engine dying again!!

[WTA]

A couple weeks ago I went through this mess with my new TD95D where right after I filled up with fuel my tractor wouldn't run. It started and almost got back to where I was in the field then started puffing white smoke and dying. Like it was running out of fuel.
Long story short, The dealer mechanics came out and couldn't find anything wrong. I changed my fuel filters and cleaned the tank. There was a little junk in the tank and some gel in the water separator but I have no idea how or why it got there.

After half a day with all three of us going through the fuel system and coming up as lost as can be it just started working right.

Everything was fine till today when I filled up again. It was down to about 1/4 tank and started running rough so I came in and filled up with fuel again. Different fuel from a different transfer tank.

It didn't make it back out to the field again. I brought my RPM up to PTO speed, 2200 RPM and it died in almost exactly 3 minutes, just like a couple weeks ago.


I got off the tractor, found air in the filters again, bled the system, started it up and continued discing the field. It would only make it down one row before shutting down on me again.

What I found this time is the fuel shutoff solenoid is buzzing like crazy when it's running. It's quiet when it is off with the key on. I don't think that is normal but one of the dealership mechanics think it is. He's on his way back out right now so I can argue with him about it.

The solenoid is a 1 wire type and the voltage is steady 13.6 when the engine is running. If it were my oil pressure switch messing with it then it would either be erratic or just going dead. I've sure never heard one buzzing and felt it vibrating like that before.
Can someone tell me if I'm wrong about this noise before the mechanic gets here and I get ugly. I'd hate to make a fool of myself but I bought a new tractor so I wouldn't have to mess with it for a long time and this is driving me nuts! Plus I have a lot of work to do.

FWIW, the new holland website has a number listed where they claim you can get help with your new tractor and they claim your satisfaction is guaranteed.
It was a waste of time calling them.

 

[Doc_Bob]

After half a day with all three of us going through the fuel system and coming up as lost as can be it just started working right.

DELETD@@@@@###############

FWIW, the new holland website has a number listed where they claim you can get help with your new tractor and they claim your satisfaction is guaranteed.
It was a waste of time calling them.

I am missing something, so please clarify. You had yourself and two NH dealership employees work on your TN95? And you are not happy? Has the dealer refused to come back?

 

[WTA]

That was from the first time it did this. After all of us messing with it for half the day, cleaning the fuel tank, checking and blowing out all the lines and all that junk, it just started working right. I can't explain it. One second it was smoking and barely running and the next it perked up and ran perfect.

It just did the same thing again. The shop manager came out after I called him this afternoon. He hasn't given me any problem at all. He is just at a loss like I am as to why it has done this after the last two fillups.

When he got here today it had been sitting out in the field for a couple hours after it died on me and as luck would have it it was running nearly perfect as soon as he laid his hands on it. NEARLY. He climbed in with me and did a couple circles around the field pulling the disc and the engine was puffing a little and hunting on the governor but it didn't try to die. All of a sudden all power came back and it just started running perfect.

I can't figure it out.

All we could figure was that vibrating solemoid may be doing something but I just finished discing that field and it's still making that buzzing sound so maybe that isn't the problem. It's running perfect now. Neither of us knew exactly what that solenoid is either. It's not the shutoff solenoid. It's on the inboard rear side of th einjector pump and is connected by linkage to a shaft coming out the front of the pump. It doesn't move anything at all. We couldn't even move that shaft by hand and turning it off and on doesn't do anything. Do you know what that one could be?

 

[Robert_in_NY]

What type of fuel storage system do you currently use? If you can please post a pic of it if it is outdoor bulk tanks.

The way you are describing things it sounds like a fuel contamination issue. It runs rough till the contaminate is worked thru the system then it smooths out till you fill up again and stir up what ever is in your tanks (either the bulk tanks or the tractors tank).

 

[Eagleview]

Solenoids should not vibrate or make sounds , they are either on or off . It would be a faulty relay that powers the solenoid . The chatter would be caused by the points in the relay arcing or because the relay coil that pulls the points in is faulty . You may have two sepparate issues though , i'd also check that the fuel tank vent/cap is clear . A vacuum could be created in the tank that stops your engine and after you take off the cap to add fuel it could be released . To check this , loosen the fuel cap and work the tractor . If your engine is turboed the linkage you speak of may be part of the boost compensator .

 

[WTA]

I did have a problem with the vent in the fuel cap. It was collapsing the tank a few weeks ago when I was out plowing in the hardpan dry dirt we have here. It was really dusty and jammed the valve in it so I took it out. No more vent valve. It won't hurt anything though. It's still sealed well enough but definitely lets air in and I put a 30 cal cleaning patch across the hole inside the cap where the valve used to be so the dirt is filtered out of the incoming air.

I don't have a fuel problem and of that I am 100% sure of. The first time I used a steel barrel that is always kept full and indoors in my air conditioned shop. No sweating, no dirt, no nothing but good clean fuel. I have a handcrank pump on it with a filter that I replace every couple months. That can was bought new when I got the tractor last year and has always been indoors except for when I go to town to fill it up.

This time I used new military jerry cans that I've had sitting in the attic for years. They have always been sealed and never used. I also filled up at the local gas station with road diesel. This was the first tank I have ever put in the tractor without being treated with power service fuel conditioner. It's always in the big barrel.

After this problem came up the first time I swung the tank down and drained it then thoroughly cleaned it inside with lint free rags. I was able to reach all but the farthest back corner of it. There really wasn't much in the tank other than a few small droplets of water and a very few rust particles. Probably form the tank at the coop. The fuel filter the first time was filled with some raspberry jelly looking stuff. I still can't explain it. It was 105 outside when I found that.

It's such a weird problem. We had a nasty storm last night that blew out a couple windows and uprooted a tree so I got in it this morning to go drag the tree out of the road. It's running perfect now. I've just never had my butt kicked by a diesel like this in my life and it's ticking me off. I've overhauled diesels from little perkins and Kubotas to monster fairbanks Morse 16 cylinder opposed piston machines and just never found myself stumped like this. I even worked in a injector pump shop rebuilding pumps, injectors and doing diesel valve jobs for 3 years. Actually I ran the shop.
This is just weird. It's really not acting like a bad pump at all. If it were a stanadyne on a GM pickup then I'd suspect the pump. They have always been goofy but not a mechanical Bosche pump. They either work or they don't. There is no in between or intermittent problems in them.

 

[Doc_Bob]

Sounds like they are treating you very well.

 

[jinman]

I am also concerned about the buzzing of the solenoid or relay. In a DC circuit, nothing should be buzzing. The next time you hear buzzing, don't just read the DC voltage, put your meter on AC and check the DC with that. If there is a bad rectifier in the alternator, you could be throwing AC onto the DC line from time-to-time. The superimposed AC could cause your solenoid to buzz.

That's the only thing I can think to add to what you have already checked. I surely think the superimposed AC is a long shot and probably not an issue. It's just one more thing to check off your list of possibilities.

 

[Eagleview]

jinman.// Thats what happened to my Volvo truck the other night . Voltage went off scale , headlights/park lights blew , melted the coils in all my relays etc . I changed the regulator in the alternator and it seems OK but im wary .

 

[WTA]

I checked the Alternator this morning and no problems found. That solenoid isn't buzzing either now. It's been running perfect all last night and this morning while I've been out spraying the weeds.

I checked the voltage regulator, diodes and did a winding test on it. Nothing. I even filled up with fuel again this morning expecting it to mess up again but it hasn't yet. It must know I'm wearing my pistol now or something.