Expedition EL vs Suburban No chevy or ford bashing please.

[davkir]

I'm not sure, but I remember reading that Carbon Motors was going to use a 6 cyl BMW diesel.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I'm not sure, but I remember reading that Carbon Motors was going to use a 6 cyl BMW diesel.

If they do that would be great. I thought they were building everything in house but I am probably wrong.

As for them selling or not they are working on the factory like crazy down in Connersville. They say they have deposits on 20,000+ police cars right now. They run about $35,000 each if I remember right with a average out the door equipped price at around $40,000. Not much different than the other no police built cars that must be modified and equipped. They are designed for twice the life of a comparable Crown Vic or Charger.

Chris

 

[Bigfoot62]

Building everything inhouse. Its a diesel. We have a few running around the town.

Not according to their website. (from the FAQ page)

. . . we will be purchasing the engine from an existing manufacturer.

 

[Bird]

If they do that would be great. I thought they were building everything in house but I am probably wrong.

As for them selling or not they are working on the factory like crazy down in Connersville. They say they have deposits on 20,000+ police cars right now. They run about $35,000 each if I remember right with a average out the door equipped price at around $40,000. Not much different than the other no police built cars that must be modified and equipped. They are designed for twice the life of a comparable Crown Vic or Charger.

Chris

That sounds pretty good, so I'll wish them well. Are they planning to sell through any kind of dealers, or only direct? And what will they do about warranty work?

 

[Dmace]

They are designed for twice the life of a comparable Crown Vic or Charger.

According to their website they have a life expectancy of 250,000 miles. Thats hardly " twice the life of a comparable Crown Vic or Charger". Our local PD gets well over 200k before new purchases and at the last police auction we went to there were several Chargers/Crown Vics with over 300k miles.
Secondly, with everything but the engine built in house, the replacement parts will be expensive and hard to get. You need a brake caliper for a Charger/Crown Vic, go to any parts store.
I also notice no word of any warranty...

 

[Monster5601]

Our local police dept took deliver of tons of them just a few months back. They bought up all they could before production ceased.

That is a shame!

I was involved in the new Ford police duty Explorer and Taurus programs. These two vehicles are superior to the old Crown Vic including performance, handling, economy, officer comfort, equipment placement, etc:. The steering committee that helped Ford create the design specifications of the new designs were made up of police departments from all over the country.

Officially Official: 2012 Ford Police Interceptor unveiled, second utility model announced

The new Ford police vehicles were OK'ed for sale last month. I've been watching the Carbon Motors efforts, they have yet to build a salable vehicle.

You may not realize but many departments use the Michigan Police vehicle evaluations report. Interesting read.

MSP - Police Vehicle Evaluation

 

[Dmace]

You may not realize but many departments use the Michigan Police vehicle evaluations report. Interesting read.

MSP - Police Vehicle Evaluation

That's pretty neat! I didn't think anyone did that kind of testing but it makes sense it needs to be done.
Reading through the 2012 comparison, it looks like the Dodge Charger HEMI is still king!

 

[Lt CHEG]

That's pretty neat! I didn't think anyone did that kind of testing but it makes sense it needs to be done.
Reading through the 2012 comparison, it looks like the Dodge Charger HEMI is still king!

I'll say this much as a person who drives a HEMI powered police vehicle every day (Dodge Durango), NO engine sounds as good as the HEMI under hard acceleration NONE! I found the HEMI Chargers to be fun to drive and very fast, but the best police car that I've ever driven is still the 1996 Caprice. I've never driven a police car faster than the 153 or 156 mph that I've had that big bad boat up to.

 

[Bird]

That is a shame!

I was involved in the new Ford police duty Explorer and Taurus programs. These two vehicles are superior to the old Crown Vic including performance, handling, economy, officer comfort, equipment placement, etc:. The steering committee that helped Ford create the design specifications of the new designs were made up of police departments from all over the country.

Officially Official: 2012 Ford Police Interceptor unveiled, second utility model announced

The new Ford police vehicles were OK'ed for sale last month. I've been watching the Carbon Motors efforts, they have yet to build a salable vehicle.

You may not realize but many departments use the Michigan Police vehicle evaluations report. Interesting read.

MSP - Police Vehicle Evaluation

Bob, I did a little editing on your post and one of mine earlier because it appeared that I said our department bought up the Crown Vic when I had only been quoting Diamondpilot. I guess I must have made a typo error.

I hadn't even heard of the Michigan State Police Vehicle testing since I retired, but when fleet management was part of my responsibilities, I did keep up with that. About 30 years ago there was a lieutenant in the MSP in charge of that testing. I can't remember his name, but I met him at the National Association of Fleet Administrators, Law Enforcement Group conventions and he sent me letters inviting me to come in person for the testing, but it just wasn't in my budget.:laughing: Unfortunately, I had to have my specs written before the MSP report was completed and released, but I'd call him each year and discuss their testing before finalizing my specs.

It was some very interesting testing they did, and I'm sure it benefited law enforcement agencies all over the country.

 

[Bird]

the best police car that I've ever driven is still the 1996 Caprice. I've never driven a police car faster than the 153 or 156 mph that I've had that big bad boat up to.

Whew, I was driving an unmarked Caprice when I retired in 1989, but never had a reason to see how fast it was.

 

[Dmace]

I found the HEMI Chargers to be fun to drive and very fast, but the best police car that I've ever driven is still the 1996 Caprice. I've never driven a police car faster than the 153 or 156 mph that I've had that big bad boat up to.

That's crazy!
According to the test the Charger had the fastest top speed at only 151 mph so you probably won't get that chance again.

