Gross profit/acre hay

[IndyIan]

Will you have enough time to do it all, or are you planning on hiring help to be able to get it all done? Sometimes a job takes enough time that you need to weigh if it is worth loosing other jobs because the larger job takes up so much time. If you are willing to hire people to do the work, then the time deal doe not come into play so much, but if YOU are doing ALL the work, well there are only so many hours in a day.

Good luck

I think that's the key, is your time availability, and with no regular help probably round bales are your best bet.
Also you are taking on some considerable risk in losing customers as well if you mess up their precious horse hay. I buy hay from full time farmers with all the tools and experience and some years the weather just won't work for them... And my current hay guy has all sorts of stories of horse people and their "preferences".
Maybe if you want to be involved with it, find an experienced guy with all the fancy hay specific equipment, and offer to do the grunt work while he does the tricky stuff?

 

[dwhite]

My neighbor makes hay on about 300 acres and I asked him what it costs him to do it. He had no idea. He has barns to store it and sells it all so he is very affected by the demand. Remember, making hay requires going over the field about 5 times. That's a lot of diesel and time. You will also need to transport it to barns and buyers. I would not want to get into that business. I have him cut mine for 1/3 of the bales which I just buy from him at the going rate.

 

[Builder]

I have time to do it.
I have set my life up so I can pick/chose what I want to do most of the time. :laughing:
I have a couple mushroom farmers near me who would buy the hay, but they pay the lowest price since they dont care much about quality.
What I thought I could do is at worst case scenario, sell it to them.
If it's nice stuff, I can sell it for cows, cattle in the future.

I don't think anyone goes into a business expecting to be an overnight success, or even make money and I don't say that defensively or like my feelings are hurt to some of you who discourage my venture. I really appreciate getting the good, the bad and the ugly.

I think the hardest thing to convey is that if I don't take the hay, some enterprising person who will take it on just might do so and take all the other work I do for these customers, too.

 

[flusher]

This oughta be fun.....
Was wondering if any of you ever crunched your numbers on hay gross profit/acre.
IOW, in a average year, how much do you make in gross sales for cattle/horse hay. This would be before expenses (equipment loans, fuel, insurance, etc.)
I know yields & growing seasons vary. I'm in the mid-atlantic area. Just thought it would be fun to see what y'all are bringing in before expenses/acre.

My neighbor grows very good alfalfa on 30 irrigated acres--3-twine bales (110-120 lb). He's getting $15 or so per bale these days from his customers (horse owners).

I was at the barber shop getting my Christmas haircut last week. One of the guys there mentioned that folks around here are complaining about high hay prices. Apparently some CA hay is being shipped to drought-stricken Texas these days and selling for big bucks.

 

[Illinoisdmax]

Not to hijack this thread but I too am in a similar situation. I'm workin with 10 acres right now and another available 20 that I lease to a grain farmer. I could do that in hay also once I get some good experience on the 10 acres. What's a ballpark average number in bales I could expect per cutting on 10 acres?

 

[QRTRHRS]

A couple of things I have not seen mentioned; weather aside, quality and quantity is relative to a couple of things. Soil quality, fertilizer, overseeding or a total rebuild. These additional costs must be factored into what you currently have. What kind of grass is there? Typically, timouthy or orchard perhaps alfafa (a legume) or a mix. Some customers will prefer or demand one over the other, some not so much.

Then there is the weather. I moved out of PA in Feb 08'. Up until then, the last say six years had been seen wet conditiions going into dry making the first crop difficult if not impossible to get even close to right time wise then zip after that. This past year had to be horrible?

Hay comes in with a narrow window of a week or so and maybe three dry days to cut, dry, bale up and remove. Any rain at all usually means "horse quality" is out.

You can make the first cut and windrow and a follow up tedder yourself. Baleing is going to require more people and/or more equipment. You can do it with one person on the wagon stacking hay but two is better. Or, you can invest in all kinds of equipment to automate the process and lessen your need for help. Even rounds go better with at least two operators and two tractors.

Some of the larger (for my area) hay suppliers literally bust their backside during the hay seasons. They need to have extra help on hand (often not so dependable in spite of a bad job market) and it is a race to get the crop up and in the barn.

