Generator feed back

[atgreene]

Just checked centralmainediesel.com (great site for generators btw).

8k auto propane is $2075

17K auto propane is $3695

Hook-up of a switch is the same. For my money, I'm going to buy the one that won't be working as hard to do the whole house with no question, but that's just me. When it's 20 below I don't want to find out that the genny is a little too small to do what I want, and besides, if you can sit in your hottub and look through the woods at your neighbors dark cold house, ain't it worth the extra.

 

[Doc_Bob]

8k auto propane is $2075

17K auto propane is $3695

Hook-up of a switch is the same. For my money, I'm going to buy the one that won't be working as hard to do the whole house with no question, but that's just me.

I wonder what the fuel use is when you compare the 8K vs the 17K?
Bob

 

[atgreene]

I'm willing to bet they're not far apart, a motor working at full load is going to burn a lot in comparison to one not working as hard. Obviously a larger one burns more, but all things being equal, you're working the snot out of the little one so it's governor is dumping the fuel to it.

 

[Doc_Bob]

Just checked centralmainediesel.com (great site for generators btw).

Some nice prices. Make me wonder if the gen set are a problem with such low prices?
Bob

 

[atgreene]

How do you mean?

I've bought a few genny's from them for the FD. Great running rigs, no issues.

 

[BubbaJr]

We currently have a 12KW Coleman whole house generator with a Honda 28 hp engine running on propane. We had an 11KW Tradewinds unit with a B&S 26 hp engine. We had nothing but trouble from day one with that unit. 95% of the problems were related to the engine, the other 5% to the auto transfer switch. Tradewinds was just a few miles from us at that point and they did all the service under warranty, but they were here on average twice a month for a over a year. I finally got fed up with the B&S engine and they upgraded me with the new unit and a new auto transfer switch for under a $1000.

The B&S engine would fail to start, run erratic when it would run, and at the end it was making funny noises internally. The Honda engine has not given us one moments worth of trouble.

We were without power for a week after an ice storm in 05. One thing I did to conserve fuel, was to get up at 6:00 and start the engine, run it until noon, and stop it. Then repeat the cycle at 6:00 in the evening. We have a geothermal unit that takes a lot of juice, so it wasn't put in the panel with the other necessities. But we did have the well pump, water heater, water softener, refrigerator, freezer, microwave, garage door openers, plenty of lights, and various other things I can't think of at the moment. For backup heat we have a wood burning fireplace and 18ac. of woods, so that was a no-brainer.

As far as the auto transfer switch, make sure it is professionally installed by a qualified electrician unless you are self insured. You have to remember if you back feed the power line outside you aren't charging the line with 120 or 240, once it get's past the transformer it will step up the voltage to whatever was coming into the transformer before the outage. You won't have as much amperage there, but it's enough to fry a lineman, and your insurance company will hang you out to dry if you installed it yourself.

Good Luck,
Joe

 

[Doc_Bob]

How do you mean?

I've bought a few genny's from them for the FD. Great running rigs, no issues.

Parts and service on the gen set is what I mean.
Bob

 

[atgreene]

Never needed service, so I can't answer direct. I'm sure the commercial stuff (Honda, B&S etc...) they're going to say to see your local dealer. Not sure on the rest.

 

[ragkar]

I have to agree with the guys that suggest that 15KW may be too big. But do you need an all-house auto switch system? The fuel problem is a serious one.
Why don't you go here
How to Pick the Perfect Standby Generator - Standby Generator Advice from ElectricGeneratorsDirect.com
and figure out what you need.
I bought a 6200W B&S from them and I use it, through a manual switch that was wired by an electrician, to power water pump, sump pump, septic tank pump, furnace, most of the kitchen except the range and oven, entertainment center, one bedroom and of course the computer center.
My generator runs 17.5hrs on seven gallons and I have a 22 gallon reserve.

 

[Tdog]

Well, I have a 15kw Generac with a 200 amp transfer switch. I had it installed in February 2006 - - It took a month without power in 100 degree heat after Katrina to convince me to spring for a whole house generator. It is propane powered - - I had to have a tank installed as well. I ran a 5500w portable almost around the clock during the Katrina power outage. I was glad to have the power it provided - - but, I had to juggle circuits to run the water heater & well pump separately. No central AC. I swore, never again. That month was a bitter lesson.

I've been mostly pleased with the generac. It served me best last week when we lost power with that 7-8" dusting of snow that took out our power for 36 hours. During that time, the temps were mostly in the 30's. I was able to run one of my heat pumps & had hot water at will. I was in much better shape than my neighbors who were running portables. [I had invited them all over, but they refused - - two told me later that was a mistake, that they spent miserable nights].

My 15kw generator is definitely NOT overkill. I figure you don't need it that often, but when you do, it's either freezing or hotter than hades & you need power to run heat/AC units. I'm not sure yet what it costs me to run it. Whatever, running a 10hp portable round the clock is NOT inexpensive. Just keeping enough gasoline on hand was a major hassle.

I understand that Generac now makes a 20kw air cooled unit - - I have no idea of the cost.

Jack

 

[LBrown59]

My generator runs 17.5hrs on seven gallons .

