General Forum Posting Guidelines

   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #31  
Thanks Mike. That appears to be what was done, cause it's open now. Though I still don't agree with it, not even temporarily. And I've seen it done on threads that weren't even contentious. The moderators just deemed them to be of "no further use". These types are really puzzling.

Free and open forum, I say. No "communist carte blanche".
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #32  
coasterez said:
The ease and unilateralism with which you choose to close threads is tantamount to censorship. If I want Milky toast, I'll go to church or visit a new age website. Open and frank discussions should not subject to closure just because you don't like the tone of what is being written.
This site is not a Democracy. This site is owned and operated by certain individuals. They have the absolute right to regulate what and how posting is done. I have been here since before it was even Tractorbynet and I personally believe that they do a splendid job. If they didn't there wouldn't be as many members as there are. A site doesn't get this large without doing something right. Anytime someone doesn't like the way things are handled they are free to leave and go to another site or even start their own. BTW, It is my opinion that a thread has never been closed that shouldn't have been. Most often these thread have developed into a shouting match and or name calling which benefits no one.
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #33  
Couldn't have said it any better myself Jerry.
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #34  
Jerry,

I never said they didn't do a lot of things right. It is a good site. But could be better, and that is why I don't agree with you. Closing posts and baning participants is censorship and results in the reduction of the dessimination of information. Information is what this site is about. You want to screen for profanity, name calling, etc. I wholely agree with that, and there are plenty of software products that do just that. But, otherwise leave the posts alone and let us determine what we want to read and respond to or not.

BTW this site is only as good as the inputs (and pluralism thereof) of the participants. If there was a better alternative, I would certainly go there. But, there's not. So, I offer criticism that I think would improve this site. You are wrong to not give it due consideration. Instead of saying: "if you don't like it here, go somewhere else then". Quite narrow-minded, I think, and not in the best interest of the forum. Or are you really on here to sell tractors and otherwise couldn't give a hoot about this site and the value of it's content?

And you are entitled to your opinion, and I value it (though I seldom agree). I will voice mine here too: NO post should be closed, EVER (notwithstanding technical limitations). There have been threads closed that contained absolutely no contentious dialogs at all, and there was no other apparent reason (at least none given). I have been left in the "lurch" more than once because of this.

The forum IS it's members. Without them, it would be nothing. In that sense, it is a democracy: We vote by coming here and participating. We vote by voicing our opinions, even in the face of the overbearing, rude, ignorant, misinformed, and disinformed. I want to choose what I read, not have some moderator do it for me.

Many threads "die" simply because they are complete, meaning that no one has anything else to say about it. This is exactly how all threads should die. Contentious, profane, "useless", or otherwise. In practice, I know it's not quite so easy. I've seen many threads get out of control with endless bantoring. When this happens, I refuse to continue to engage; may attempt to get back on topic; Read without comment looking for the finer thread of usefulness that might exist beneath the surface, or stop reading the thread altogether. I just think this should be my choice, not someone elses.

Tom
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #35  
A couple more "good" things for this site: Dealers (at least those that admit to being one) should be clearly noted under their member status for all posts. The same is true for moderators. Perhaps every member status should include some sort of member category such as owner/operator,contractor, dealer, future owner, moderator, etc. The terms currently used (new member, gold member, etc.) have some value, but could use further delineation.

Since, most of what are posted are opinions, such information would help to qualify the opinions being posted and whether the opinions MIGHT be swayed by conflicting interests or alterior motives. It will also have the effect that "seasoned" tractor veteran's opinions will probably garner more respect from their peers. I think this has been suggested before. Not sure why it's not being done???
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #36  
This leads me to wonder if dealers should even be moderators??? Hmmmm.....I'll have to think about that one a bit........
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #37  
coasterez said:
Since, most of what are posted are opinions, such information would help to qualify the opinions being posted and whether the opinions MIGHT be swayed by conflicting interests or alterior motives.
'Ulterior" motives. :)

coasterez said:
It will also have the effect that "seasoned" tractor veteran's opinions will probably garner more respect from their peers. I think this has been suggested before. Not sure why it's not being done???
It's not being done, because no one has come up with a meaningful way to determine what a "seasoned tractor veteran" is. Do you have a way?

