GM Truck Warranty

[Dargo]

To bump this thread back up, I'm not so sure now about buying GM products. Several investing firms moved their long term stock estimate for GM to $0.00! It seems that more than not the 'experts' in the financial area are betting GM goes away. I see that Moody's agreed with Joseph C. Amaturo of Buckingham Research Group and also dropped their target price of GM stock to $0.00.

I'm afraid that if GM folds that Chrysler will be right behind them. Saab is filing now and I've read several inside trade magazines that all agree that Saturn is dead. I don't think we have enough printing presses to print enough money to keep all the domestic automakers afloat along with their suppliers. Being that GM stock is at a 74 year low now and is expected to go to zero, what is a guy to do?

 

[Diamondpilot]

I agree. Just don't see how they can make it. Even though I don't usually buy GM products but still own a Saturn, I really want them to stay in business and make it. I really think Chrysler will go first. I still can not see why Ford did not buy Chrysler when they had the chance? I guess someone higher up figured they would get the market share one way or a another.

I did not realize that they were bankrupting Saab, and dropping the Pontiac and Saturn lines.

On a side not watch some of the major airlines like United and Delta. I can not see United making it another year with out some cash inflow either from the government or to merge with another carrier.

Unemployment in my county just hit 9%. We were a major builder of components for all auto manufactures under 100's of small shops which many have closed. Up north of me just a hour or so the rate is 15%+ and going up. This area of the country is the RV capital of the world and also a major player in the boat market.


Chris

 

[Builder]

Hummer is gone, too.

My prediction is that GM will not "go away". They will file for bankruptcy protection and hopefully that will save about 1 million jobs from being lost directly and indirectly.

Ford doesn't have the cash to buy Chrysler, although the pom poms have been high in the air about Ford not needing gov't bailout money, they are by no means "healthy", their stock is trading at a whopping $1.58 and they lost a record 6 billion last quarter, their biggest loss in Ford history.. http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2009/01/29/2009-01-29_ford_posts_its_worst_loss_in_history_but.html

http://www.marketwatch.com/quotes/f

Even Toyota is in bad shape and closing plants, but you'll never hear the anti-American liberal biased media say anything about that. They hate detroit, especially GM.

 

[Dargo]

Pontiac is not going away as long as GM is around per their plans right now. They say that they may only have one or two Pontiac vehicles (don't know which they'd be), but Pontiac is not slated for termination.

The "go away" I am talking about is GM as we know it. More and more people who know far, far more about GM's position than I ever will seem to think that GM will be forced to file and, by doing so, either destroy the UAW or force them to be reasonable and accountable. I would NOT want to have my future pension or healthcare in the hands of the UAW crooks.

 

[Scooby074]

Latest news on the Saturn front is that there only going to be supported by GM until 2011? After that they need to find their own supplier.Rumor is that PSA (Peugeot Citroen) or the Chinese are in the running, Those companies are looking for a way into the NA market.

I think there's some interesting times ahead in the auto industry.

 

[horse7]

The thing is that GM/Chrysler want the UAW VEBA funded at least 50% by stock that an increasing number of analysts ("short sellers") consider to have a future value of 0.00. Same for bondholders, taking stock instead of cash with at least a 60% haircut along the way at the current value of the stock. I don't see how that will work out-- and combined with the ballooning estimated cost of a rescue starts to make Chapter11 more likely. The circulating rumor is that Ch11 debtor financing would include financing warranties (at least new ones) so that sales are more likely to sag less.

Interestingly, at current production levels and with the current inventory of cars, it would take 27 years (Krugman/NYT) to replace all the cars. On average cars don't last anywhere near that long, so the sales market has to go up at some point simply due to wastage and wearout. However, most people can stand on the sidelines for several more months or even a few years before replacing their car or truck.

The real disaster is for the retirees (considered in a rather mercenary fashion as non-producing assets paid partly from current cash flow (i.e., medical) [note that salaried retirees have largely had their medical deleted at the stroke of a pen, we aren't hearing about that]). The airline retirees have already been imploded as have steelworkers and many others. Indeed, anyone whose retirement/medical is not funded by the Fed should be concerned, since even a few local governments have toppled into bankruptcy.... and supporting non-producing (former)assets isn't high on the list of things to finance by bankrupt entities.

 

[Dargo]

I have no evidence of this except from a current UAW worker, but he says that the UAW spent retirees money on current job pools keeping current, but not working, UAW workers paid. If this is true, and I was a retired UAW worker, I'd want the UAW's head on a stick. The terminology being batted around current UAW line workers is "gross mismanagement of UAW funds by the UAW".

My UAW source is only a line worker, but he has been with the Jeep plant in Jeep, MI for almost 30 years. I'm sure that stories told down the assembly line tend to get stretched a bit, but he says that overall there they seem to be mostly true. Ron Ghettelfinger, (Ron Gettelfinger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) known by the rank and file as 'Ghettofinger', seems to be the lightning rod of the UAW rank and file's anger. I have no idea if he's to blame or not, but from what I've heard he isn't doing the UAW workers any favors. As they are quick to point out, Ghettofinger is set for life whether the rank and file lose their jobs or not.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Kills me too because they made a big stink about the Big 3 having corporate jets but Ghettofinger flies around in a 25 million dollar Gulfstream owned by the UAW, the Cadillac of corporate jets.

Chris

 

[Builder]

Ford's in the best financial shape, but interestingly has the most corporate jets (6).

The corp jets thing was all political grandstanding by the committies to get the average American who's never even sat in a corp jet on their side.

 

[horse7]

If anyone has actually *gone* anywhere by corporate jet for business reasons, they would realize that the corporate jet is way more efficient than the clunky airliners. None of this security theater for hoi polloi, no wandering around wondering where the luggage is, no getting stranded in O'Hare or Hartsfield or where ever for 24hours because its raining somewhere, you can carry instrumentation that cause the TSA screeners to have brain infarctions... and you can discuss corporate confidential topics (i.e., actually get work done).

Many years ago they would stuff engineering staff on the corp jet, usually with very little notice, to go off and work on Important Customer problems. Be lucky to get 8 hours warning before being yanked away for up to 2 weeks. Now its cattle car both ways, but then almost everything can be done remotely. No, I won't go on these anymore, tired of losing money on the trips (really!).

I can't see why Ford needs 6 corp jets, unless some are kept for overseas locales (Europe/Asia).