Goodbye Kubota, hello EarthForce

[MChalkley]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

Whoodle - You'll have to forgive me if I say something that sounds stupid. (Well, everyone here is used to that, but I'm talking about something directed toward you personally.) You see, I'm carrying on 6 or 7 private e-mail conversations with various folks who are considering an EarthForce machine. A couple of them are out west, one in the NE, one in the SE (who actually visited the distribution center near Charleston), and several that I don't even know where they are. Two or three I've talked to by phone, too. And several people have called Jason because I posted his phone number and told him they heard about the EarthForce machines from me, and I don't have a clue who they are because their name doesn't connect in any way with their TBN user id. Anyway, I can't remember which one you are (and I'm not asking you to identify yourself here, just stating the fact), but I hope it works out for you, if you decide to get one. I think it's an incredible machine with tremendous versatility. And Jason at Folcomer Equipment has been a top-notch dealer (if he can keep me happy without needing prescription medication, you know he's pretty good /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif), despite the fact that this hasn't been your typical tractor deal (I'll bet he would say that has to be the understatement of the decade... /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif)

Oh yeah, you asked a question, didn't you? I think it was <font color=blue>Did the folks at EF Prague decide to use your switch design on future models?</font color=blue> - and the answer is "Yes!" Originally, it was designed to go in an empty spot on the right side of the dash panel (there's a picture of that in this thread somewhere...), but my comment to them was that the first time somebody fipped the rocker switch (it wasn't the momentary-contact variety) while they were using the backhoe and were reaching for the rear worklight switch just above it, the next time they hit the front auxiliary hydraulics lever, they'd run the risk of dropping the attachment on something or somebody and they agreed. (In fairness to the EarthForce folks in CZ, they were trying to make it as easy to install by me as possible.) On future versions, though, I think the lever will be hollow to allow the wire to run down the inside of it - us early adopters always have to pay a high price... /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[whoodle]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

Mark.

I'm the one in Northern Vt. You are right about Jason. I think he must be heading for EF dealer of the year. You'll probably get a free machine,(or just the parts so you can assemble as you see fit), and a plaque as EF innovator of the year!

 

[MChalkley]

Re: Hydraulic system lock-out

When I ordered my EF-5, one of the options was a "Hydraulic system lock-out". Since nobody seemed to know exactly what it was at the time I placed the order /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif, except that it had something to do with safety (which immediately got my attention in a big way) and it was about $150, I ordered it. When the machine arrived, "it", whatever "it" was, wasn't installed, and I was told I'd be getting "it" later, to be installed by yours truly. (Just for the record, I had a fairly flexible arrangement with the EarthForce folks from the beginning regarding do-it-yourself stuff, because my machine was to be the first with hydraulic front quick-attach, etc. Normally, none of the options would be handled on a do-it-yourself basis by EarthForce but, as I say, we have an "arrangement" - I'm also working on some other things with them - more on that when the time comes...)

Anyway, a few days ago, the "Hydraulic system lock-out" kit arrived. It turned out to be some interesting valves that go on the loader lift and dump cylinders, as well as the backhoe boom and dipper cylinders. They screw into the cylinder port that would discharge fluid when it's under compression from gravity, should a major hydraulic system failure occur. In other words, if the cylinder extends to lift, the valve goes on the "blind" end of the cylinder, the end opposite the rod, or, put yet another way, the port that gets pressure to lift the weight in the first place. Obviously, they also have to be installed in a specific direction, but since they'll only go in one way, that's pretty easy to insure. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

They're not simple check valves - a check valve wouldn't allow the loader to lower at all, for example. I'm not exactly sure yet how they work, or what they're called in standard hydraulic terms, but I'm going to find out. I assume they're flow-rate controlled - should a major failure occur, the pressure on the back side of the valve would drop to zero and a huge flow surge would occur, which would cause the valve to close until pressure were reestablished on the back side to unlock it again.

My main reason for bringing them to everyone's attention here is that I think they would be very useful additions to any machine. With one on both FEL lift cylinders, the front bucket/attachment can't fall on someone should a line blow. Likewise, one on a dump cylinder prevents the contents of the bucket (or the attachment itself) from dumping/falling on someone. On the backhoe, a hydraulic system failure would normally allow the boom and/or dipper to fall on anyone or anything below. (I know: There shouldn't ever be anyone below the backhoe boom/dipper, but there's an awful lot of things now history that would've been different if what should've been was.) But with the lock-out valves in place, this kind of accident would be prevented. A very good investment, in my book.

 

[MChalkley]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

I just got back into to town after being away for a few days on my first real project with the EF-5.

Chores on this project included building a couple landscape mounds out of 12 or so yards of soil, setting some landcape stones, digging a half dozen or so tree holes with the 30" auger, general grading, and moving a 3" willow oak and a 4" birch with the backhoe/FEL.

I was amazed by the ease of use, versatility and power of the machine. A site work contractor who was working on an adjacent lot came over and asked all kinds of questions about it - he said he was very impressed. He ended up asking for the name and phone number of the dealer I bought it from, so I gave him Jason's at Folcomer Equipment.