coasterez said:
This leads me to wonder if dealers should even be moderators??? Hmmmm.....I'll have to think about that one a bit........
Think about what? That dealers should, or should not, be moderators?
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #38  
Thanks Mike for at least giving my thoughts some consideration. I'm not saying I have all the answers. Nor am I saying that this site is anything other than great. I've just been frustrated by closed threads (and I don't have a track record of being contentious either, mostly a silent lurker), and by folks with hidden agendas. I think there is always room to improve upon the forum.

Spelling has never been my strong point. I know when it might not be spelled right, but it's not sufficiently important to take the time to look it up. The message is clear enuff...... I mean enough. Did I miss your point, here?

Yes, a "meaningful way" to measure seasoning isn't so easy. Some are easy: dealer, moderator, novice (never owned or operated), etc. One thought off the top of my head (just thinking out loud):

The profile form helps the user select his/her own category. Say maybe based on seat time per task (mowing, backhoe, loader, ground engagements), and also collects and uses occupation, no. of machines owned, and so on. Maybe it's like century estater (100 hour estate user), or Millenium retiree (1000 hours or more), or 500 farmer? It doesn't have to be perfect. But, at least knowing how much experience they have on what type machines, and if one is a dealer, an excavation contractor,a bonafided farmer, retired hobbiest, caring for a 2 acre estate, or a weekend warrior, it would be helpful.

And one should be able to tell this without leaving the thread to read profiles. Heck, I'm always getting people mixed up because their info isn't handy on the thread. There's plenty of space on the left. Why not use it?

BTW, I think profiles should be mandatory in order to post a message. Read all you want, but post only if your profile is filled in. Of course someone could always completely misrepresent themselves. But, not much we can do about liars, now is it? At least they are forced to be outright liars as opposed to "unspoken liars".

On moderators, you are correct. Should or should not dealers be them? I see pros and cons. Dealers have a great deal to offer (no punns intended) and do so all the time. But, potential conflicts of interests might weigh in on performing their duties as moderators. I don't think that anyone whose livelihood depends on the sale of tractors or competing machines can separate their interests from what is purely right for the forum, and this is what concerns me. Also, the owners of this website, who make their money from advertising dealers and equipment also could have conflicts.

The reality is I don't even know who "our" moderators are (and I should). Maybe none are dealers. Perhaps it's my fault; maybe I just haven't taken enough initiative to search out who they are. But, it should be plainly obvious who you are and what you represent, and that goes for all of us, moderators, dealers, farmers, or whatever.

Closed threads are very frustrating, especially if they are closed when I'm in the middle of typing a long response. My whole response is simply lost when I try to post it. On those I'm simply observing, sometimes I'm left hanging with no closure to the topic. I just don't understand the reasoning for the oppressiveness.
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #39  
coasterez said:
J
Or are you really on here to sell tractors

There have been threads closed that contained absolutely no contentious dialogs at all, and there was no other apparent reason (at least none given). I have been left in the "lurch" more than once because of this.
If I had more than one tractor and I wanted to sell it I might try the classified adds, but I don't.

Would you please point out one of the threads that have been closed for no reason?
 
   / General Forum Posting Guidelines #40  
Jerry,

Most were some time ago, so I can't remember the threads. But, one in particular I do remember was in the rural living section (before countrybynet) and was posted by JimR (I think). It related to story he was telling about a neighbor flooding JimR's land and violating wetland regulations on his own property. I was reading the posts, finding the story very interesting and informative, and then there is the message, something like "we decided to close this thread as it has no further value". I was like who the heck is "we", and why does it not have any further value?

Basically you are calling me a liar, or that I'm simply stating things that aren't true. Well, Threads are closed all the time and little if any reasons are given. They are simply closed. Do you really think I would waste my time writing this if I didn't believe what I have said and have had "negative" experiences because of them? Anyway, I posted my thoughts on this. TBN can decide to do with it what they wish.
 

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