Gas & Diesel Titans go head to head on the Gauntlet

[tcartwri]

Surprised this hasn't been up here yet.

Not sure what Nissan was doing when they tuned the diesel, but it got smoked by the new version of the 5.6 Gas motor... Over a minute faster up the hill with the same load! Plus they had to keep lifting to stay under the speed limit.... hmmm....

 

[Diamondpilot]

Pretty disappointing performance by Cummins.

Chris

 

[Monster5601]

Looks like Nissan bit off more than they can chew. I'm not sure what market segment they we after, likely the ECODiesel segment or were they after the 3/4 ton market. Too expensive and lack-luster performance, they need to go back to the drawing board, reduce cost, and retune the engine.

 

[buickanddeere]

How is the best pickup chosen by a drag race ?

 

[tcartwri]

How is the best pickup chosen by a drag race ?

That's not the point. The pressurized oil burner should have made short work of this test at altitude. It also used nearly as much fuel over the same course, which is echoed in the feedback from Fuelly users.

Cummins missed the mark with this motor somewhere, or the transmission calibration is out to lunch.

 

[The Fred]

Anyone would be foolish to buy a new Diesel car or truck with all the overpriced BS emissions.
Maybe lease it for 3 years and let it go back.

I have so many customers with TDIs that are broken emissions wise and waiting for the big buyout from VW to finally come.

Buyer beware of any new Diesel garbage! If anyone on this forum thinks they are going to have a 6 year or better note on a Diesel truck and keep it past 100K with zero issues think again.

Regards, Fred

 

[Snobdds]

The feds are requiring diesel emissions equipment to be warrantied for 10 years. That will make the manufacturers design and build more reliable emission systems, or it will effect their bottom line.

It's just a mechanical system, they will perfect it soon.

 

[tcartwri]

The feds are requiring diesel emissions equipment to be warrantied for 10 years. That will make the manufacturers design and build more reliable emission systems, or it will effect their bottom line.

It's just a mechanical system, they will perfect it soon.

Except that it's a moving target.

 

[Snobdds]

Except that it's a moving target.

It may be a moving target forward but not backwards. A buyer knows what he's getting into when he signs on the dotted line.

It's always been like this.

 

[tractorshopper]

This is why they make tuner chips and diesel emission mods.

 

[buickanddeere]

That's not the point. The pressurized oil burner should have made short work of this test at altitude. It also used nearly as much fuel over the same course, which is echoed in the feedback from Fuelly users.

Cummins missed the mark with this motor somewhere, or the transmission calibration is out to lunch.

It's 2016 not 1990.

 

[rankrank1]

Hearsay Reports are that Ram actually asked Cummins to build the baby Cummins. However the performance was not up to what Ram desired nor was the fuel economy anywhere near targets Ram specified. Ram declined the option on the Cummins motor accordingly to hearsay. Nissan immediately snatched the Cummins up hoping for relevance in their declining truck market banking on the Cummins name might inject some interest.

Ram made their ecodiesel internally after the baby Cummins fell so short of their targets by a large margin.

 

[MossRoad]

Anyone notice the gasser had 7 gears, the diesel had 6? And the diesel never seemed to shift down, while the gasser kept grabbing gears when needed? Anyhow, good test and fun to watch.

 

[Raspy]

Hearsay Reports are that Ram actually asked Cummins to build the baby Cummins. However the performance was not up to what Ram desired nor was the fuel economy anywhere near targets Ram specified. Ram declined the option on the Cummins motor accordingly to hearsay. Nissan immediately snatched the Cummins up hoping for relevance in their declining truck market banking on the Cummins name might inject some interest.

Ram made their ecodiesel internally after the baby Cummins fell so short of their targets by a large margin.

Lots of hearsay there. The Ram, Cummins, Nissan partnership fell apart when Chrysler restructured. Nissan already had a deal with Chrysler and Cummins.

The Eco-diesel is not an in-house Chrysler engine, it's a VM Motari engine from Italy. VM and Ram have worked together before with the Jeep Liberty diesel. A different engine, but it to was a VM Motari.

