Generac or Koehler whole house generator?

[Duds13]

If you never want to lose power again, buy a generator. lol

 

[WM75Guy]

I wanted a generator to power my 400A service for the house and the barn. Estimate based on whole load coverage was $65K installed with an 80 Kw Generac, transfer switch, wiring, and concrete pads for generator and propane tank. Generator alone was $36K. Going with the hay barn project instead.

 

[EddieWalker]

Generac is the top, widely available generator company. As with tractors, there probably isn't a huge difference.

From what I have seen, it will cost about the same to have the generator installed as it will to buy it. I'm looking at the 22kwh dual fuel (propane and diesel) option. I think it was about 10k, but the guys in Tyler wanted another 10k to install.

I haven't priced anything, but that seems kind of extreme to have them install it. Thanks for sharing, it makes me think it's something I'll have to figure out how to install myself.

 

[EarPlug]

I haven't priced anything, but that seems kind of extreme to have them install it. Thanks for sharing, it makes me think it's something I'll have to figure out how to install myself.

Installation is fairly simplistic. Remove the utility feed from your panel. Connect utility feed to the Transfer Switch. Connect the Transfer Switch to the Panel. Connect the Generator to the Transfer Switch. Connect Fuel to Generator.

I paid $15.8K for the Generator and electrical work and an additional $1500 for propane plumbing. One other consideration is the Fuel regulator need to be matched to the generator fuel requirements. I ended up with multiple regulators.

What could be done to reduce installation costs would be set the generator on the pad, mount the transfer switch, run the wiring from generator to transfer switch and panel. Then have an electrician do the final hookup.

Same could be done for the fuel source. Run the lines and have a qualified gas plumber do the hookups.

We were required to get a Permit and County inspection for the installation.

 

[jyoutz]

I wanted a generator to power my 400A service for the house and the barn. Estimate based on whole load coverage was $65K installed with an 80 Kw Generac, transfer switch, wiring, and concrete pads for generator and propane tank. Generator alone was $36K. Going with the hay barn project instead.

Would be far cheaper to have the electric company install a second meter at the barn to attach to your service box. Even if you have 2 different bills each month. I did that once. To save the cost of running drop poles and lines from the house service to the barn.

 

[ponytug]

Propane heat. Yes have A/C but have had backup generators for decades years so know the drill and know how to juggle things. My issue would really be the surge to start things. The motivation is advancing age.

My electrician is a friend and this is a close rural community where people take care of others. I would have him "service" the unit but I would change the oil and that sort of thing and would count on him to maintain the electrical aspect. I don't see a problem with that but just as a hedge hope I can retain my 10K/12K plug-in generator as a redundancy. It plugs into a receptacle outside and we flip a switch in the basement to run various circuits.

Someone needs to invent a box that goes in the garage and safely stores a week worth of energy to run things in a short-term emergency. The Tesla battery is pretty close but they need to figure out the safety aspect of the things so it won't burst onto flames or whatever..

It sounds like a great plan to have your electrician take care of things, and it sounds like you know the generator drill, which are both great. Variable/inverter AC units have lower starting draw that helps generator use. You can get your electrician friend to put on a soft start to ease the surge, but not all AC units are compatible. Don't put on a hard start as that makes the starting surge worse.

I never thought of the liquid cooled vs air cooled thing. My lawnmower is diesel cooled because I want the longevity and quality that goes into a liquid cooled, which implies commercial application while an air cooled consumer model leads me to think lesser quality and maybe not there when you need it.

I'm very appreciative to be able to discuss this with a group like this that has accumulated knowledge and experience on generators. Every post has something useful and lots of things brought up that most of us don't immediately think of.

I think ten years ago there was a big gap between air cooled and liquid cooled generators, but I think that Generac and others have realized that they were taking a hit because of the reputation for poor longevity of their air cooled units. (No idea if it is / was true.) I would comment that Caterpillar/Cummins purpose built a new 1l air cooled engine for generator use, and designed it to use synthetic oil that helps it live longer in high heat, high load home usage. That said, I went for diesel, because I have it for the ranch anyway.

We have solar and Tesla Powerwall 2s. The Powerwalls are mounted several feet from the house on a concrete wall. If they catch fire, it wouldn't be great, but it would be much better than on the house or in a garage. I've seen folks plant roses or shrubs in front of the Powerwalls so you don't have to look at them. I think wall mounting away from a building would be prudent for most battery systems. The newer Powerwall 3s are supposedly lithium phosphate and therefore a lower fire risk, but energy is energy in my book. The upside to Tesla is that they have a gizillion miles of experience with their battery systems, but the downside to Tesla is that they are constantly tweaking the software and the updates aren't always bug free.

At this point, I would consider any of the major battery brands, but make sure that you put enough in. ACs use a fair bit of energy.

All the best,

Peter

 

[bdhsfz6]

If you use a propane generator, consider the size of your propane tank. At full load, a 22K model will use a lot of fuel.

My neighbor found that out the hard way. During the last 7 day outage we had, he drained his 400gal tank in a little over 4 days.

Not a problem if your average outage is only a few hours, but something to think about.

 

[ponytug]

If you use a propane generator, consider the size of your propane tank. At full load, a 22K model will use a lot of fuel.

My neighbor found that out the hard way. During the last 7 day outage we had, he drained his 400gal tank in a little over 4 days.

Not a problem if your average outage is only a few hours, but something to think about.

Great point! It happened here to some folks that I know.

Something to be aware of some insurance companies and jurisdictions have rules around larger propane tanks, e.g. 1,000 gallon and up. It is one of the reasons why I went with diesel.

All the best,

Peter

 

[bdhsfz6]

Great point! It happened here to some folks that I know.

Something to be aware of some insurance companies and jurisdictions have rules around larger propane tanks, e.g. 1,000 gallon and up. It is one of the reasons why I went with diesel.

All the best,

Peter

My main genny is diesel also. I fuel it from my 1000 gal fuel oil tank. I keep it topped off during storm season and it would run the generator for a month if necessary.

 

[newbury]

Someone needs to invent a box that goes in the garage and safely stores a week worth of energy to run things in a short-term emergency.

The problem becomes when one defines "a week worth of energy " "things" and "emergency".
My last long power outage was probably Hurricane Isabel in 2003. We just hunkered down, lived more in the basement (cool). Didn't have a generator. Power was only out for a few days for me and the family (6 people).

If you never want to lose power again, buy a generator. lol

And that's what happened to me. After Isabel I bought a 7K generator at HD for ~$600 w/ Honda engine. I try to run it a couple of times a year. Have not needed it since 2003.

My best power purchase was a DEWALT 1800 Watt Portable Power Station and 20V/60V MAX Lithium-Ion Battery Charger, for ~ $200 years ago. I'll slide 4 batteries in to it, I can run my networking and lights off it for many hours.