Ford 6.2 VS GM 6.0

[buickanddeere]

How many miles of towing ?
How about the 1500 with the Max Trailering Package ? That gets rid of the port injected engine and into the direct injection engine.

Max Trailering Package w/6.2L EcoTec3 V8 Engine $1,165
Includes 9.76" rear axle and revised shock tuning for increased control.
3.42 Rear Axle Ratio
Integrated Trailer Brake Controller
Enhanced Cooling Radiator
Heavier Duty Rear Springs
Increased RGAWR
20" x 9" Polished Aluminum
50.8 cm x 22.9 cm.
This option features:
Heavy-duty radiator
Heavy-duty rear springs
Polished finish wheels
Aluminum wheels
Trailer brake controller

Engine: 6.2L EcoTec3 V8 $2,975
Includes active fuel management, direct injection, variable valve timing and aluminum block construction.
Active Noise Cancellation
6 Speaker Audio System
This option features:
OHV
Variable valve timing
V8
Gasoline direct injection
Front mounted
Regular unleaded fuel
Electronic ignition
Longitudinally mounted
Aluminum engine block
Aluminum cylinder head
Cylinder deactivation
SAEJ1349 AUG2004 compliant
ULEV III emissions
Tier 2 Bin 5
Active noise cancellation
Engine: Vortec 6.0L VVT V8 SFI FlexFuel Incl.
E85-compatible. Capable of running on unleaded on up to 85% ethanol. Horsepower: (hp / kw @ rpm): 360 / 268 @ 5,400.Torque (lb.-ft. / Nm @ rpm): 380 / 516 @ 4,200.

Variable valve timing
V8
Sequential multi-point electronic fuel injection
Front mounted
Regular unleaded fuel
Electronic ignition
Longitudinally mounted
Iron engine block
Aluminum cylinder head
SAEJ1349 AUG2004 compliant

Transmission: Electronic 8-Speed Automatic w/OD $0
Includes tow/haul mode, cruise grade braking and powertrain grade braking.
This option features:
Automatic transmission
Overdrive
Lock-up torque converter
Electronically controlled Transmission

 

[Copperhead]

The problem with comparing a 1500 to a 2500/3500 is payload. Except maybe yanking around ag type trailers with draw bars, one is hardly ever going to be able to pull the max tow rating without going over on payload rating. There is a reason the 1500 is a Class 1 truck and not a Class 2 or 3. There is far more to towing capability than engine output. One can comfortably drop 2500 lb in the back of a 6.0L 2500 and just be nudging the GVWR. That would be significantly over the GVWR of a 1500.

And the 6.0L in my 2500 is flex fuel, which is great right now. Filled up Saturday with E85 at $1.49 a gallon. Sure, the fuel economy is less, but even with that, the cost per mile is still substantially less than regular E10 ($2.41), and even more so than regular E0 ($2.72) or premium ($3.03), which the 6.2L Ecotec needs to make the advertised power. I usually get around 11 mpg for all miles when using E85 (14 on regular E10). That comes to about 13.5 cents a mile on E85. On premium, I would have to get 23-24 mpg all the time... city, rural, highway, everything combined... and that would only be the break even. Not going to happen with my 2500 with a 6.0, and compared to a 6.2L 1500, I would still have much more towing capability with the 6.0 2500 and will cost less to purchase and operate.

 

[Turbys_1700]

I tow occasionally with my 07 2500 HD Classic. It is the lower HP version at 300 vs 360. With 4.10 gearing it handles what I do fine. That includes a small single axle 10 foot trailer and a double axle 14 foot cargo. The cargo trailer pulls a lot harder due to wind resistance and gas mileage drops to 9 on the interstate. Around town driving it gets 11. I did drive over 300 miles to pick up my bush hog pulling a 7000# 16 foot utility trailer and it pulled it without any issues. It is a fine truck.

I prefer 3/4 and ton trucks over 1/2 ton trucks also Copperhead for the exact reasons you state.

 

[Btown]

The problem with comparing a 1500 to a 2500/3500 is payload. Except maybe yanking around ag type trailers with draw bars, one is hardly ever going to be able to pull the max tow rating without going over on payload rating. There is a reason the 1500 is a Class 1 truck and not a Class 2 or 3. There is far more to towing capability than engine output. One can comfortably drop 2500 lb in the back of a 6.0L 2500 and just be nudging the GVWR. That would be significantly over the GVWR of a 1500.

And the 6.0L in my 2500 is flex fuel, which is great right now. Filled up Saturday with E85 at $1.49 a gallon. Sure, the fuel economy is less, but even with that, the cost per mile is still substantially less than regular E10 ($2.41), and even more so than regular E0 ($2.72) or premium ($3.03), which the 6.2L Ecotec needs to make the advertised power. I usually get around 11 mpg for all miles when using E85 (14 on regular E10). That comes to about 13.5 cents a mile on E85. On premium, I would have to get 23-24 mpg all the time... city, rural, highway, everything combined... and that would only be the break even. Not going to happen with my 2500 with a 6.0, and compared to a 6.2L 1500, I would still have much more towing capability with the 6.0 2500 and will cost less to purchase and operate.

Yes your E-85 is cheap. In the northeast it’s more than E-10 gas so it is not worth buying if you have a flex fuel vehicle.

 

[Copperhead]

I do admit that it is a regional thing at times. While I filled for $1.49 the other day, I then later saw it for $1.39 in Nebraska a couple of days later. I saw it in Chicago yesterday for $1.79. The midwest is swimming in the stuff. One would think that it would have an effect on gas prices (lower) in other parts of the country.

