Grading new land.

[paintman161]

So I am getting prices for grading a new driveway, pole barn pad and digging out a pond (fill dirt). So far I have gotten price of 15K and 16K. They are going to stripe the topsoil off of the driveway area and pole barn pad (save for leach field) and use the fill from the pond to build them back up. Both said they did not price in gravel for a base for the driveway and it should be fine for driving on. The driveway will only be used couple times a month, until the house is built in 2014, then i planned on having the driveway finished off.
My other option is getting the base gravel only and spreading it on the driveway myself then do the final layer after the house is done.
Would i be wasting my time and money putting any gravel on the driveway before the house is built? I am worried about the heavy trucks driving on it and and pushing the stone into the ground when we build the house (using Superior walls so they use a heavy crane too). The ground is mainly clay.

Suggestions?

 

[RedNeckRacin]

If your trying to save the stone, the only good way of doing it is with geo-textile that I am aware of. I'm sure someone will chime in here eventually but it can cut your stone costs down dramatically. Its not the cheapest thing going but its well worth the price when a load of stone is so expensive. We use it alot for our locations that handle 80k+ trucks regularly to cut down on the amount of stone needed. Your other option would be to use some bigger stone like 6" minus and build a base, then when the heavy truck traffic is done, spread some 2b on it to seal it up and compact it for a good strong road. What kind of sub-base are you working with?

 

[paintman161]

If your trying to save the stone, the only good way of doing it is with geo-textile that I am aware of. I'm sure someone will chime in here eventually but it can cut your stone costs down dramatically. Its not the cheapest thing going but its well worth the price when a load of stone is so expensive. We use it alot for our locations that handle 80k+ trucks regularly to cut down on the amount of stone needed. Your other option would be to use some bigger stone like 6" minus and build a base, then when the heavy truck traffic is done, spread some 2b on it to seal it up and compact it for a good strong road. What kind of sub-base are you working with?

I was worried about the geotextile getting ruined with the heavy trucks as well, we have about 14" of fine sandy loam and then 14-32" we have a silty clay loam and 32"-48" we have gravelly loam.

 

[kevin37b]

The first thing you need is that driveway . You need fabric and rock . Keep it above grade so it will drain . Without a driveway you will regret ever starting .

 

[dakotagun]

+1^
i'd recommend at least a partial driveway (nice and wide) for your/contractor's use. we opted to wait until the house was built to nail down the drive, had the approach built with culvert in ditch for easy access to the plot, but nothing else. since moving in a month ago, and for the prior three months getting to the structure during its build, I've been slipping/sliding and rutting out the clay "yard". we park 50 feet from the door due to the drainage/mud issues surrounding the clay/dirt (built on a slope, too).
when it dries, which looks like at least mid-June, i'll start the same process as you, and while it will be more exact due to the known footprint of the house and new appreciation for the drainage/flow of the slopes, I wish we would've done some of this work before to allow more convenient access.

 

[paintman161]

The first thing you need is that driveway . You need fabric and rock . Keep it above grade so it will drain . Without a driveway you will regret ever starting .

This is why i am getting price on the drive and pole barn pad at the same time. I am thinking of just doing may the larger stone, and skip the fabric, then later when we install the final driveway we will install the fabric and put the stone on top of that.

 

[ENG18LT]

Paintman,

I put in a gravel base last year south of you in Warsaw. This is what I did, dish out the topsoil, roll out fabric and dump gravel (bank run), spread to a depth of 14". The trucks were able to back in on top of what I had just spread out with no problems at all. Below the top soil was clay, with a high water table. The fabric will stabilize the driveway base for years to come. When I get done with the site work I plan on topping with crushed limestone to make it "nice". If you want more details check out the link in my signature below. As always you are welcome to Message me with any questions.

 

[paintman161]

Paintman,

I put in a gravel base last year south of you in Warsaw. This is what I did, dish out the topsoil, roll out fabric and dump gravel (bank run), spread to a depth of 14". The trucks were able to back in on top of what I had just spread out with no problems at all. Below the top soil was clay, with a high water table. The fabric will stabilize the driveway base for years to come. When I get done with the site work I plan on topping with crushed limestone to make it "nice". If you want more details check out the link in my signature below. As always you are welcome to Message me with any questions.

Yep i did read it fully, i grew upmjust south of warsaw, so i am familar with that area went to Letchworth schools. I was reading that younused bank run for a base how did that hold up? Thinking it will be cheaper to start with.

 

[ENG18LT]

Paint,

The bank run has done well, it did get a bit "muddy" on top when the snow was melting. I expected that though, that's why I am planning on topping with the crushed limestone down the road. I can drive my tractor on it and only leave minor impressions from the AG tires (tractor weighs 9200lbs.). I had a roll-off dumpster truck on it twice around Easter weekend and it only left a 1" impression in the driveway. Considering it is just a base and not the finished topcoat I am quite happy. The price was much better then using all limestone, about 60% less in material. Hope this helps.

