Ford Focus Hated. Who did not see this coming?

[IslandTractor]

If I understand this correctly, you are saying that by limiting US production of oil on the world market, we are not affectly the price of oil? And even though we have more oil then all of the Middle East, if our government allowed that oil to be drilled, that would not have an affect on the world price of oil?

Supply and demand means that you pay more when something that is wanted is in limited supply. Since there is no shortage of oil, and the world economy is down, then either the available supply is also down, or there is some fear of it's ability to be supplied.

There is no shortage, but there is a fear of supply due to conflict in the Middle East. (Iran)

By opening up the US to drilling, there will be more supply available. It doesn't have to actualy be there, but since the price of oil is bought on speculation, those who invest their money will not pay as much when they know that more oil is in the process of becoming available.

Supply and Demand

Eddie

Honestly I have not been following this issue closely but I understand that the US is producing more oil today than at any time in our history. We are also using less than we were a few years ago. The issue is not US oil production but rather Chinese and Indian and other developing nations increased consumption. This was bound to happen as the US has traditionally used something like a quarter of the world's oil even though our population is only about 10% of the total or so and as the rest of the world catches up with internal combustion engines etc the total demand is going to increase. Could we produce more? I'm sure we could but any decision made today would take a decade or so to influence the markets. I'd rather focus on conservation so that future generations in the US will have access to national oil not just for automotive use but more importantly as a raw material for plastics etc. We will eventually certainly make a switch over to solar and other replaceable forms of energy to power our vehicles, the question is how to balance the development of that technology with the economics of current use.

The other issue is that it is not just supply and demand but also speculation in oil prices. I don't pretend to understand how the system works but if Wall Street and similar groups have anything to do with it then you can be assured that prices will be manipulated to benefit the few rather than the many.

 

[arrow]

I understand your point but think that in the era of 24 hour news cycles and investigative journalism (neither present during the 1950's) it would be hard to keep that sort of collusion out of the public eye. Also, while I don't doubt it was in GM's interest to foster cars rather than mass transit, they really did not rip up all the trolley tracks (Boston, NYC, Philly, Chicago, SF etc etc never did). I don't doubt that smaller towns ripped up the trolley tracks but wonder how much of that was the local economy and local tax cost of extending those lines into the new suburbs. No doubt there was an absence of any national policy to keep or develop mass transit solutions during that time however. I'd personally attribute it less to shenanigans by GM and more to just the post WWII boom generation and their desires. Easy to understand a desire for an individual vehicle over mass transit so long as you don't calculate the long term costs.

My problem is that when media did not concentrate on the obtuse things America's leaders did, what happened still effected its populace. I also admit to being quite jaded and to some extent, living in the past as I see it as a precursor for the future. I shall never forget the interview Merv Griffin did with a Charles Irwin or Erwin or something like that in the early sixties. At any rate, this was a man who was appointed secretary of defense in the 50's by Eisenhower. He was also former president of GM. Merv brought up the subject of mass transit and what influence GM had in its development or lack there of. When asked point blank about GM's role, there was a smile , a wink and a twinkle in Mr. Irwins eye so you knew right then and there that GM most certainly had a major role in the transportation shape of America. Cars then became the cell phones of today. You are correct that large cities never removed all of their tracks but rest assured, these lines were never developed into something more at that time or nothing like Europe had fostered and had little to do with the economies of the time as we were in a boom time period building roads like crazy. We could have also been putting in tracks but that would go against what some were trying to do to make more money. The other thing is that the media will center on whoever they do not like. The media seems to be liberal biased so that which would be relentlessly covered otherwise might have a little bit of under the rug sweeping if they think it injurious to those they do like. I'll be dead before this energy story comes to its climax but I certainly hope whatever happens is of benefit to our grand children.

 

[two_bit_score]

If the data is available from a "lot of sources", please post it.

Learn to use google.

 

[two_bit_score]

Who and where is there a recovery? Unemployment is still worse then when Bush left office, and that's after Obama changed the rules to get the numbers to look better with more people being out of work.

