Future of HVAC and industry supply issues.

[ultrarunner]

Don’t get me started on operating system obsolescence…

We went to VOIP phones and all is ok as long as the Internet is working.

Can’t page or call another department if Internet down.

I did keep a few analog lines on cordless sets for language translation and they have come in handy when the main phones are down…

Face it… just not a subscription kind of person…

 

[Sigarms]

Don’t get me started on operating system obsolescence…

We went to VOIP phones and all is ok as long as the Internet is working.

Can’t page or call another department if Internet down.

Honestly, no knowing nothing about phones other than the fact that when I'm in the office, they changed them last year, and now I don't even know how to transfer someone to another extension. For the last 25 years, any company I worked for pays me for my cell phone, and that's the SAME number I've used and one I know how to work

The KISS meathod is becoming something of an extinction IMO.

 

[ultrarunner]

Now that we are renting temporary air the focus is on finding a solution...

Replace condensing coils and sheet metal of air handler

Consider scrapping existing and going with 7 package units

Replace all existing with a new built up system with or without 100% outside air...

The options are influenced by future regulatory changes and projected years at this location.

Regulation of the HVAC industry is far reaching ranging from refrigerants to efficiency all the while meeting medical requirements...

 

[milkman636]

Having the hot water heating loop with pnuematic actuation is probably the key to the long track record of accurate control. Pnuematic actuators are super responsive. As the DX cooling steps up and down through its stages the heating loop is able to react quickly and keep things on point. It sounds like someone originally did a good job of laying out an effective system. If the structure and evaporator coil in the air handler are still good, I’d probably concentrate my efforts into doing a coil changeout on the condenser. In my past I’ve done a 50-ton condenser coil replacement over a weekend.

If you get into new equipment and new controls you’ll have a hard time staying pnuematic. Electric actuation has a huge cost advantage. Getting an experienced installer that has the expertise to get the processes tuned and timed right will probably be a challenge too. The good guys are rare and typically not the lowest bid. Even big names in the control industry have morphed their business model to the point where the guys in the field installing controls just load what someone in another state or country have sent them, and then report back the troubles and wait for a revised program from India, Australia, Germany, etc……

More local knowledge and ability was required before this internet thing happened. Now major global players in the industry are able to concentrate most of their thinking into two or three buildings located around the world.

 

[skipandtry]

I'd say it's all about adapting to new tech while seeking reliable options. One thing is the increasing importance of maintenance - when you said the York Heat Pumps required larger circuits and weren't as reliable, it reminded me of some experiences I've had with ac repair hamilton. Even if Heat Pumps are seen as the future, their usability isn't universal. I believe a blend of solutions that include not just pumps but gas systems too, might be the way forward, depending on the location and specific needs. It's a complex landscape, but that's part of the exhilaration in our field, right?

 

[ultrarunner]

We have had some days pushing a 100 which is very hot here plus one day with high humidity which is rare but the reminent of the Tropical Storm.

The first 3-days the 30 ton generator powered temp air combined with the 40% circuit A still working has performed well… no one getting fired.

Temp cooling availability was limited and my choices were 20 ton, 30 ton, 80 ton and 150 ton at corresponding price points.

I went with 30 to supplement the 40% cooling I still have in the original Air Handler.

The combination is working so well why not simply place a 50 ton permanently on the roof and duct the 20 feet to the existing air handler?

No more old coils, compressors, condenser fan motors, etc…

The temp unit has remote capability and would seem a simple way to get past R22?

 

[milkman636]

Well, the first hurdle that comes to mind would be the city wanting you to obtain a stamped blessing from an A/E firm stating the roof structure is adequate for the additional load. They will also want stamped drawings from a mechanical engineer detailing the changes before they will even review the plan for conformance to city mechanical code. Then there’s the whole issue of opening up the roof to create the necessary supports for the ducts and equipment. There would also be considerable expense in insulating the whole assembly so that the greater potential losses to the 100+ degree roof conditions won’t require an upsize to 60+ tons. Theres also a good possibility that the extra ductwork and transitions will require a bit more continuous fan horsepower to achieve the desired airflows.

There’s a lot of detail to work through to get the best plan, and many ways to make a good plan go bad.

 

[ultrarunner]

Very true plus screening may be required…

I need to compare weight of what’s there now to what a replacement would way.

In 2000 I reduced the built up system square footage by 20% and added two package units…

I realized that was 24 years ago…

 

[Sigarms]

Saw a commercial for a electric car the other night, never heard of it. Looked up the "manufacturer". May not be the future of inventory issues, but I definately see the similarities where the HVAC manufacturers are heading in the HVAC industry...

Only difference I can think of is there is one HVAC manufacturer "made" in the US that was bought out by a foreign company.

 

[ultrarunner]

See a few around even one in Doc parking.

My guess the most expensive EV to date owned by staff is Lucid…

Very impressive stats but in the ropes fonancially?