 

[paintman161]

Paint,

The bank run has done well, it did get a bit "muddy" on top when the snow was melting. I expected that though, that's why I am planning on topping with the crushed limestone down the road. I can drive my tractor on it and only leave minor impressions from the AG tires (tractor weighs 9200lbs.). I had a roll-off dumpster truck on it twice around Easter weekend and it only left a 1" impression in the driveway. Considering it is just a base and not the finished topcoat I am quite happy. The price was much better then using all limestone, about 60% less in material. Hope this helps.

thanks i will look into bank run, driveway is 800' long so need to get it low as possible.

 

[dave1949]

I vote for getting the driveway sooner rather than later. The fabric is a one-time expense for a driveway you will use for years. The better retention of stone with fabric over time, will go towards offsetting the cost of fabric up front.

Nothing is more frustrating when trying to build and heavy trucks will not attempt your driveway for fear of getting stuck. The drivers aren't going to get yelled at on your account. :laughing: So, then you delay and hope for dry weather. That is not a plan.

 

[MacLawn]

Second to above. Do it right from the start - hmmm, wonder how I know that??:mur:

 

[paintman161]

Thanks for all the opinions, think i will invest in the fabric. What if i use asphalt millings? Seems like a much cheaper option and its pretty stable.

 

[Birdhunter1]

If you put down 2" size rock and have the trucks drive over it all summer while building your house then once the winter comes and it freezes and thaws go in next year and add 1" dirty rock you will have a super solid base and a nice smooth surface for years.

At $15-16K I don't know how long of a driveway you have to build but if I were looking at that cost I'd be shopping for a tracked bobcat and do it myself, I don't know what your equipment experience is like. I rented a Bobcat T 300 to do my driveway and had my dad on a tractor and we knocked out over a 1/4 mile driveway in 3 days, then leveled out a pad for the house and other stuff.

 

[paintman161]

If you put down 2" size rock and have the trucks drive over it all summer while building your house then once the winter comes and it freezes and thaws go in next year and add 1" dirty rock you will have a super solid base and a nice smooth surface for years.

At $15-16K I don't know how long of a driveway you have to build but if I were looking at that cost I'd be shopping for a tracked bobcat and do it myself, I don't know what your equipment experience is like. I rented a Bobcat T 300 to do my driveway and had my dad on a tractor and we knocked out over a 1/4 mile driveway in 3 days, then leveled out a pad for the house and other stuff.

The drive is about 750' and its not just for the driveway thats for the pole barn pad, which is being raised 4-6' from grade to match the house. i have not heavy equipment experience and dont trust myself to do it right.

 

[Birdhunter1]

4-6' is a big pad when you figure on sloping the perimeter. Does it have to match the grade of the house? My shop is 200' from the house and about 5-6' lower than the house yet still WELL above grade around it. Since everything is on top of the hill where I live I don't have water issues. A bobcat is pretty easy to learn with, rent one for a day and you will be amazed I am sure.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

You gotta put the fabric in first or the stone that is laid in before hand is almost lost. The fabric acts as a bridge bascially and spreads the load out much farther than the actaul stone does. This does two things, It supports your stone and it keep the stone from being "filled" with dirt. Over time the stone will keep getting pushed down into the dirt because the dirt cannot support the weight, and the dirt will come to the surface because its being displaced by the stone. this is made even worse by adding water to the mix, the driveway will soon not drain quickly and will become even softer resulting in faster degradation if driven on. We can cut our stone usage down by about 50% if we lay in geo-textile when laying out the areas. This is for supporting 80,000lb trucks and up. It may seem expensive, but its far cheaper than the stone will cost!

 

[paintman161]

You gotta put the fabric in first or the stone that is laid in before hand is almost lost. The fabric acts as a bridge bascially and spreads the load out much farther than the actaul stone does. This does two things, It supports your stone and it keep the stone from being "filled" with dirt. Over time the stone will keep getting pushed down into the dirt because the dirt cannot support the weight, and the dirt will come to the surface because its being displaced by the stone. this is made even worse by adding water to the mix, the driveway will soon not drain quickly and will become even softer resulting in faster degradation if driven on. We can cut our stone usage down by about 50% if we lay in geo-textile when laying out the areas. This is for supporting 80,000lb trucks and up. It may seem expensive, but its far cheaper than the stone will cost!

I agree, think i will put it down first then put milling on top of that.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

I agree, think i will put it down first then put milling on top of that.

your talking about road millings? Be careful, my dad works for a contractor that does a large amount of paving and milling in pa, and its not allowed to be placed as the top layer in a road. It has to be recycled or used as fill and have a cap placed over it. Probably someone is afraid of the DEP finding a leachate that leaked off into a stream. I have heard that it makes an excellent base due to it compacting very well and having some tackiness from the asphalt left in it.

 

[paintman161]

your talking about road millings? Be careful, my dad works for a contractor that does a large amount of paving and milling in pa, and its not allowed to be placed as the top layer in a road. It has to be recycled or used as fill and have a cap placed over it. Probably someone is afraid of the DEP finding a leachate that leaked off into a stream. I have heard that it makes an excellent base due to it compacting very well and having some tackiness from the asphalt left in it.

It was suggested to me by a local builder which uses it a bunch and never had an issue with it being a problem. Actually a lot of gravel yards now sell old millings here in ny