GC2410 Hydraulic Shudder, etc

[mgstevens]

Hey all, I'm just getting to know my new-to-me 2009 GC2410. My pre-purchase shakedown showed the charging light on, so I negotiated a reduction for an alternator replacement, that is done and all appears well there. All the hydraulics worked fine pre-purchase (although I couldn't dig up the sellers yard..) and it ran smooth, once boosted. Once back at home I put the backhoe through some paces and afterward felt a [[shudder]] while running/driving/digging.

I reviewed this forum, and another, searching for "shudder." Saw one post referencing a driveshaft-as-problem, a few others calling the shudder "hydraulic," so I thought I'd start there. I removed the backhoe, and the shudder was gone! Running smooth, but I felt the hydro was relatively gutless, so I took a moment to check the oil-fill window on the back of the transmission. No oil showing!

I got out one of the three jugs of hydraulic transmission fluid that came with the tractor - generic brand - and proceeded to fill until the oil was just above half way up the window. Took it back out, and noticed that the hydro had more guts - go figure - but also that the shudder was also present again, albeit a little less than before.

So, I'm wondering if anyone can offer experience on this issue. I read a basic FAQ suggesting generic hydro fluid is not a good idea, and I'm thinking of a hydro oil change because of the low-fluid condition. I need to source the hydro filter first and find out if there are any other things to check and watch for. That is why I find these forums so valuable.

Thanks in advance for any responses.

 

[cglaser104]

Make sure you're running the proper hydraulic fluid for your Massey. I've had very poor luck on my GC1710 (newer model but very similar to yours) finding an alternate hydraulic fluid that I'd be comfortable running in it. Given that the fluid powers everything from drivetrain to implements it's important to hit the target there. Also, be sure to clean the hydraulic screen and change hydraulic filter was part of service. I never assume a prior owner was perfectly on point with regular service internals and fluids and filters are far cheaper than replacement OEM parts.

That said, if going through service doesn't restore regular operation you can double check your hydraulic quick connects for any debris and normal operation. They should be wiped thoroughly prior to reconnecting to keep dirt/grit/contamination from getting into the system. I have had to take my own QC's off and clean then in the past for this reason.

Let us know how it's going and good luck!

 

[DMW]

Hot/thin oil will cause significant shudder. Check your hydro cooling fan, ensure all the blades are there.
SCUTs are affected more by the oil quality, generic isn't that great for them. They generate a lot of heat. I would switch out to Kubota SUDT2. It will be more widely available than the Massey equivalent.

 

[mgstevens]

Thanks for the replies! Wondering: where is this extra "hydraulic screen?" Is this the item that one finds in the manual after "remove left rear wheel..", and called "suction filter?" Also, I will be sure to check the blades on the hydro cooling fan.

The "CO-OP" brand Hydraulic/Transmission Oil I have specifically mentions "meets or exceeds the Massey M-1141" spec, but so many folks say to stick with the PermaTran lll so now I am on the hunt for that, which already seems to have a new name if I read the tea-leaves online... Also, I can't seem to find a price online, just lots of replacement suggestions. Is the dealer the only source?

Turns out the $40 Hydro filter I need came with the purchase, and the invoice in the box says it was purchased in 2010 I'm not exactly sure what that implies, but changing the oil ASAP is now written in ALL CAPS!

I guess I was generally wondering if others have had this shudder issue and if so, what corrected it. The oil change is a must, but if it don't address the issue, I'll need options.

Thanks,

 

[cglaser104]

You may be able to use permatran 821 XL, verify with your dealer as this is what newer GC's are suggested to use.

 

[mgstevens]

You may be able to use permatran 821 XL, verify with your dealer as this is what newer GC's are suggested to use.

Yes that seems to be the new product number. I will check with the dealer.

 

[mgstevens]

I notice that in the manual, "Transmission Suction Filter" section, it mentions "apply sealant to threads on drain plug(s)" and I was also wondering what type of sealant people are using in this instance?

 

[cglaser104]

I notice that in the manual, "Transmission Suction Filter" section, it mentions "apply sealant to threads on drain plug(s)" and I was also wondering what type of sealant people are using in this instance?

I don't use a sealant. My gc1710 has a rubber O ring that seals the suction filter once tightened down.

 

[DMW]

I notice that in the manual, "Transmission Suction Filter" section, it mentions "apply sealant to threads on drain plug(s)" and I was also wondering what type of sealant people are using in this instance?

Suction filter has 2 O-rings, don't forget to re install afterwards. Do not over-tighten. The plastic will crack, or o-rings deform.


The drain plug on the transmission housing does not appear to have an o-ring.Any pipe thread resistant to oil/hydraulic fluid should do.(Permatexｮ Thread Sealant with PTFE as an example). Teflon tape should be avoided, but better than nothing.


The hydro oils in standard use now didn't really exist when your GC2410 was made. There were a few top tier makers , but not in general use. Avoid the "meets standard" on packaging. Just means it is probably made to the minimum requirements.
There are a lot more quality hydro oils to choose from. Permatran 821 XL, Kubota Super udt2 and Petro Canada Duratran XL Synthetic blend are all comparable. The Permatran has the worst ratings of the 3. Decision best made on price and availability. The top 2 IMO are Amsoil and Petro Canada Duratran Synthetic. Your fuel will gel before these fluids stop working at low temps.

 

[mgstevens]

I just called my local dealer, who like many/most BC dealers, identify largely as a Kubota dealer, but are also MF reps.

They use/sell the Kubota oil for $93CDN/20L (May 2019..) which appears to be a reasonable price. I cannot find a price online for the Duratran to compare, just some older pricing in a forum post that 3 years ago was higher than the dealer price quoted today. Dealer parts guy said that the MF Permatran is too expensive for them to carry.

On "meets/exceeds" i have three gallon jugs of Hydro-oil that came with the tractor which "meets or exceeds.." and specifically mentions the M-1141 spec of the MF oil. They may become relics, resold or used some day in the future, but not this time for sure. No chances taken on this refresh. I'm curious to see the state of the suction filter. Hoping this maintenance will smooth out the power of the machine.