Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences

   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #1  

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Now you wish you were a rocket scientist...

{from another web site}

Question

What is the difference between gasoline, kerosene, diesel fuel, etc.?

Answer



The "crude oil" pumped out of the ground is a black liquid called petroleum. This liquid contains aliphatic hydrocarbons, or hydrocarbons composed of nothing but hydrogen and carbon. The carbon atoms link together in chains of different lengths.
It turns out that hydrocarbon molecules of different lengths have different properties and behaviors. For example, a chain with just one carbon atom in it (CH4) is the lightest chain, known as methane. Methane is a gas so light, in fact, that it floats like helium. As the chains get longer they get heavier. The first 4 chains (CH4, C2H6, C3H8 and C4H10 or methane, ethane, propane and butane) are all gases that boil at -161, -88, -46 and -1 degrees F respectively. The chains up through C18H32 or so are all liquids and the chains above C19 are solids at room temperature.

The different chain lengths all have progressively higher boiling points, so they can all be separated by distillation. This is what happens in an oil refinery - crude oil is heated and the different chains are pulled out by their vaporization temperatures.

The chain lengths in the C5, C6 and C7 range are all very light, easily vaporized clear liquids called naphthas. They are used as solvents - dry cleaning fluids can be made from these liquids, as are paint solvents and other quick-drying products.

The chain lengths from C7H16 through C11H24 are blended together and used for gasoline. All of them vaporize at temperatures below the boiling point of water.

Next is kerosene in the C12 to C15 range, followed by diesel fuel and heavier fuel oils (like heating oil for houses).

Next come the lubricating oils. These oils no longer vaporize in any way at normal temperatures (for example, engine oil can run all day at 250 degrees F without vaporizing at all). Oils go from very light (like 3-in-1 oil) though various thicknesses of motor oil through very thick gear oils and then semi-solid greases. Vasoline falls in there as well.

Chains above the C20 range form solids, starting with paraffin wax, then tar and finally asphaltic bitumen used to make asphalt roads.

All of these different substances come from crude oil. The only difference is the length of the carbon chains!
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #2  
John -

Thanks very much for that post. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

You very clearly explained something that has puzzled me for many years -- you even put it into terms that I can understand (no small feat).

What still remains unclear is the combustion properties of the liquid fuels you describe. I assume that the lower vapor point of the lighter ones makes them more "explosive", but does that also mean they burn hotter?

Just trying to tie this in with some other discussions (that you apparently have read) about adding gasoline to diesel and what effects that will have. Also, I'm not clear on why putting diesel in a gasoline engine burned it up.

I'm a kindergartener here, so please be gentle. /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

HarvSig.gif
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences
  • Thread Starter
#3  
Harv,

A rocket scientist, I'm not!

I found this info somewhere on the web and saved it because I was interested in it. I too, felt it was well written.

Upstate New York gets a little cold for diesels in the winter and I've been "cutting" my diesel fuel for years with kerosene.

I've also heard of some "crazy's" using "gasoline" to help start a cold diesel. I think those same people use gasoline to help start their "outdoor charcoal grills" and you read about them in the newspapers the next day...

Different fuel oil suppliers have stated the only difference between #2 and #1 fuel oil is #1 has "kerosene" mixed for anti-gel purposes. The same goes for "home heating oil" (#2 Fuel Oil) and "diesel fuel" (#2 Fuel Oil) difference being 1. the excise tax added at the pump (retail) 2. sometimes a "dye" is used with the retail version. So the bottom line is #2 Fuel oil is #2 Fuel oil, etc.

I was never a big fan of these "automotive additives" in the stores and the "claims of": fantastic increase in horsepower you'll get, teflon super lubrication for life, major increase in mpg... etc. Most of all are marketing gimmicks...
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #4  
Well John until you posted that last post you sure had me fooled. Whoever wrote that sure knew his or her stuff about oil. I was impressed to say the least.
Thanks for taking the time to post that.
Gordon
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #5  
John,

Two great posts. Thanks.

Bill Cook
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #7  
John,

Fractional distallation of petrolem as described worked just fine for a lot of years, but produces product quantities that don't fit the market demand. Cataltic Cracking modifys the compositon of the heavy hydrocarbons to more valuable lighter products like gasoline. Cracking is the major process of todays refineries.

http://instruct.uwo.ca/engin-sc/391b/Assignments/es512_420/fcc.html
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #8  
in the owners manual for a VW diesel pick-up; VW recommend mixing gas with the diesel during cold weather; i don't remember the ratio; i didn't believe it either till the VW owner brought he manual in; according to him, it made the starting a lot easier.
heehaw
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #9  
Harv, You may have it reversed. I don't think diesel in a gas engine will "Burn up" the engine, I don't think it will even ignite the diesel. Gas in a diesel though, I would think would have a tendency to "pre detonate", igniting as the piston was still coming up, instead of detonating at the top of the stroke and pushing the piston back down AFTER it had already maximized it's upwards travel. This is all just an educated guess - anyone out there with some facts instead of "theory"?? /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #10  
Ahh. Thanks, I needed that. The previous explanation left me scratching my head (do a lot of that these days /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif), because I have heard refinery-people talk about "cracking" all the time. So the previous explanation left me puzzled as to where "cracking" fit in. This explains a lot, and leaves one more little piece out of that great tome "Everything I don't know"....