Using the hydraulic auger mounted on the backhoe, driven by the rockbreaker hydraulics, was great. It was so much better than the three-point-hitch mount that I'm sure I'll never miss the doing it the old way. My chiropractor will miss the money from the treatments to get my stiff neck straightened out, though. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif It's much faster, and it seems to have just as much power as the PTO model did. Plus, the ability to dig several holes without repositioning the machine was a real time saver. The only inconvenience I noticed anywhere was that it would've been nice to have a little more flow from the implement pump - it would slow down quite a bit when I was raising the auger. A fix for that is in the works.

When I was moving the larger of the two trees, one of the guys working on the site, who has quite a bit of experience with equipment, told a friend of mine "There's no way he's going to move that tree unless he knocks the root ball down some." The EF-5 didn't give any indication it even knew it was there.

The backhoe is much more powerful than the Bradco 609 I had on the Kubota. It was cutting out 24" buckets full of hard clay/sandstone easily. I was pleasantly surprised by how stable the machine felt with the vertical stablilzers. I noticed very little difference between them and the traditional horizontal type.

I also noticed a marked improvement in performance between the EF-5 and the L4310 when digging into stockpiled soil. Even with the smaller tires, there was no tendency to spin, even though it was pushing into the pile more easily than the L4310 would. I don't know if it's the weight difference, the limited-slip differentials front and rear, or what. There doesn't seem to be enough difference in weight between the EF-5 and the heavily ballasted L4310 with the Bradco 609 on it. Plus the rear tires are much smaller on the EF-5. Still, there's some reason - it's definitely there...

The biggest problem I had was operator error. When I was loading up at the end of the day, I unlatched the 4-in-1 and backed away from it without disconecting the hoses. So, I now need two more hose ends. Ouch! /w3tcompact/icons/sad.gif /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif

All in all, though, a very successful trial run for the EarthForce!

 

[MikePA]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

It's great when something exceeds your expectations and it sounds like the EF-5 has done that. Your hard work and the research has all paid off. Congratulations!

 

[MossRoad]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

Sounds like a fun time.

I also noticed the tendancy to want to back away without first disconnecting the hydraulics. Only my implements are so much lighter than yours, I'd probably just drag them along /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif. Several times this winter, due to the nice weather, I have decided to do some dirt work with the bucket. The unit is usually backed into the garage with the plow facing out. I would drive out of the garage, have to get off, disconnect the hoses, get back on and go get the bucket. Now I have trained myself to disconnect the hoses before I get on the first time. This saves me a shut down, get off and on and start up cycle. I just drive out of the garage, drop the plow in the driveway and go get the bucket. Very simple thing to train myself to do, but didn't even think of it first few times.

One other thing I noticed. I set the plow down in the sun on a warm day. When I came back, I mounted the plow and put it in the garage. I shut down and went to hook up the hoses, but couldn't get them to snap into the quick connect. Couldn't do it for the life of me. Took a wrench and cracked the threads on one of the fittings until a drop or two of hydraulic fluid came out. Then I could make the quick connect. Seems the sunlight heated up the hydraulic fliud enough to put some pressure on the fittings. Have you ever experienced something like this in your hydraulic past?

 

[Charlie_Iliff]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

MossRoad:
I have been able to put a bolt into the connector and tap it a few times, reducing pressure without unscrewing a fitting. There are threads here and there where others with hydraulic connectors have had the same problem with pressure behind quick disconnects.
So far, I haven't driven away with hoses attached, but my day will come, especially if I get a solenoid valve working the aux pto so the stock lines are hooked to the quick attach.

 

[Charlie_Iliff]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

Mark:
Sounds as if you're going to have to start hunting for tougher challenges. You always have to keep some experienced guys around, as well, to predict that you can't do them.

 

[MChalkley]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

MossRoad - That situation you've noticed with the quick-connects being impossible to get connected when the fluid is heated up by the sun is very common. The only solution I know of is to crack a fitting a bit, as you did. There are a couple of fitting designs that are supposed to be easier to connect and disconnect under pressure, but all of them have problems that make them worse than the regular ones, from what I've seen. Some won't handle high pressure, others are screw on types that have wide "wings" on them, and some won't handle high flows. Etc., etc., ad infinitum, ad nauseum...

Still a lot easier than PTO shafts, though. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[MChalkley]

Re: EarthForce EF-5 usage report

Thanks, Mike! My friend Jack and I were talking on the way home today, and he said several of the folks on the site commented that it was incredible how so much machine could be crammed into such a small package. Initially, I got a couple remarks that the EF-5 actually looked smaller than the L4310. (And even one "cute"... /w3tcompact/icons/tongue.gif) Didn't hear any more of that after she got going, though. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

After all the fretting, looking, shopping, tire kicking, and five-, eight-, and 12-hour drives to compare machines, I think it might have paid off in the form of a good decision.