 

[robertsa]

I do admit that it is a regional thing at times. While I filled for $1.49 the other day, I then later saw it for $1.39 in Nebraska a couple of days later. I saw it in Chicago yesterday for $1.79. The midwest is swimming in the stuff. One would think that it would have an effect on gas prices (lower) in other parts of the country.

OPEC controls the price of oil which influences gas prices. The ethanol fuels are made from corn; the corn being subsidized by the government. Since the producer of oil and producer of corn are two different entities, the price of one isn't going to substantially impact the other. Blending the ethanol in creates a lower cost product at the pump, but the gasoline in it costs the same. E85 just has less gasoline in it, so costs less.

I can get E85 locally, but my fuel economy drops enough that after doing some pencil whipping, costs me more than paying for E10/15 at a higher price. I may have to revisit the E85 discussion once my car's engine rebuild is complete, and it's on the dyno. The higher octane rating of E85 is beneficial in that capacity, if necessary.

The real problems I have with ethanol blended fuels are the government subsidies and incentives given to farmers and fuel suppliers. There's no money in it but many grow corn meant for ethanol production because there is money through the subsidies. Gas stations receive local and federal incentives to offer E85 fuel, with the added smoke and mirrors effect of having an absurdly low price on your sign to lure people in. You and I fund these with our tax dollars. My wife and I paid over $50,000 in federal taxes alone last year to fund programs like this that make no sense except to the people raking in those taxpayer dollars. These large lobbying groups force politicians to make decisions that make no sense to anyone except their beneficiaries. $$$$$$$$

 

[nikerret]

I recently bought a 2014 Ford F-350 crew cab dually chassis cab with the 6.2L and 4.30 LS rear end and the maximum spring upgrades available, when ordered. I've only towed around 8,000 pounds with it, thus far (had the truck less than two months, still getting it work ready). I thought it pulled great, into a headwind with a terrible aerodynamic load, the BX25D-1 plus a couple thousand pounds of scrap metal. On a less windy day, I hauled a dump trailer that was just under 6K, total, drove like nothing was there. I'm looking forward to getting my dump trailer and really seeing how it can do, closer to maximum rated load.

The diesel is fine, for going over the road, but I decided it wasn't for me, since I drive mostly in town and at trips under ten miles, at a time. Plus, these new diesels are powerful, but **** on maintenance.

From everything I read, the GM 6.0 is a fine engine, as well, the Ford just happened to be a great deal with all the options I required. I drove 330 miles, one way, to pick it up. The F-350 is rough riding, but I bet the pickup versions are much softer with their fewer leaf springs.

 

[Copperhead]

OPEC controls the price of oil which influences gas prices. The ethanol fuels are made from corn; the corn being subsidized by the government. Since the producer of oil and producer of corn are two different entities, the price of one isn't going to substantially impact the other. Blending the ethanol in creates a lower cost product at the pump, but the gasoline in it costs the same. E85 just has less gasoline in it, so costs less.

I can get E85 locally, but my fuel economy drops enough that after doing some pencil whipping, costs me more than paying for E10/15 at a higher price. I may have to revisit the E85 discussion once my car's engine rebuild is complete, and it's on the dyno. The higher octane rating of E85 is beneficial in that capacity, if necessary.

The real problems I have with ethanol blended fuels are the government subsidies and incentives given to farmers and fuel suppliers. There's no money in it but many grow corn meant for ethanol production because there is money through the subsidies. Gas stations receive local and federal incentives to offer E85 fuel, with the added smoke and mirrors effect of having an absurdly low price on your sign to lure people in. You and I fund these with our tax dollars. My wife and I paid over $50,000 in federal taxes alone last year to fund programs like this that make no sense except to the people raking in those taxpayer dollars. These large lobbying groups force politicians to make decisions that make no sense to anyone except their beneficiaries. $$$$$$$$

Very few farmers grow corn specifically for the ethanol producers. The vast majority of corn is sold on the markets as it always has been and ethanol producers buy at market rates from whomever will sell to them. There are no direct corn subsidies. Corn prices are not in the basement yet. There has been no direct corn price support payments this century. Sure, there is some crop insurance premium support and such, but that applies to whether one is growing corn, soybeans, or green beans. And there is some land set aside payments that are made to keep land out of crop production. But that applies to more than just land that was primarily used for corn production. And all ethanol subsidies were eliminated in 2011. Some retailers have gotten some grants to install blender pumps that allow the buyer to select various blends, but ethanol producers and farmers don't sell the stuff retail. Ethanol is traded on the commodity market.

Ethanol is traded on the Chicago Commodities Exchange, just like all the other fuels from regular gas to diesel to jet fuel. The closing price on Friday on the exchange was $1.47. Gasoline closing price was $1.81

E85 does have regional pricing advantages, for sure. That is true of any product depending on where it is produced, transport costs to move to another area, etc. I am very sure that in some areas of the country, I wouldn't buy it either because the price spread is not worth it. But look at it this way... I buy the stuff regularly in my area because the price is very good, and that frees up more gas for everyone else. Hey, we all win! Just fueled with the stuff at $1.66 a gallon. Regular gas is going for $2.49 in my area. That is a 83 cent spread. Even with the mpg differences between these two fuels, I would be stupid not to buy E85. I save almost 3 cents a mile using it. Was just in Indiana yesterday, and saw E85 for $1.69. So my area doesn't have an exclusive. South Dakota, pricing is usually even lower than I typically enjoy.

 

[Btown]

I’m glad that you have cheap E85. Right now in Massachusetts gas is around $2.50 and E85 is over $3.00. So almost no one buys it. I remember the problems we have when it is cheaper than gas. People would see the low price, fill up and get 1-2 miles down the road and their car dies, because their car is not E85 compatible.

 

[Copperhead]

That can be a problem. It is hard to fix stupid.