The GlueGuy
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #11  
Somebody else correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of diesel fuel is that it would be a relatively "low" octane rating (maybe somewhere around 60 or 70 octane?).

Reason I believe this is a number of years ago, Chevron accidentally contaminated some 100LL avgas in our area with jet fuel (similar to kerosene). Net result was that instead of getting 100 octane fuel, we had something that was below 80 octane. Caused pre-detonation for everyone that had an engine built for 100 octane.

Result was that about 1300 aircraft in our area had damaged engines (mine too). Things like bent valves, and other internal damage not easily repaired.

Bad news was my airplane was one of those that had gotten damaged. /w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif. Good news was that Chevron ponied up the cost to replace the engine /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif.

The GlueGuy
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #12  
Whats weard here is one of my old tractors had a "low cost fuel" option. The tractor had two gas tanks, one for gasoline (two gallons) and one for kerosene (17 gallons). The book is VERY specific that the engine must be started and fully warmed up on gasoline, then the fuel valve would get flipped over to the main tank and you would operate on kerosene. BUT you HAD to remember to switch back to the gasoline fuel BEFORE you shut off the engine or else you would have real problems trying to start on Kero.

I guess the main thing here is I'm talking about a 250 Cubic inch engine with a 5:1 compression ratio, HP rating of 33, and redline of 1325 RPM.
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #13  
I've never seen anything like that. However, I did drive a truck in the military that was a "multi-fueler". You could alledgedly run "any" kind of fuel in it. We mostly just put diesel in them, but occasionally would put in gas or kerosene.

The GlueGuy
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #14  
<font color=blue>Harv, You may have it reversed.</font color=blue>

Wouldn't be the first time. /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

I appreciate your thoughts, Gerard, but my comment was made back in early January, so I believe the statute of limitations is up. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

HarvSig.gif
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #15  
skent...
I worked For Case for a number of years and one day a guy brought an irrigation pump in that was powered by an old Case engine. At first glance I thought it was a gas burner, but once I started working on it, I saw it had two tanks for fuel. I got curious and went to the parts manual and found that it too, cranked on gas and then ran on kerosene once it warmed up. First time I'd ever seen an engine run on kerosene through a carberator. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

BTW.... that old engine was old enough that it had poured babbit bearings. I really enjoyed rebuilding that unit.
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #16  
skent: I watch "classic tractors" on my satellite dish, and a lot of the old John Deere tractors from the 1930's used a gas engine that was called a pony engine. You would start the pony engine and this engine would then be used to start the diesel engine. After the diesel was started you shut off the pony engine.

DaveH
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #17  
DavidH
Caterpillar used pony engines a lot too. My dad had several old D8's from the late 40's early 50's that used 2cyl pony engines to turn the big 6 cyl diesel and to heat it as well. The exhaust from the pony engine went through the intake on the big engine to warm it up, with the compression released of course.... then once it was warm, throw the lever to restore compression, throw the lever to engage the clutch on the pony motor and...... puttt....putttt......PUTTTTTT.... that old 6 cyl would fire off. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Max RPM on that old baby was about 1200rpms but man was it strong.
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #19  
John,
Here's a question for you. I went down to Mississippi to get some mares this weekend and up here in Iowa, Illinois, diesel is more expensive than gasoline. When you get down to Missouri, Arkansas, Tenn., and Miss. then diesel is less expensive than gasoline. Winterblend in all states, truck stops in all states. I asked them why and noone knew the answer. We're talking big differences too.

18-35034-TRACTO~1.GIF
 
   / Gas, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel Differences #20  
Running gas powered tractors on kerosene was extremely common from the very earliest gas tractor engines (around 1900) up until the early 1950s. At the time the cost of kerosene was much lower than gas. In order to run kerosene the engine had to have a fairly low compression ratio and a special heater box on the intake manifold to keep the air/fuel mixture warm. These engines were almost always overhead valve, even though flatheads were much more common in car engines. Old tractors usually had shutters on the radiator also to help them warm up faster. Kerosene has a lower energy density than gasoline so it delivered less power than gas, and was very difficult to start on, but the much lower cost made it attractive. The owners manual for my 1952 Case DC-4 has a complete set of instructions on how to start and operate a tractor with the "low cost fuel option". Now that kerosene costs more than gasoline there isn't much point anymore.

18-29930-MJBTractor.gif
 

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