Engine will not turn over. Where to start?

[Cacinok]

dusty, thanks again for the advice. will a spun bearing be obvious by looking at it or will i need to pull the main bearing caps?

cp1969, i'd never band-aid something and sell it w/o notifying the buyer. in any event, i don't plan on selling it. i may band-aid it, or buy another tractor and eventually fix the old long. we just moved to our new house and we are still carrying the mortgage on the other place. if it sells soon, then we'll just buy another tractor. if it doesn't sell for a while, then i'll try to band-aid the old long, if possible.

 

[cp1969]

You'll need to pull main & rod caps to find the spun bearing, if there is one. Once you do that, it will be obvious. If it is from lack of oil, it will usually be as far away from the oil pump as possible--that's the one that did without lube the longest, so start there and work your way closer to the oil pump. Then, if you can bear it, look at the crankshaft. It is very unlikely that you can spin a bearing and not damage the crank.

Thumbs up on the paragraph directed at me. It's good to know there are honest men out there.

 

[gemini5362]

most likely a part failed, could or could not have anything to do with maintnence.

you can do all the PM's in the world and not prevent a valve from breaking and falling into the piston.

as they say ...... ***** happens.

Kick I apologize Cacinok had asked the question how many hours are ok on a used machine. I was makeing a joke in response to that question. I will admit that some people think my sense of humor needs more development.

 

[Cacinok]

Kick I apologize Cacinok had asked the question how many hours are ok on a used machine. I was makeing a joke in response to that question. I will admit that some people think my sense of humor needs more development.

it there is something that all forums need, but i've never seen one that works is a smiley that conveys sarcasm.

@cp1969, thanks for the info. i figured i'd need to dig into, but wonder if there might be other signs, besides, of course, the obvious metal shards everywhere.

thanks again to everybody who posted. i've definitely learned a lot and appreciate the sharing of your knowledge.

 

[Knotbored]

I don't think I saw anywhere in these messages that a check whether the starter is getting juice when installed on the tractor.
Does the starter click or grind teeth ?
I think a previous poster mentioned kill switches. I "invested" in a new battery, a charger and several hours on my Kabota before I realized I can't start it unless I put in the clutch LOL. I was trying unsucessfully to start it in nuetral standing beside the tractor.
If you hear nothing from the starter then probably the engine IS NOT siezed-its electrical. Note a diesel makes a lot of clicking noises normally-sounds like valve lifter problems.

 

[Cacinok]

I don't think I saw anywhere in these messages that a check whether the starter is getting juice when installed on the tractor.
Does the starter click or grind teeth ?
I think a previous poster mentioned kill switches. I "invested" in a new battery, a charger and several hours on my Kabota before I realized I can't start it unless I put in the clutch LOL. I was trying unsucessfully to start it in nuetral standing beside the tractor.
If you hear nothing from the starter then probably the engine IS NOT siezed-its electrical. Note a diesel makes a lot of clicking noises normally-sounds like valve lifter problems.

yeah that was the first thing that i checked. i put the battery charger directly on the starter and used a remote starter to engage the starter and you could hear the starter engage the flywheel, but it wouldn't turn. i have tried to manually move the flywheel and it will not budge.

as an aside, sedro-wooley is a great place. i'm from everett, but lived in bellingham for a few years and took some drives w/ my gf through the sedro-wooley area, up into the mountains.

 

[kmdigital]

You said the engine only turns about 1/2". Is this in either direction? In other words, did you only turn it one way, and then no more, or does the flywheel turn 1/2" back and forth, and then no further in any direction?

Personally, I would jack up the one rear wheel, block the other rear wheel (or better apply the brake firmly for this other wheel) and put it in the highest gear possible, and try rocking the engine with the raised rear wheel. If a valve isn't dropped you won't do any more damage, and you should be able to tell if it the engine is siezed or will actually move with a little effort.

It was running, so it seems very strange that it would have siezed that tightly unless it was very hot for some reason. And it is hard to see how you could have spun a bearing at idle unless it was very low on oil, which you say it wasn't. That is unless it set for a long time and rust built up on the crank which might have frozen one bearing, in which case you might be able to get by just replacing that bearing, if the crank isn't too badly pitted.

 

[RobJ]

If it is from lack of oil, it will usually be as far away from the oil pump as possible--that's the one that did without lube the longest, so start there and work your way closer to the oil pump.

Actually this makes perfect sense but it's the opposite. In a run out of oil case or a failed oil pump it's usually one of the closest to the oil pump. It's the first one to run out of oil. Some air in the system will work oil through the galleys. On the diesels I worked on when I was a mechanic we ran some tests..IE run engines out of oil. In our engines the #2 was the first one in the oil galley. It would spin the rod every time. So if you brought in an engine with #2 spun rod...then warranty rejected on the spot. And usually the rod does go first because it has the most loads on it. I never rebuild an engine with a spun main...the rods start making noise and someone with stop the engine. But on the gen sets and irrigation pumps...they keep running and can make a mess. Most of those would shut down because of sensors if they hadn't been bypassed. But under a full load it doesn't take long.

Good Luck on the fix.

Rob

 

[mopacman]

Take the belts off to make sure it is not the alternator or water pump locked up. I have ran in to this before. If the hydraulic pump is mounted on engine it could be that. Make shure pto is off it could be the brush hog.
Larry

 

[cp1969]

Actually this makes perfect sense but it's the opposite. In a run out of oil case or a failed oil pump it's usually one of the closest to the oil pump. It's the first one to run out of oil.

That's contrary to my experience, and would seem to be a violation of the laws of fluid dynamics. Not saying you didn't experience what you did, but I have seen spun bearings on #1 cylinder when the oil pump fed up through rear main cap. If what you're saying is universally true, then #4 should have bit the dust first.