After shoulder surgery, I paid an extra buck a bale to have it delivered and stacked in my loft. I also negotiated filling my barn and paying as I could. In that manner, my supplier did not have to stack it in his barn and then move it again. You may negotiate going directly to a customers barn. On credit like I do, you could get taken over.

In my area, the average deal is a 50/50 split. Say I have the hay, you have the manpower and equipment. You come in and bale it all, take your share and go. I then either deal with my cut myself or further negotiate for some help putting my share up. Field maintenance or improvements are negotiated.

IMHO, a field free for the taking is no bargain for someone not already in the agricultural business unless disposable income is not an issue. My supplier also has a number of horses and owns plenty of land. He also has adjoining acreage he cuts for others. He has a full time more or less unrelated business to attend to. I never asked him directly but I suspect he does not sit down and look at his overall bottom line.

Lastly, one influence that applies in many areas with hay crops. There are a lot of cash deals going on.

 

[slowzuki]

Some good points. In your situation, there is no way I would get into haying the ground. I'd bushhog it for free before getting into haying it. A bunch of my "free" ground generates about nothing for me in income, just keeps the ground from growing up. I already spend a day a year picking rocks on it. For it to make money, I'd have to invest in fertilizer, and lime, both are expensive right now. The owner won't let me spray for the weeds that are on it, so its getting worse every year. The 15+ acres used to produce 1500+ bales, its now down to 300 or so.

 

[Builder]

Some good points. In your situation, there is no way I would get into haying the ground. I'd bushhog it for free before getting into haying it. A bunch of my "free" ground generates about nothing for me in income, just keeps the ground from growing up. I already spend a day a year picking rocks on it. For it to make money, I'd have to invest in fertilizer, and lime, both are expensive right now. The owner won't let me spray for the weeds that are on it, so its getting worse every year. The 15+ acres used to produce 1500+ bales, its now down to 300 or so.

I hear you on the spraying/fertilizing, but if the customer is tied to the the profits on the sale of the hay (he gets a small cut of what I sell) then it would be in his best interest to fertilize & spray to get a better (more profitable) crop, right? Higher yields of good quality hay make he or she more $$
These customers I have are WEALTHY people. They do get some joy out of being a "farmer", so my gut tells me they will hire me to spray/fertilize (have a friend with spray license) and I can fertilize.
I was looking at it as a way to make even more $, albeit "chump change" compared to my main sources of income-which are down these days....

Other intangibles are:
1. exposure to more business- it's no problem to stick a sign out by the road to get more drive by potential customers to call me.

2. I wont lose the more profitable other work they give me.

 

[DIRTROAD]

Builder, Think about it like this. If you were approached by a potential customer to build his house, but let's say that to do the job you would have to purchase a new compressor for your air nailers and a 16" backhoe bucket to dig the footings and a couple other odds and ends, you would do it right?

This hay business is no different. If you are planning on doing it the rest of your life, then make the investment. If this is just a occupation to fill any empty time while the construction industry is in the toilet, I would steer clear.

Your roots are in construction. There is absolutely nothing wrong with going in a different direction. It's simply a matter of whether your investment in equipment will ever payoff.

 

[wcampbell47]

I have been thinking of a venture into haying. Reasoning - there is a drought on in Texas and hay is hard to find. Thinking of a niche market like horse owners. Ruling out large round bales because when hay prices go up cattle owners will sell off the majority of their herd. Four thousand acre ranch across the highway just sold off 75% of the herd because of lack of grass and high hay prices.

Drawbacks - I would have to purchase cutter, rake and baler. I would also have to irrigate because of the drought. Since I am labor poor I would need a bale accumulator to attach to the baler and a grapple to pick the bales up with the FEL. I would have to develop a customer base.

I have had a conversation with a neighbor that is raising Jiggs Coastal Bermuda. Claims $3 a bale to produce and can sell for between $6 and $9 depending on how much hay is available at the time.

I would consider a lighter bale somewhere in the 40 to 50 pound area to market to horse people. That way the wife or kids could handle the feeding chores.

Just saying ... have not pulled the trigger yet on this idea.

Comments welcome!