At that rate This would keep your Gen. going for 350 hours.

 

[LBrown59]

I have to agree with the guys that suggest that 15KW may be too big. But do you need an all-house auto switch system? The fuel problem is a serious one.
Why don't you go here
How to Pick the Perfect Standby Generator - Standby Generator Advice from ElectricGeneratorsDirect.com
and figure out what you need.
I bought a 6200W B&S from them and I use it, through a manual switch that was wired by an electrician, to power water pump, sump pump, septic tank pump, furnace, most of the kitchen except the range and oven, entertainment center, one bedroom and of course the computer center.
My generator runs 17.5hrs on seven gallons and I have a 22 gallon reserve.

What fuel problem ; what do you mean?

 

[DelSc]

We have a 16KW Generac with 100 gal propane tank and a "whole house" transfer box. We lost power last week for 3 days, and I was really happy to have it.

During the outage, we basically ran our well, oil furnace, lights and appliances without consideration to being on a generator.

I re-filled the tank once the power came back on, and was able to compute that we used one gallon of propane per hour during the blackout. This fuel consumption rate (according to Generac) equates to the fuel consumption for this size generator running at about 1/4 power.

This was the average rate over a 3 days of pretty much constant use. I only stopped it a couple times to check the engine oil level. Since we left it running through the night with the furnace and fridge as the only load (temps dropped into single digits), the load with lights and appliances would have been noticeabley higher, however I dont know exactly how much higher.

If I remember, we sized the unit based on motor starting capacity as well as steady state power usage. In other words, we wanted to be able to leave all systems plugged in, and have the capacity to be able to handle having a couple systems with motors starting simultaneously.

 

[ragkar]

As a residence, I don't need all that much fuel on hand. I only have to run a lawnmower, weed whacker and a few others. so If I had a lot, it would go stale before being used. The other posters have mentioned how difficult it was to get gas during a prolonged outage. I think one said that he had a sixty mile round trip.

 

[LBrown59]

As a residence, I don't need all that much fuel on hand. I only have to run a lawnmower, weed whacker and a few others. so If I had a lot,
*it would go stale before being used. The other posters have mentioned how difficult it was to get gas during a prolonged outage. I think one said that he had a sixty mile round trip.

The only thing i use gas for is the chain saw and the string trimmer.
I only keep a couple or 3 gallon around.
I have a diesel pump and storage set up with 2 drums and extra drums for it so in my case I'd go with a diesel Gen..
*I can store all the fuel I'd ever need during a prolonged power outage, but haven't worked out the going stale issue either.

 

[Doc_Bob]

*I can store all the fuel I'd ever need during a prolonged power outage, but haven't worked out the going stale issue either.

Stabil.
Bob

 

[capi75rs]

It does not necessarily have to be real big, to run everything. A good 5500 watt unit, with a good surge capacity, will run a lot of stuff.

like I said, you would not believe me if I listed it all, I run the everything, except the central air. However; I do run a window a/c in my den.

I couldn't agree with you more, I have a 5500 watt and run my house. Fridge, deep freezer, furnace, window AC, lights, computer (on surge suppressor) 220v pump for my well, and the list goes on and on and on. I will admit I limit what I turn on and when but over the last 3 years have never had an issue.

 

[Pilot]

Think ETHANOL: If you store gas with 10% ethanol very long, it absorbs water from the air and when the temp gets low the ethanol & water separate out. Ethanol is an octane booster, so one effect is that the octane in the remaining gas drops. If your compression ratio is high enough to need the octane specified on the pump, you won't have it. I don't remember the details, but it can cause other big problems with small engines.

I have had my gas powered generator for 10-15 years now, but Oregon has only required ethanol for a year and has exempted off road uses. The problem is that there are only about 20 places in the state where you can get ethanol free gas and the nearest one to me is about 35 miles away & they still want about $4 a gallon. I go 50 miles & stock up on $2 ethanol free gas just for my small engines.

You may not have ethanol in your gas in your area, but it is coming because of federal mandates.

I don't intend to start an ethanol war, and I know there are probably some folks here that think it's great, but I just want folks to be aware of what you need to know if you have it in your area.

Diesel and propane seem like good solutions to me.

 

[Highbeam]

Well of course the folks with a 15KW-20kw gensets and sufficient fuel on hand are perfectly happy. They always have plenty of power. It is not optimal but I would have to agree that the oversized genset will get the job done while the properly sized genset will require some skill and power management.

Ideally, we would all have 200 amp (whatever your service is) gensets on hand and enough fuel stockpiled to make it through the worst case outage. This scenario cost more money than a properly sized genset but it is superior in every way.

My 3000 watt genset cost under 300$ and the fuel stockpile for the longest historic outage is contained in a few 5 gallon gas cans. So I made a decision to save my money and optimize the genset purchase.

 

[ragkar]

I bought my generator before I got my tractor (currently my only diesel application). So a gas generator made sense. If I were buying now I'd seriously consider a diesel generator since diesel is easier to store (i.e. less volatile and fumes explosive).
Since I have fireplace gas logs with a 100 gallon (or is it 100 pound?) tank, I really should have opted for a propane generator. That would have solved the storage and supply problems for fuel.