Grapple grapple types

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Northland thanks for the tip about the teeth. You may be on to something there.
The guy I used to work for had an 8' bed 2500 Dodge Ram with what they call around here an EZ-Dumper body in it. He built up the sides another 3 ' , added additional leaf springs and went around a cord at a time. Back then we got $75 for cut, split and dried oak. (mid to high 1970's) delivered. It is back breaking work and labor intensive. People on Cape Cod are paying anywhere near $350 per cord now. Thats where everyone is going around here and with fuel costs, insurance and maintenance, one now has to charge that kind of money to make meager gains. After your expenses and only if you already have a truck, $70 is chicken feed for the amount of work you'll do. You'd almost have to have a processor to increase your cord per hour duration to make money @70 bucks. In other words, you'd have to have quite the operation going. No, I don't think its worth it not unless you were already equiped with a truck, splitter, conveyor and a skidder that will get you 3-5 cords per hour. If you are having stems delivered as opposed to skidding that may be more cost efficient but I still wouldn't involve myself for that kind of return. Besides, you seem to be having fun in the snow and woods. A business started with an entity that you think is fun now, has the inordinate knack of turning what was fun into work.

Lou

 

[Eagleview]

You need a rock bucket such as the one that www.onlineattachments.com sell . It is a skeleton bucket made of solid round bar . It would be ideal for what you want , if you do get some dirt or sawdust in it with the splits a quick jiggle of the hydraulics and it will simply fall out the bottom .

 

[Northland]

A business started with an entity that you think is fun now, has the inordinate knack of turning what was fun into work.

Lou

amen to that Lou-ain't it the truth thanks for the clear voice of reason

see attachment for my set-up

 

[arrow]

Great set-up Northland. If I get a tooth bar, it looks like you have a little play as to how deep in the bucket it goes. May be all I need.

Ironhorse, Thanks for the tip. Those buckets are more than I can spend and they are quite heavy. My loader only does 800#. They tell me I can increase it with a screw turn but I do not know where this screw is. I did a search on rock buckets after your post and Virnig makes a light one at under 300#. Don't know what the cost is. If I had a pipe bender, I'd make the darn thing

 

[Luke_theDrifter]

Hi Arrow....I wasn't kidding or trying to be sarcastic in my previous post, sorry if it came accross that way. Sometimes a guy can mess-up typed words versus just standing a talking with someone. I don't have a real skidder and I'm trying very hard to NOT become a "logger".
I have my hands full trying to care of all of the logistical planning, processing and marketing of just the firewood end. For example I'm buying semi log truck of tree-lenght logs and then we process them into cut & split firewood, store that material to let it dry, and then either load bulk stove wood into a dump truck for delivery and more recently we're getting into the bundle-wood mfg process. Another major cmmitment I'm facing right now is building a large drying kiln. These are the little .75 cf (3/4 of cubic ft) shrink wrapped bundles you see at the local quick stop gas station. However our target market is camp grounds and RV parks for our bundle wood.

Anyway, back to the log skidding part. Currently we have some challenges with a supply & demand issue. We need a certain amount of firewood grade logs delivered to us, however most of the loggers in this region sell lumber grade logs for a certain price, house logs for a higher price, and the firewood grade logs fetch the lowest price. Of course its common sence that no one would go out of thier way to work the same for less money, therefore I'm always on the lowest pecking order, so to speak, when it comes to buying logs. I'm having a hard time buying enough raw material, tree lenghts firewood grade logs. By the way, I have an "open door policy" w/ all of the logging outfits in my region, and always pay cash on the spot for my product, plus do my best to use good people skills when dealing w/ different personalities....in other words I'm not trying to low ball them on price, or act like a jerk so they won't sell to me, the problem is simply supply and demand; frankly I'm buying just as much or more logs than anyone else.
Soooo, to bring this full circle I'm exploring other options to increase my supply. My main option is to get the logs myself, which reguires another major investment in a logging truck, maybe a feller-buncher, skidder, more insurance, large $ bond for bidding on state or federal timber sales, and on and on....the logging business is a business in itself. I've got my hands full doing firewood.

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As to whether or not a guy can make money in the firewood business is hard to say. I suspect a lot depends on how serious you want to make it, if its your only source of income-or you have another job and do it part time, plus other factors like demand for firewood in your area, and as I mentioned above do you have access to plently of raw material to process into firewood.
In my region the wholesale price for a logging truck, about 9 cords, of tree lenghts Birch with maybe a few Spruce mixed in is about $1,000-$1,200 depending on how far they truck it. Retail price for dry and processed stove wood is about $200 per Cord delivered. As you can see there isn't much margin by the time you buy it, process it, hold it for a year (tie up your $ for a year), and then load it into a delivery truck and go dump it at the customers location.
On the other hand, there is more margin in the bundle wood, however it takes a lot more labor. That said you're getting paid for your labor, or a lot of times you can provide a service to the local community and put some high school kids to work for the summer making bundles, and then you go deliver them to the RV parks and camp grounds during the summer. There are many small buiness' scatered around that are operated by one man who wants something to do in his spare time and makes a little extra money. Plus if you have your own teenage kids putting them to work processing firewood instills good work ethic and its just old fashion hard work...they make some extra money.

