Gear or Hydrostatic Transmissions for Compact Utility Tractors?

[Citydude]

Are you coasting when you do this? The clutch disengages the drive train from the engine, no? So how is that *not* a stop? I've never driven a shuttle or glide or anything fancy like that, but the old gear rigs I grew up on, under heavy pull, stopped dead when I pushed in the clutch.

That depends on how fast you can clutch, shift and dump the clutch. I usually grind to a stop, no pun intended...

 

[RaydaKub]

Yep. Never could figure out why any brand would design an HST tractor that you can't use the brakes in conjunction with the HST pedals. Now there will be posters talking about how they NEVER use their brakes and can't figure out why anyone would want to. They obviously have not been on our hills......

Well I never use the brakes to stop the tractor, and my hydro will stop you real quick. And you don't even need them to hold you on a steep hill after the charge pump bleeds down when you let off of the pedal, as you can just give it a little reverse pedal to hold you dynamically on the hill.

I'm with James on this one, Richard. My tractor isn't all that big, but when I go down my hill (about 22 degrees) I use 4x4 and stop where I need to just rocking the pedal back. If I forget 4x4, I *might* slide to the bottom depending on conditions, but if I'm sliding already, the brakes aren't gonna help anyway.

On gear tractors (not shuttle or glide or whatever), to approach your cliff, don't you have to rely on the brakes to stop, brakes to hold while you clutch and shift to reverse, and ease them off as you let out the clutch to try to back up? That's a lot of operations (and coordinated limbs!) I don't have to worry about.

 

[ovrszd]

So how much reverse pedal is needed becomes an experiment based on how steep the incline. James and you both have stated that.

My two gear tractors have wet disc brakes. One power assisted, one not. Both are crisp and precise.

Stopping and/or changing direction with precision is very simple. It is also predictable and accurate.

If an operator does not feel comfortable performing that task then by all means they should own HST. Preferably one with brake pedals on the left. Just in case they are needed. My JD is so equipped and I use the brake pedal in extreme situations. Without using the brake pedal I am left with the uncertainty of the delay in the HST system determining how far the tractor "drifts".

 

[RaydaKub]

As the HST gets even more complicated (because they can) with electronics and bells and whistles it only makes the case for the manual transmission more attractive. Less expensive, is way more simple to repair (HST might even be repairable without dealer help and special tools and sophisticated hydraulic measuring tools and meters), DT is easily straight forward mechanical repair, expectations of fewer problems. You put it in gear it moves. HS

Doesn't glide shift, shuttle shift, power reverser, etc. add the same kind of complexity to a standard transmission?

 

[RaydaKub]

So how much reverse pedal is needed becomes an experiment based on how steep the incline. James and you both have stated that.

My two gear tractors have wet disc brakes. One power assisted, one not. Both are crisp and precise.
Without using the brake pedal I am left with the uncertainty of the delay in the HST system determining how far the tractor "drifts".

I guess I can see where that is true. Maybe there is more drift in larger equipment. I don't find a lot in mine. And I have logged a LOT more time on a Case 730 and 930 than anything else and it was a long time ago. The brakes, especially the 730, were neither crisp nor precise. Inevitably, one side would engage before the other, so you never wanted the lock across the pedals; you usually had to cock your foot one way or the other to make it almost even. Heck, I'm not sure you could really classify them as "brakes". :laughing: Dang, they were poor.

But getting back to your example, if I were approaching your cliff, I wouldn't be going all that fast that I would worry about the HST's drift; I'd be easing up to it real slow.

 

[Turbys_1700]

Are you coasting when you do this? The clutch disengages the drive train from the engine, no? So how is that *not* a stop? I've never driven a shuttle or glide or anything fancy like that, but the old gear rigs I grew up on, under heavy pull, stopped dead when I pushed in the clutch.

My Workmaster is synchronized in gears 1-4. You can depress the clutch and shift up or back without stopping the tractor. Same thing with the forward and back reverse shuttle. Changing from Low to High requires a complete stop since it is not synchronized. In a hard pull I guess it would stop. I'm not typically speed shifting my tractor anyway. Usually just select the gear and go.

 

[mohead1]

Gear drive all tjhe way unless youre talkin garden tractor size

 

[jenkinsph]

Anything new-ish is a hard sell to folks that make a living with their machinery.

When you have powershift, clutchless reversers, high/low, declutch buttons, power from 1200 to 2300 rpm and lots of synchronized gears the attraction of hydro becomes nill.

It seems more industrial equipment is becoming hydrostatic each year. I make my living with my equipment too.

 

[ovrszd]

Gear drive all tjhe way unless youre talkin garden tractor size

Welcome to TBN.

This is a delicate debate with each side having strong feelings about the other side's lack of talent and knowledge concerning tractors. You have definitely stated your preference.

 

[ovrszd]

It seems more industrial equipment is becoming hydrostatic each year. I make my living with my equipment too.

Yep. Not being overly intelligent, I'm not sure why that is?? Must be improved technological design and assembly??? Seemed the HP rob and heat issue was always too much to bear years back.