 

[Lt CHEG]

That's crazy!
According to the test the Charger had the fastest top speed at only 151 mph so you probably won't get that chance again.

You're probably right. I'll most likely continue using trucks or SUV's due to the amount of stuff I carry, and even our Impala's, Taurus's, etc aren't pursuit rated at my current agency. I've been over 100 with the Durango, but even the doggiest Crown Vic that I ever drove when I was still a uniform cop would still blow away the Durango at the top end, and in handling.

I still remember the night I had the old Caprice wound up. I was working afternoons at my second part time PD. We got a call for a fight and there was a car that was just around the corner that pulled up right away and they started getting surrounded. This call was at one extreme end of the city, and I was in the middle. There's a road that cuts along the outskirts of the city that's built for higher speeds than the regular city roads and also has about a 3 mile straightaway. I took that road and kicked in the afterburners on the straightaway. Mind you this was a backup car, 1996 model year, and this was calendar year 2005, but boy could she boogie. The A/C didn't work in that car or I probably would have driven it more often, but for flat out speed nothing except the Camaro interceptors that I've ridden in could compete. The smaller, lighter Chargers will get up to warp speed a little quicker though.

 

[CompactTractorFan]

As far as fire and police vehicles, we are mostly Ford. Our FD has a ford Expedition chief's car, F-550 utility truck and an old Ford air truck. Our PD uses all Ford with a mix of marked and unmarked Ford Explorer's and Crown Victoria's. Also think they have an Escape detective's car. Back in the mid 2000's there were Chevy Impala's and Tahoe's mixed in. Recently the PD was loaned a Dodge Charger to test out, so we may be getting them in the future. Funny seeing a PD car with a Michigan plate patrolling around town. :laughing:

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Our police dept just got a fleet of F-150 Eco Boost trucks.

Do you know if they are using them for patrol?

Police officers have, for at least 40 years, wished that someone built a car designed for law enforcement, but it hasn't happened and they couldn't afford to buy it, if it did happen.

The "new" Chevy Caprice is also purpose built as a police car.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Yes, the F-150's are used for some patrol but mostly crime scene stuff, foul weather, and special events patrol like todays Super Bowl. Go to Vegas and you see them alot also and I was in Mexico a few months back and many of the Federalizes drove Rams. Trucks have a place.

As for the Charger we have a few around here but they were not well received being Uni-Body. Same with any care that is Uni-Body for this type of work. I know in the future they will have to cave and give in but the Crown Vic gives a much safer feeling even though it may not be on paper. Hard to break habits, even for the police.

Chris

 

[yelbike]

Well I made my choice and I did it. I bought an loaded limited expedition el.
Its new to us but 2007. I get it home next friday. Thanks everyone for the advice.

Two things pushed me over to the ford side. First was the shop that did my transmission in my tahoe. The owner told me that chevs burnt lots of tranys but the fords are just better units. He said he could show me a stack 6' thick of invoices to prove it. No where near that for the fords. He said other transimission shops around were finding the same thing. He also drives an older expedition and he tells me that its never in his shop.

The other thing was thinking abou my ranger. Its a 1996 4 litre 2wd. I bought it when I was a 19 year old kid and I drove the crap out of it. Now I drive it nice but it still has a ton of miles. I've seen them with 550 km in the wreaking yard. I've done very little repairs to it. two brake jobs, lots of tires one clutch control arm bushing x2 and hanger bearing x2.

 

[ultrarunner]

My friend tows a 22 foot 10k+ trailer about 500 miles a week for his business... he has bought new Fords and Chevrolet. It is also his weekend family hauler... his other family car is a Miata...

In retrospect... his best in terms of getting the job done and reliability was the Diesel Excursion.

The Ford Crew Cab and Chevrolet Crew Cabs... both Diesel 3/4 tons came up short.

Now he has a 3/4 ton Suburban... the mileage is about 11 towing... not nearly what he was anticipating... creature comforts are good.

Had 3400 miles on it when it went to limp home mode on the Bay Bridge... something wasn't right... Dealer had for 10 days and install a complete new power plant with all the accessories... said it was the most efficient thing to do.

It's been 10,000 miles since and no problems other than the fuel mileage...

 

[HeavyHitch]

I have both an 03 Excursion and an 05 Suburban....the Excursion dwarfs the Suburban...parked side by side, you'd swear you could could park the Suburban in the back of the Excursion. The Excusrion is built as a people moving trailer pullin' tank and the Suburban is more of a people movin' small trailer pullin' Cadillac. They each have their purpose in my opinion.

 

[yelbike]

I checked the dash read out for the expedition when I test drove a used one at another dealer, it showed 9 mpg. I guess I'm paying a premium for my wifes and kids safety. Thats cheap insurance I think.

A local fire chief was bring his grand daughter to daycare in his ford escape and clipped the side rear of a tractor trailer, torn the side of the escape right off. The little girl died a week later in hospital. Sad. I could not handle that. I'll guzzle gas at $10 per gallon.

 

[timswi]

I checked the dash read out for the expedition when I test drove a used one at another dealer, it showed 9 mpg. I guess I'm paying a premium for my wifes and kids safety. Thats cheap insurance I think.

A local fire chief was bring his grand daughter to daycare in his ford escape and clipped the side rear of a tractor trailer, torn the side of the escape right off. The little girl died a week later in hospital. Sad. I could not handle that. I'll guzzle gas at $10 per gallon.

I feel the same way.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Congrats on the new truck. I am sure you will love it. My sister has a sharp Expedition EL and loves it. Hers is around a 2010 and has been trouble free. They got it new in 09??? It gets much better MPG than you are reporting. Somewhere around 15 average and they took it to OBX and got 18ish.

Chris