 

[Luke_theDrifter]

Gee whiz guys I got awful long winded and forgot where I started, which was coming to this site looking for info about how to use a small tractor to help me fetch logs. By the way....sure is nice to get different opinions and view point and to see what other guys are doing, thanks!
I'm acting like a spunge and trying to gather up all of the info your guys provide. Which got me to thinking maybe I can use my little Kubota to skid logs, on a limited basis, maybe from some smaller tracts of private land. The attachments for these little tractors are WAY more than they were a few years ago...unlimted options. And one more time I must say this site is an extremly valuable learning tool!

 

[arrow]

Luke, I never took offense with anything you said nor would I have been bothered with any sarcasm or not. I just thought with a firewood business, the rest would follow in terms of equipment but that's what was in my background. Everyone had quite the operation except for the last guy I worked for.I used to hate delivering with the guy . He was so ornery, he'd turn peole off in a second. Whenever someone said, "a cord huh, doesn't look like a cord" I'd hold my breath because I knew what was coming. He'd pitch on guys 80 pounds heavier than him. He was a little guy but would wreak havoc with much bigger guys and I'd be in the middle of it trying to break it apart. He did wood all his life and was as strong as an ox but his people skills were zero. He worked for people most of his life and thought he could make money on his own. The key to a wood business along with people skills is pre selling. If you can produce and sell 10 cords a week, thats at least $2000. Multiply that by 36 weeks and you have yourself $72000. Subtract your costs , and that's how much you made but your operation has to be contained. Have logs delivered. The last thing you want to do is get into skidding. Get a good splitter, your tractor, a fast saw and your dump and a customer base and you can make a living. By the way, the guy I worked for died at 54 years of age of a coronary. He was lean as could be but one big ball of stress.

Me, I still can't get splits into my bucket without dirt. I'm having a hard time convincing my wife I need a $1000 rock bucket. I'm amazed yours operates so well. Are you on cement or asphalt by any chance? I have hardly any rollback angle on my fel. I get no bite into the wood at all. I was out there today thinking of you and feeling sorry for myself for having to load up the bucket by hand and also swearing alot.

Lou

 

[bjcsc]

Arrow: While I understand what you're after, you need to take a hard look at your numbers. While the gross looks attractive, it is irrelevant. Take a hard look at all of the numbers, err against yourself, and see what you think you can net. Most businesses do well to preserve a 15% margin, what do you expect to do? If you end up with the average margin you'll make $300 a week, less the self-employment taxes, or roughly $200 per week which is $20 for every cord of wood you supply. Maybe you have already worked up and through your model, but plan plan plan. Better to see it now than later! Good luck!

 

[arrow]

Bj you might be a little confused here. The numbers I provided were for Luke the Drifter. He is the one in the wood business. He told us he pays a little over $1000 for 9 cords of stems. He'll be lucky to get about 8 cords of saleable wood from that and if he gets $200 per cord, he has netted $600 on that load. Now he has to figure his insurance cost, his fuel and miscellaneous costs, taxes and he comes close to $200 net per 8 cords. For every $72000 he grosses, he has much to subtract. Thats with selling 10 cords per week. He is the one who has to figure out how many 10 corders he has to sell to make a living. In my mind he has to either up his cord price or sell 25-30 cords per week to survive. As I said, firewood is a tough business and if he can make $450-500 per cord of firewoood bundling it as he does, he can make a go of it. It is crucial to have a steady customer base in the wood game. As for myself, the professional woodchuck days are long gone. Right now I'm content to just figure out a better way to load the wood cart with my fel. Your input is appreciated I'm sure

 

[Luke_theDrifter]

Hey Lou I was surfing around on the world wide web last night-this morning, while my lovely bride was in bed sleeping-where I should have been, and came across a site that had the dangest attachment you've ever seen for hauling material and then dumping. I'm talented at many thing in this world, however I'm not really good w/ computer stuff...which means two things; 1) I can't remeber the site name 2) or provide you w/ a link to click.
However I'll briefly describe it and you'll get the idea, make you can make something up at your own place that'll work for your applaication. They were using some fixed forks and had a container that looked about like a small commercial trash dumpters; the special parts included a niffty latch system on the top door that opened for dumping when it reached a certain angle-that you set, and the fork pockets had some type of clamp system where you wouldn't dump-off the container when dumping the load.
I realize this doesn't help you pickup stove wood w/o getting gravel/dirt/debris mixed in. I prepped my storage area by starting with pit run gravel, compacted, and then finer 3/4" minus w/ plently of binder (dirt) on top -well compacted; plus most of my loading is in the winter so I have a nice layer of ice to pickup from. I would have the same problem you have if I were loading from a non-compacted area that wasn't set-up ahead of time for a certain job. This summer you can rent a plate compactor, have some nice 3/4 minus crushed rock w/ binder delivered, build your load area, and then from now on use this area for storage....skid and process your logs in this area. I have also considered cement, but too costly, other options is pavement...which I have also considered and think would work very well, of you already know its easiect to load the last few scoops from a buck board..so you'll need to make a backstop (buck board) somewhere at the back of your loading area.
Other than that the only thing I can think of is to use a conveyor.
By the way...you're pretty close, just a little low, on our volume of wood sales. I have to mechinize ever step I can to effeciently put out the volume were doing. The value added buddles sound better ever time I think about it....less materail to deal with, which means one less logisitical challenge to face.....which means I have more time to spend w/ my 11 year old boy doing soemthing fun!