 

[buickanddeere]

Anyone notice the gasser had 7 gears, the diesel had 6? And the diesel never seemed to shift down, while the gasser kept grabbing gears when needed? Anyhow, good test and fun to watch.

How is it a sin for a gasser to gear down on a hill? It ain't gonna blowup.

 

[MossRoad]

How is it a sin for a gasser to gear down on a hill? It ain't gonna blowup.

You take offense to too many things too easily.

I was commenting on the gasser's ability to find the CORRECT GEAR while the diesel couldn't. If you'd have watched the video and listened to the commentary, the diesel was floored and slowing down while the gasser just grabbed another gear and accelerated. They had to slow down with the gasser because they were exceeding the speed limit. The gasser won. I was rooting for the gasser.

We all know what year it is. Your endless comments about modern GDI gas engines and 2016 are unnecessary. We know about them. You're so angry you can't even tell when someone is agreeing with you! :confused3:

 

[fordmantpw]

You take offense to too many things too easily.

I was commenting on the gasser's ability to find the CORRECT GEAR while the diesel couldn't. If you'd have watched the video and listened to the commentary, the diesel was floored and slowing down while the gasser just grabbed another gear and accelerated. They had to slow down with the gasser because they were exceeding the speed limit. The gasser won. I was rooting for the gasser.

We all know what year it is. Your endless comments about modern GDI gas engines and 2016 are unnecessary. We know about them. You're so angry you can't even tell when someone is agreeing with you! :confused3:

FWIW, I took your post the way you intended it to be taken.

The diesel was saddled with either a mis-matched transmission, or bad programming. My guess is that the gasser gets the 7 speed for two reasons:

1) Because it needs an extra gear to keep up with the diesel
2) The Aisin 6-speed was the only one available to handle the power and torque of the Cummins.

I bet the outcome would have been different had the Cummins had the same tranny setup. However, the Cummins should have had the low-end torque to pull on through.

 

[MossRoad]

I was kinda shocked that he had it floored and the thing just sat there at 3000 RPM and didn't shift to a lower gear. Also, was he letting it shift all by itself? Could he have pulled it into a lower gear manually? Would it have helped? I know when I drive our cars in the mountains sometimes, especially our 2013 Impala with a 6 spd, it will upshift and start slowing down, then downshift and start speeding up and it gets annoying, so I pull it into a gear manually to keep constant engine RPM and road speed. I sacrifice a small amount of fuel mileage, but I think its easier on the drivetrain VS constant shifting and its easier on the flow of traffic to hold a steady speed, too.

 

[rankrank1]

Lots of hearsay there. The Ram, Cummins, Nissan partnership fell apart when Chrysler restructured. Nissan already had a deal with Chrysler and Cummins.

The Eco-diesel is not an in-house Chrysler engine, it's a VM Motari engine from Italy. VM and Ram have worked together before with the Jeep Liberty diesel. A different engine, but it to was a VM Motari.

Okay, I will bite. Who owns VM Motari? (Italian supplier or not Chrysler owns them lock stock and barrel making that in house in my eyes).

Numerous reports out there on the web (some more credible than others) and again I said most of it is hearsay, but if that little Cummins would have been a fuel miser game changing homerun of an engine do you really think the new restructured Chyrsler would have so willingly passed on it?

Rumors even out there that Ram may eventually replace the big Cummins in the 2500 and 3500 series with their own motors, but that is only rumor right now. Regardless enough rumors exist to make the diehard Cummins loyalists a little nervous.

 

[Midniteoyl]

I was kinda shocked that he had it floored and the thing just sat there at 3000 RPM and didn't shift to a lower gear. Also, was he letting it shift all by itself? Could he have pulled it into a lower gear manually? Would it have helped? I know when I drive our cars in the mountains sometimes, especially our 2013 Impala with a 6 spd, it will upshift and start slowing down, then downshift and start speeding up and it gets annoying, so I pull it into a gear manually to keep constant engine RPM and road speed. I sacrifice a small amount of fuel mileage, but I think its easier on the drivetrain VS constant shifting and its easier on the flow of traffic to hold a steady speed, too.

I think he was in auto the whole way just letting the tranny do what it wanted.. I too thought he would pull down a gear