General Motors

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   / General Motors #51  
To me when at a union job and someone says, "Hey, slow down, you can't make too many widgets in one day or you'll screw up the quota" -- there is a productivity problem.
 
   / General Motors #52  
"The only place unions are able to succeed is in certain levels of the government. "

How about major league baseball, football and basketball. Seems they have survived pretty well.
 
   / General Motors #53  
<font color="blue"> I wonder which are the least productive -- Union workers or Government employees?

<font color="black">You certainly paint with a broad brush Gatorboy. To label all union and government employees as "unproductive" is simply ludicrous. By no means am I a staunch union supporter. Quite frankly, I don't have much good to say about the one I am a member of. However, I do feel the the need to reply to your comment.
I work on the line in a truck assembly plant. Our current "line speed" is 84 trucks per hour. This is roughly 43 seconds per truck for me to complete my job. In that 43 seconds I have several tasks to complete. I must first obtain and install 4 "J" clips into the lower radiator support. Then I determine which is the proper part for this particular truck. This part must then be pulled from one of three containers which are behind me. The part is then positioned into place. I then obtain 4 bolts and fasten the part down using an air wrench. All this while the truck is moving along at that 84 per hour speed. During a typical shift we build 700 trucks. So that means that I will install 700 parts per shift using 2800 clips and 2800 bolts. This job has been time studied by the company and has a 56 minute per hour workload under ideal conditions. Think every truck is ideal? Think every clip slides right in? Think every bolt lines up perfectly with that clip? One problem that costs you 7 or 8 seconds and you have to work that much faster on the next several trucks to catch up. Do I sound "unproductive" to you still?
Are there unproductive people where I work? Absolutely. Are there "easy jobs" that pay the same as mine? Yep. But the vast majority of the people work as hard or harder than I do. The vast majority EARN every penny they get.
You can not blame the problems of the Big Three solely on the union. Management has to share in the blame. Although Bill Ford took no salary last year, his bonuses and stock options totaled over 20 MILLION. In his last year as head of Ford, Alex Trotman received over 70 MILLION in salary and bonuses. Jacque Nasser, who almost destroyed Ford, negotiated a golden parachute when he "retired" that pays him MILLIONS of dollars to be, shall we say, "unproductive".
Wish you could walk in my shoes one night Gatorboy. Maybe then you could see what it's like to be an unproductive union worker /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif.</font>
 
   / General Motors #54  
Trkbldr,
You have my respect!!! Although I dont own a Ford, I still but American vehicles. The latest one was for my wife, 2006 Chevy Equinox, its a great vehicle that gets excellent milage. I drive a Dodge truck.

I cant relate directly to assembly line work, mostly because I have never done it. But I have been in the manufacturing enviroment 35 yrs , mostly as a toolmaker and or machinist. I know darn well there is nothing easy about what your doing!!!

I will continue to buy American whenever and wherever I can.

scotty

ps I hate outsorsing and what it does to our job force, whether it be automotive or other /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif We will all be affected in the long run.
 
   / General Motors #55  
So I guess your answer is Government Employees?
 
   / General Motors #56  
You see, Gatorboy, its rather simple...every line of work has lazy and hardworking folks. The hardworking folks usually end up taking the slack of the lazy folks. He sounds like a hard working fellow who works his tail off yet is frustrated b/c the guy next to him earns the same or more but puts forth far less effort. The problem w/ GM is exactly what you are doing...too much finger poiting and no one stepping up. Who cares if union workers or govt. workers are lazier? At this point, it does not really matter. People need to get off their duff, quit finger pointing, pick up a wrench and help their fellow man. If failure is the final outcome, no one can blame anyone because everyone tried to achieve a better out come. The sad thing is, this gentleman may end up losing his job, which can have further negative consequences on his life, while all the big wigs sit in their pretty mansions having no remorse that the folks who put them there are now jobless and possibly homeless. By the way, I'm neither union or government. Just a hard working fellow doing my part.
 
   / General Motors #57  
<font color="blue">( He sounds like a hard working fellow who works his tail off yet is frustrated b/c the guy next to him earns the same or more but puts forth far less effort. ) </font>

Now you are starting to see the problem with Unions.
 
   / General Motors #58  
<font color="blue">So I guess your answer is Government Employees? </font>


I have never been a government employee nor do I personally know anyone who is. Therefore, rather than make assumptions and fall prey to the stereotyping of government employees, I do not feel qualified to answer in respect to their situation.
 
   / General Motors #59  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue">( He sounds like a hard working fellow who works his tail off yet is frustrated b/c the guy next to him earns the same or more but puts forth far less effort. ) </font>

Now you are starting to see the problem with Unions. )</font>

Comon Dave,
Thats lame and you know it!!! I work directly with engineering , developing mailing office equipment. Are you telling me there are no slackers in the white collar community ??? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif Huhh, I must have been blind for the last 35 years !!!

scotty
 
   / General Motors #60  
<font color="blue"> ( Are you telling me there are no slackers in the white collar community ??? ) </font>

No.

I'm saying White-collar Slacker is not making the same amount of money as White-collar Hardworker for salary is based on performance. White-collar slacker may even get the boot and be replaced by a new-hire for a much lower starting salary -- not the same as Hardworker who has been with the company for years even though they may be doing the same job.

Private Industry is geared on rewarding the hard working and getting rid of the deadwood -- where Union and Government jobs are geared towards keeping employees around with no worry (or very little) of getting fired.

Just because you find a few exceptions to the rule doesn't make this theory invalid.
 
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