itself stalls, more accurately it is a spin proof or at least spin resistant design, something which can be achieved in more a conventional manner but heck the canard configuration looks so cool just like it's designers long side burns. J

 

[njrqs]

OK I get it now. From a 100% Cessna trained man, I don't think outside the square like these aircraft do.

How would an angle of attack meter work?

I read about the lack of them in light aircraft in my text books, but they didn't go any further into them.

Thanks guys.

Hey we sure need that flying forum now don't you think??

 

[GlueGuy]

Neil,

3C's gave you the straight poop on the stall. I will add that the "stall mode" (at least for my EZ) is variable.

When I'm lightly loaded, there is no up/down oscillation at all, just a kind of "mush", with a steady 500 fpm or so descent. The ailerons, rudders have full control; even though the elevators are in the "full up" position.

When heavily loaded, my EZ does a slow "bob" motion with a cycle time of 20-30 seconds (per "bob"). Still is in full control, but with a slightly higher descent rate.

Re: aircraft weight. I think my EZ is about 1/2 the weight of a C152 (empty weight for both). However, the full-up weight isn't far different (EZ has much higher usefull load).

Re: angle of attack meters. There are many designs. Some are simple "flappers" that attach to the leading edge of a wing at the appropriate angle/position. Go above the critical angle, it gets pushed up, and triggers. Go below the critical angle, it gets pushed down and turns off. Others are variations on that theme; just need to be able to sense the direction of attack.

 

[TresCrows]

When you fly a prop Cessna as you do you got 1950's technology, a VariEZE or a Vans RV7A can utilize 21st century technology.
The lift meter my RV7 will have is the Fly Safe. See them at www.angle-of-attack.com . These are not avaialble for certified aircraft--homebuilts only. Unlike the kit auto industry where the resultant vehicle is a bit strange and not equal to a factory built car, homebuilt aircraft have evolved beyond the factory offerings and are in general far superior for their intended mission profiles. J

 

[Bird]

Speaking of STOL aircraft; did you ever fly a Heliocourier. The most fun I ever had in an airplane (well maybe except for going from the factory in Kansas to Anchorage, AK, in a new Cessna 152) was in a 1973 Heliocourier. We drove the FAA nuts with calls from people calling in saying some nut was doing things over Dallas that an airplane can't do; like when I flew it backwards across the airport./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

 

[njrqs]

GG

OK so it stalls but doesn't turn into an inverted brick and scare the S**t out of you. Sounds like a very nice airplane.

Particing stalls in the Cessna is not a fun experience although the more you do it, the less it feels like a stall as you just get used to it.

Yes CCC I know of the seriously outdated technology we are flying. Very hard to learn in anything else around here though and I don't know many flyign schools who operate anythign other than standard aircraft.

The stats on my mates RV8 seem amazing. He has shown me the videos etc. One day I could be tempted but I have nothing like the patience needed to build one.

GG - Got a website for info on the Long Ez??

 

[GlueGuy]

<font color=blue>Practicing stalls in the Cessna is not a fun experience although the more you do it, the less it feels like a stall as you just get used to it.</font color=blue>

One of the best lessons I ever got was with my primary instructor, when I was just "not getting" stalls. My instructor finally says: "OK, sit on your hands." I do as I am told, and he proceeds to pull the trainer into several different stall approaches. My job was to manage the pedals. That's when it clicked in my head that you could actually avoid a stall (or correct it if you're not fast enough) by managing the rudder. This was just the ticket for getting me to understand the stall mode in a C152. Of course, each aircraft will be a little different, but the rule for the C152 also works in a large number of other "standard" aircraft (just not all of them).


<font color=blue>Got a website for info on the Long Ez??</font color=blue>

One of the best places to look is here:

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.canard.com/>Canard Aviator's Page</A>

If you want to see what Burt Rutan is up to these days, try this:

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.scaled.com/>Scaled Composites</A>

 

[Hawkflyer]

You might also want to look into the United States Ultralite Association (USUA). They have a nationwide network of affiliated clubs and programs simular to EAA. Ultralites (UL) are fun, cost a lot less to build, fly, and maintain than "spam cans" (general aviation aircraft), and can be flown from smaller fields. While the FAA does not require training to operate a UL, it is strongly recommended. There are many UL Basic Flight Instructors (BFI) nationwide. As with any activity you can spend a lot or a little, but you can get in the air for as little as $5,000 and the sky is the limit (no pun intended) from there. Most guys I know have between $7,500 and $15,000 in their planes, and fly almost every weekend. And these are "proper" little aircraft, with full controls, wheels, and doors (well they zip shut but they keep the wind out).I wish your wife all the luck. I took Cesna training and all I have left is the written and the check ride to finish. But UL's have captured my fancy and I have not looked back.

 

[3rdbase]

On a AOA related matter, we in the airline business have been asking for AOA indications in the cockpit for years. Military fighters have had them forever.Angle of attack is the primary speed indication when flying aboard a carrier. It's the best way to get out of windshear or other lift critical situations. We've been unsuccessful getting the companies to pay to get that data displayed in the cockpit. It is available though-you know where? On the flght data recorder used to investigate accidents. Kind of ironic isn't it? The data is available and already on the aircraft, but why do such a stupid thing as presenting it to the pilot?