get ready for very expensive diesel

[idaho04]

It's time to start using the horses we have in our backyards as pets. Get some use out of them.

 

[MikePA]

What would happen if the govt controlled gas prices? (Other than less profit for Chevron, Exxon).

We'd have less of it. Anyone who lived through Richard Nixon's price controls knows this.

Supply, demand and price.

If you fix price and demand goes up then supply goes down.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Energy and it's costs are certainly commodities which affect the welfare and security of our nation. Propane, natural gas, and electricity prices are governed by a group...the public service commission. But, there are no restrictions on gas/diesel. Seems there would be since the nation also relies on fuel. What would happen if the govt controlled gas prices? (Other than less profit for Chevron, Exxon).

Like MikePA said, price controls create supply shortages. They also encourage overuse of commodities which are limited in availability. Think, if gas prices were fixed at $1.00/gal, would there be any reason to buy an efficient vehicle?

BTW, public service commission is a state entity and they vary a LOT by state. In my state propane prices are unregulated (AFAIK) and our electricity prices, while regulated, are notoriously high, despite most electricity coming from coal which isn't hard to get here.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Here today in Northern Indiana Gas was 3.07 and diesel was 3.79.

Chris

 

[Redbug]

Just thinking about what MikePA and ZMich said...

We'd have less of it. Anyone who lived through Richard Nixon's price controls knows this.

Supply, demand and price.

If you fix price and demand goes up then supply goes down.

I do not remember much about the gas shortages back in the 70's. So, I do not know about Nixon's price controls. I will read up about it on the net when I have some time. It intrigues me. In our economy, Price = Demand + Supply. But you are saying that if the price is controlled, supply will go down...because of demand. I don't know about that. I think there is plenty of oil, and the companies/OPEC are holding it back to increase demand, (which also raises price/profit). It seems to me if profit (price) is controlled...the demand would remain about the same. Supplies would be loosened up since there is less profit. Does that make sense or is it flawed? How did Nixon's controls fail? Why didn't it work?

 

[Roto]

Here in Mid-Maine its $3.25 for gas and $3.87 for diesal. can someone tell me why diesal is $.62 more then gas? Isnt it cheaper to make? Why is it 62 cents a gallon more then gas. Thats insane.

mike

 

[Iowachild]

Seems to me as though some people could stand to learn a little about economics. Here is a good place to get started.
Economics for the Citizen
Be sure to check out "Who is Gouging Whom"!

 

[MikePA]

I don't have the figure handy, but the demand for fuel rises about 3 - 5% a year. It's driven by how much people drive, it's driven by a growing economy and not just ours.

Think about it...

You own a business that makes widgets and watches. The government tells you how much you can charge for a widget (think Communism), but the free market sets the price for watches. What are you going to make more of? The US government sets the price for widgets in the US. No problem, sell more overseas. Why would you want to sell more of a product you make less money on?

Prices rise when demand increases as well as when supply drops. We do not have a supply problem and no one is holding back supply to drive up prices.

Our problem is no one learns from history, they don't teach economics in school so far too many people fall prey to panderers looking to exploit people's emotions.

Look at any Communist or socialist country where the government tries to control the economy. By and large the countries are dumps.

Much of economics deals with facts, not emotions.

• Cut tax rates, revenue to the treasury increases.
• Fix prices, shortages happen.

National health care. Another attempt to fix prices. What happens? Long waits for services. In other words, a shortage of health care services.

 

[RalphVa]

That was the other thing that I was gonna suggest: get smaller tractors. Unless you're doing a whole lot of Ag work requiring 30+ hp, you can likely do about 90% of what you want to do with a 16-20 hp tractor instead of a 30-40 hp one. An 18 hp tractor will use just short of 0.5 gallon/hr. A 60-80 hp ag tractor would probably use about 2 gallons/hr. BIG difference. Just use a little tractor. Rent a big one occasionally when you need the heft.

Same thing for pickups. Best most of you could do what needs to be done 90% of the time with a small pickup (Tacoma 2wd ones with 4 cylinder get 28 mpg average, 30 mpg at 85 mph on the road with their "hemi" head engines; future hybrid ones will get 40-50). Then just rent a U-haul truck or big pickup when you need the heft.

Manufacturers could make the little trucks ride as well as the big ones, too. Just bolt the differential to the frame and put in swing axles will go a long ways to improving both ride and handling. The Tacoma 2wd is not bad even with the bouncing differential. Ford Rangers, by comparison, don't have a suspension. They ride like go karts.

Ralph

 

[Z-Michigan]

That was the other thing that I was gonna suggest: get smaller tractors. Unless you're doing a whole lot of Ag work requiring 30+ hp, you can likely do about 90% of what you want to do with a 16-20 hp tractor instead of a 30-40 hp one. An 18 hp tractor will use just short of 0.5 gallon/hr. A 60-80 hp ag tractor would probably use about 2 gallons/hr. BIG difference. Just use a little tractor. Rent a big one occasionally when you need the heft.

Same thing for pickups. Best most of you could do what needs to be done 90% of the time with a small pickup (Tacoma 2wd ones with 4 cylinder get 28 mpg average, 30 mpg at 85 mph on the road with their "hemi" head engines; future hybrid ones will get 40-50). Then just rent a U-haul truck or big pickup when you need the heft.

Manufacturers could make the little trucks ride as well as the big ones, too. Just bolt the differential to the frame and put in swing axles will go a long ways to improving both ride and handling. The Tacoma 2wd is not bad even with the bouncing differential. Ford Rangers, by comparison, don't have a suspension. They ride like go karts.

Ralph

Good points, but you don't always have to downsize. I have a 50hp tractor and use only 1.0 gal/hr. I did a lot of comparison before buying, and the NE tractor tests indicated very low fuel consumption for the model I bought. My experience has been even better than expected.

Similarly, I recently decided to get a large SUV. Believe it or not, there are big differences in their mpg. I got a 2007 Chevy Suburban, rated 15/20 under the old system or 14/19 under the 2008+ EPA system. I get 15-17mpg in winter commuting, and have seen almost 20 on the highway. Not Prius mileage, but I'm happy. Most other SUVs in that class do much worse. As a bonus I get flex-fuel capability, in case E85 ever becomes viable (cost-wise or environmentally). I haven't even driven it in summer yet, and am betting on 16-18 commuting and >20 in some highway use. Again, not amazing #s, except that many midsize SUVs don't do as well. Comparison shopping pays.

Of course, for sane driving I could actually be OK with a smaller engine provided it had 6 or more gear ratios. I do hope to see better use of engine hp by more efficient transmission and vehicle design.