Car sales, Home sales, and retail sales are all down. Where is the recovery that caused the price of oil to decline?

I don't get this at all.

Eddie

We are seeing a little bit of a recovery, not much, but a cautious one. Rassmusen is reporting that consumer confidence is back up to the 2008 level.

This is because people are excited about getting to vote Obama out this November. People are really excited about this. They are expecting the SC to declare OBAMACARE unconstitutional or if that doesn't happen then getting a new president and congress to repeal it.

People are excited about taking the country back and that is transmitting into some economic recovery.

The real momentum will start right after election day when Obama is voted out.




.

 

[IslandTractor]

Learn to use google.

As noted previously, the data you keep referring to is only published in a private subscription newsletter. No place else. It is the analysis of a private petroleum think tank. You simply quoted the one or two sentence synopsis which was in their news release and which gave zero detail on the methods or assumptions used in their model. Best to just admit that rather than sending people on wild google chases.

 

[IslandTractor]

We are seeing a little bit of a recovery, not much, but a cautious one. Rassmusen is reporting that consumer confidence is back up to the 2008 level.

This is because people are excited about getting to vote Obama out this November. People are really excited about this. They are expecting the SC to declare OBAMACARE unconstitutional or if that doesn't happen then getting a new president and congress to repeal it.

People are excited about taking the country back and that is transmitting into some economic recovery.

The real momentum will start right after election day when Obama is voted out.

.

Dream on.

 

[JasG]

Honestly I have not been following this issue closely but I understand that the US is producing more oil today than at any time in our history.

Our peak production was in the 1970's or 80's. I know,I know, it's hard to believe, but our President is mistaken (Ok he lied). It has been in decline ever since due to games both political parties have played. We are currently at about an 8 year high mainly due to drilling on private land. On federal lands it's at a 8-10 year low.


Here are a couple of sources.

United States Crude Oil Production by Year (Thousand Barrels per Day)


N. American oil output could top 40-year-old peak - Houston Chronicle


U.S. oil production up, but not on federal lands - Washington Times

 

[IslandTractor]

Our peak production was in the 1970's or 80's. I know,I know, it's hard to believe, but our President is mistaken (Ok he lied). It has been in decline ever since due to games both political parties have played. We are currently at about an 8 year high mainly due to drilling on private land. On federal lands it's at a 8-10 year low.


Here are a couple of sources.

United States Crude Oil Production by Year (Thousand Barrels per Day)


N. American oil output could top 40-year-old peak - Houston Chronicle


U.S. oil production up, but not on federal lands - Washington Times

A politician would lie or twist the truth? I'm shocked and disappointed. Guess it's time to switch my allegiance to Newt who promises overnight $2.50/gal gas.

Thanks for the data. Guess it is time to come up to speed on some of this.

 

[two_bit_score]

Our peak production was in the 1970's or 80's. I know,I know, it's hard to believe, but our President is mistaken (Ok he lied). It has been in decline ever since due to games both political parties have played. We are currently at about an 8 year high mainly due to drilling on private land. On federal lands it's at a 8-10 year low.


Here are a couple of sources.

United States Crude Oil Production by Year (Thousand Barrels per Day)


N. American oil output could top 40-year-old peak - Houston Chronicle


U.S. oil production up, but not on federal lands - Washington Times

It takes years to obtain leases and develop production. Then to get it from crude to refined product on a scale that impacts the market is not quick.

There has been a lot of information out there about lag in production that was started under GWB showing up now and how Obama has done everything he can to falsely claim credit for it.


.

 

[two_bit_score]

As noted previously, the data you keep referring to is only published in a private subscription newsletter. No place else. It is the analysis of a private petroleum think tank. You simply quoted the one or two sentence synopsis which was in their news release and which gave zero detail on the methods or assumptions used in their model. Best to just admit that rather than sending people on wild google chases.

If it was false you would have found something by now to show it and you'd be crowing about it.

I can't help you if you won't help yourself. But that is the leftwing way, isn't it? Always wanting someone else to do your work for you?



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